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Squeaky

Godd rifle build idea?

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Hello:

I wanted to pass an idea for a rifle project by you guys to see if it sounds ok or not.

I have a Remington 700 ADL in .30-06 with a black nylon stock. I don't need it anymore ever since I inherited a beautiful Weatherby Mk.V Deluxe from an uncle in .30-06 too with a nice Burris scope. So ... I have an extra 700 long action. Hmmm ...

I was thinking it'd be fun to take my Remington apart by a gunsmith for a project. I'd take the thin factory barrel off (that gets hot) and put a Shilen heavy varmint or bull barrel onto the action. I'm referring to their #7 or #8 contours. Replace the trigger with a Timney trigger. Of course, I'd also get a better scope, base, and rings. At the least, something like an SWFA SS scope. Since it's an ADL, I'm fine with the factory bottom metal (correct term?). However, if there's a way to convert to a box magazine, I'm open to any suggestions as to how to do that. I'm not a Brownell's expert.

Anyway ... I'd put it all into an Boyd's Pro Varmint or Thumbhole stock and get it bedded. I don't think any pillaring would be needed. I think either one can accept a bull barrel with some widening of the stock's channel.

I'm not trying to make a competition rifle since it's a .30-06 - not a .308 or 6.5 Creedmore. I assume a bedding job and new trigger would be all I need to worry about. Not sure what kind of crown to get though. Perhaps an 11-degree crown is the simplest. I'll be going ahead and having a complete chambered barrel made.

I just wanted to check with you guys and see if I'm on the right track for making a souped-up .30-06 bolt rifle for the fun of it. Maybe I'll blueprint the action too just for the heck of it.

Thanks.

 

 

 

 

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It would very likely be more cost effecting to get something that is closer to what you want right out of the box and minimize the additional work. If you are not concerned with the cost, it would be cool to turn what you already have into something special. You would think I would be all about maximum work, but I only like work when there is nothing readily available that will compare or suffice. For example, a radically short mag fed SBS just has to be built since it cannot be bought.

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I do not see the value for the effort. For less $$$$$$ you could get something in .338 Lapua to start with.

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Back in the '60's or so my Dad did a similar build with a Springfield 1903A3. He had a heavy barrel put on, a nice Monte-Carlo-style stock, and added a good scope and mounts. He was hoping for a good rifle for whitetail deer, but he preferred stalking rather than sitting. This build came out a bit too heavy for hiking around with, so it became a bench-rest rifle for the range. I'm happy to report it's still pretty accurate today!  :)

It's your project. If you have the time and interest, I'd say go for it and make something just for you. 😎

Edited by Ronin38

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19 hours ago, Squeaky said:

Hello:

I wanted to pass an idea for a rifle project by you guys to see if it sounds ok or not.

I have a Remington 700 ADL in .30-06 with a black nylon stock. I don't need it anymore ever since I inherited a beautiful Weatherby Mk.V Deluxe from an uncle in .30-06 too with a nice Burris scope. So ... I have an extra 700 long action. Hmmm ...

I was thinking it'd be fun to take my Remington apart by a gunsmith for a project. I'd take the thin factory barrel off (that gets hot) and put a Shilen heavy varmint or bull barrel onto the action. I'm referring to their #7 or #8 contours. Replace the trigger with a Timney trigger. Of course, I'd also get a better scope, base, and rings. At the least, something like an SWFA SS scope. Since it's an ADL, I'm fine with the factory bottom metal (correct term?). However, if there's a way to convert to a box magazine, I'm open to any suggestions as to how to do that. I'm not a Brownell's expert.

Anyway ... I'd put it all into an Boyd's Pro Varmint or Thumbhole stock and get it bedded. I don't think any pillaring would be needed. I think either one can accept a bull barrel with some widening of the stock's channel.

I'm not trying to make a competition rifle since it's a .30-06 - not a .308 or 6.5 Creedmore. I assume a bedding job and new trigger would be all I need to worry about. Not sure what kind of crown to get though. Perhaps an 11-degree crown is the simplest. I'll be going ahead and having a complete chambered barrel made.

I just wanted to check with you guys and see if I'm on the right track for making a souped-up .30-06 bolt rifle for the fun of it. Maybe I'll blueprint the action too just for the heck of it.

Thanks.

if it is not going to be a competition rifle what is the point?

Just buy a used rifle that has what you want or sell or trade up to what you want. There is  a lot of joy working on guns but in the end you should expect a better  shooting gun for the money

19 hours ago, Squeaky said:

 

 

 

 

 

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In response to Jerry 52, I'm sure such changes will, by their very nature, produce a more accurate rifle than a stock 700 ADL. Better stock, heavier barrel to minimize (or eliminate) barrel whip, and Timney triggers are great.

My Rem 700 ADL is the first rifle I ever bought and I didn't know much about guns & scopes then. I just knew Remington was a good brand, the .30-06 is a classic cartridge, and it can be hand-loaded for just about anything using up to at least 220 gr. bullets. Without knowing any better, I got that thin barrel really hot a few times simply due to being excited and having fun target shooting at the range. It might be prematurely worn-out.

I'm simply under the general impression that the .30-06 cartridge is not as accurate as the .308 or 6.5 Creedmore for competition. Seems like every competitor I've seen shoots either .308 or 6mm PPC (?). I figure it's good to have .30-06 as a "back-up" for my .308 rifle.

I simply have a Remington 700 long-action I want to do something with. The rifle is currently chambered for .30-06 and I figured I'd stick with that - especially since I've hand-loaded a lot of .30-06 rounds using primers and shells I also got from my uncle.

If this project gun shoots groups as small as a dime at 100 yards - fine. I just don't assume to be a good enough shooter to run with the benchrest guys who get groups like .180" or .190" at 200 yards.

 

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To me, this seems like the type of project that is satisfying only if I had the ability and did the work myself. Squeaky, you stated you'd be having a gunsmith do the work, so essentially you'd be buying a rifle that costs more than if you searched for something similar to what you want built. Your money, so spend happy.

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5 hours ago, RShort said:

To me, this seems like the type of project that is satisfying only if I had the ability and did the work myself. Squeaky, you stated you'd be having a gunsmith do the work, so essentially you'd be buying a rifle that costs more than if you searched for something similar to what you want built. Your money, so spend happy.

If it is a old gun why not try doing it yourself.

Taking a barrel off is nothing . I think that most guys that work on their guns have had to risk hurting the gun in order to advance in knowledge and skill.

If it is just a barrel get a good one and go for it. and when you shoot it you will have something.

The money spent for tools will be the difference in the cost of hiring a gun smith.

And it is almost as fun as reloading.

Reloading is what will give you your dime shooter. I also think you can do the mag upgrade with the 700 adl

 

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Put on a threaded 18 inch bull barrel twisted for heavy bullets.  Run a very nice can.  Put a nicer thermal scope on it.  Do not forget the BAR box mag option.  Make a super pig shooter.  Just me.

www.eliteiron.com

All Oregon State Laws, US Code Laws, NFA Laws and BATFE rules, regulations and whims apply.

Can site will not link.  Dunno why.

Edited by HB of CJ
site not linking

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On 7/9/2018 at 4:48 AM, G O B said:

I do not see the value for the effort. For less $$$$$$ you could get something in .338 Lapua to start with.

Nobody said anything about a .338 Lapua build until you brought it up.

You don't build a rifle (or usually anything else) to save money.  You build a rifle to get the rifle you want.  If an accurized ought six is what floats his boat, then so be it.  I would take the same action and have a .35 Whelen built on it, because that's MY idea of a great custom rifle.  The fact that I could BUY a factory built Remmy in Whelen is largely irrelevant...  Besides getting exactly the barrel quality and contour desired, the twist can be specified, so the resulting rifle will be optimized for the actual intended bullet weight, not whatever compromise twist rate the factory would have chosen.  Muzzle threading can also be specified, whereas often a factory barrel won't have sufficient meat for threads.  And even though Remington barrels and assembly have generally resulted in accurate rifles over the years, no production rifle built to a price point is ever going to be able to equal one that is the result of a good gunsmith's personal attention, using a barrel from Hart, Shilen, etc.

Also lately Remington has not always been doing so good as they used to quality wise.  Having a custom rifle built on an older action may actually be less of a crapshoot than buying a new factory Remington in the desired caliber.

Edit to add:  Be careful who you take it to.

Edited by netpackrat

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Netpackrat expresses my sentiments better. I understand the cost/economic arguments some posters have submitted, but my idea is meant to be a fun educational exercise. Also, they seem to assume such a gun already exists on the market. As far as I know, no mainstream manufacturer makes bull barreled .30 caliber rifles (why not?). What they call a "heavy barrel" is not nearly as thick as what I've seen on custom rifles at the gun range. A Varmint barrel is thicker than a "heavy barrel"  on many factory stock rifles. I dream about building a rifle from scratch, but I figure it's smarter to begin with aftermarket components and put them together. I wouldn't do it all at once due to the total cost. One part at a time.

I mention using the services of a gunsmith simply because I do not have the skills or tools of a gunsmith to do things like change a barrel, replace a trigger, or glass bed a gunstock, blueprint an action, etc. I just know about them and their importance. I simply have an extra Rem 700 long action I want to do something with in order to learn more about this fascinating craft, and get rid of the skinny barrel (a sporter barrel?) my rifle currently has. I might do the same for a .308 rifle build one day. All in all ... I'm intrigued by how one can build a bolt rifle from components. If only Howa offered barreled actions with bull barrels. If only MacMillan gunstocks weren't so expensive. If only the stork would leave a NightForce scope at my door. :-)

I think I need to attend that gunsmithing school I've heard about in Colorado. I had an idea for a .50 caliber bolt rifle when I was in middle school. Well ... some guy in Tennessee named Barrett beat me to it. Darn.

I have a  20 gauge side-by-side double barrel shotgun my grandfather made himself - including a walnut stock he carved. I wish I knew how to do that. Unfortunately, they don't teach "Gunsmithing 101" in college. It seems silly to have gotten an engineering degree, but not know the first thing about building a rifle - let alone a match grade barrel.

Like Clint Eastwood said in one of his movies: "A man has to know his limits."  I have a fun idea. I'll defer to others' expertise to help make it become a reality.

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Any time you can go to school and  do what you love better is a good Idea.

If you go to the school it will open up a ton of roads you never thought possible.

As for the barrel in your gun being shot out that may not be so.

when I shoot a rifle with a thinner barrel I keep track of it temp. Some guns shoot better cold and some shoot better warm.

Also 30.06 is not a bad round  .

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If you can find a school, and use that spare action to build what you want, THAT would be a better use of time and money! And when you get down to it, it will most likely be about the same amount of money - but nothing beats doing it yourself!

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I never went to school for gunsmithing. I think some people just don't need it and, on the other hand, I have known people who went to gunsmithing school and still didn't have enough natural mechanical ability to get by as a semi-decent gunsmith. One even went to Colorado School of Trades, IIRC. There is something that can't be measured or taught that is required to be more than one dimensional when it comes to this stuff. I studied machining 20+ years ago and just completed CNC programming and fabrication school. I get by with that, research when I don't already know something, ignoring what most others do (my greatest asset, lol), and some natural ability. A solid machining program at a community college would likely get you where you want to go if you have an above average understanding of firearm function and are a good researcher. If you already have machining experience and have a good understanding of that, start researching bolt rifle building and tool up. Searching 'Build your own bolt action rifle' yields some good hits. You never know, you might unearth something noteworthy that others would pay you for. Post pics ;)

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This can be true for some but going to a good school can give novice  a better perspective and teach them that the only thing that ruins a gun is a Dremel.

I have fixed guns since I was 12 years old but understanding how each gun works and what you can do with them has always involved study and the right  tools and how to use them. I still remember threading my first barrel I was a wreck but after it was over, then you think to yourself " that was it ?" that was years ago.

Only Botched 2 jobs in my life a AR trigger because I was in a hurry and a cold blue job (never again) on a shot gun because I wanted to try it.

I do it as a hobby but have though about opening a shop but my Other job I just retired from took all my time and life.

I do It for friends  and have made a lot of Kel Tec pistols work perfect  not to mention High points, cheap 1911s, cheap micro 1911s, botched ak builds . Just finished a Beretta 84 that a woman dropped off that she bought years ago and never fired it. 

Have a old Rem 721 30.06 that has been neglected next and then 2 shot guns and a 22 target pistol.

The only way to do something that you have not done before is to start

 

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Dremels don't ruin guns, people ruin guns.  It is no different from any other tool; it can be used for good, or it can be used for evil.

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I think you know what I mean. They break them we fix them.

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On ‎7‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 11:01 AM, jerry52 said:

This can be true for some but going to a good school can give novice  a better perspective and teach them that the only thing that ruins a gun is a Dremel.

I have fixed guns since I was 12 years old but understanding how each gun works and what you can do with them has always involved study and the right  tools and how to use them. I still remember threading my first barrel I was a wreck but after it was over, then you think to yourself " that was it ?" that was years ago.

Only Botched 2 jobs in my life a AR trigger because I was in a hurry and a cold blue job (never again) on a shot gun because I wanted to try it.

I do it as a hobby but have though about opening a shop but my Other job I just retired from took all my time and life.

I do It for friends  and have made a lot of Kel Tec pistols work perfect  not to mention High points, cheap 1911s, cheap micro 1911s, botched ak builds . Just finished a Beretta 84 that a woman dropped off that she bought years ago and never fired it. 

Have a old Rem 721 30.06 that has been neglected next and then 2 shot guns and a 22 target pistol.

The only way to do something that you have not done before is to start

 

You probably have that immeasurable thing.

I couldn't live with not giving it a go no matter how financially difficult it was at the time. To say it was tough doesn't even come close. Ability was not an issue, but tooling up without going into debt while in a commercial location was a very long road. The county will not allow 07FFL at home, so I had no choice. It has taken far more effort and sacrifice than I ever imagined, but I am still here, debt free, and finally tooled up well. I can tell you for sure that you saved yourself a lot of headache and tough decisions.

On ‎7‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 5:09 PM, netpackrat said:

Dremels don't ruin guns, people ruin guns.  It is no different from any other tool; it can be used for good, or it can be used for evil.

Or evl can use them for good ;)  (Sorry, I couldn't resist). It can be a very useful tool for little things and tight areas or things that don't condone waiting for a compressor to be ready or fixturing in a mill to remove just a little bit of material.

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My best advice is that you have no idea what you can or cannot do - until you have tried! (My Dad taught me that one.)

DO NOT think you'r first, second , or third attempt will be a masterpiece. It takes 10 years to fully learn any trade.

Get some tools, get some CHEAP projects,learn what you are capable of doing! Learn what you are NOT capable of.

HAVE FUN

 

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I can say that a lot of my projects have more time in them than the cash value of the items would warrant. 
At the time it was more of a matter of limited cash, but of course now I tend to like those guns more than ones with more intrisic value.

"I did it myself" is hard to quantify, but it has real value. It also does a lot for stripping down various emperor expert trades. I'm not denigrating gunsmiths (or lawyers, etc...) but there sure are a lot of them who talk as though assembling an AR upper, or mounting a scope should only be performed by someone who has been doing it for a job for 35 years.

Expertise has its value. So does working off the clock. The best expert has to be sparing with his time, and charge a lot for it. A careful amateur is going to check thrice, go slow, and go the extra mile, because it is his own.

I doubt Tony or Evl would have refined their guns that they made into their jobs to the level that they have, if they were having to log the work hours on the first few. That kind of passion tends to be a hobbyist first, and maybe a job second.

If your goal is to have a precision rifle and shoot it, buy one.

If your goal is to build a rifle, because you want to build rifles, " because I wanna" is a solid justification.

 

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For me, I know that a custom precision rifle will make absolutely no sense. There are few places around here to really stretch anything out. A decent 400 yard and less build might make sense if I had the time and money to build it and fire it.

 

Regarding this build, I would ask myself a few questions, with total honesty and grounded in reality.

1- Am I the shooter that can extract at least a majority of the potential out of the rifle and do I have the eyes for it?

2- Am I going to shoot it enough to condone throwing that much time and/or money at it?

3- Do I have time to build it?

4- Do I have money to tool up and build it (assuming I had little to none of the tooling)?

5- Am I mechanically inclined and patient enough to build it?

6- Should I just have it built and do I have the money for that?

7- Is there anything that comes in a box RTR that will suffice and can I afford it.

8- Can I afford the glass that it takes to really get out there?

9- Do I have access to an area that is 400+ yards? I don't consider anything less than that to be worth building or buying what most would call a precision rifle. 

 

These would be my answers if I asked myself the questions at this moment and are the exact reasons that I do not even own anything remotely resembling a precision rifle.

1- No, I don't have the experience in precision shooting nor the eyes for it (double vision in both eyes, darker colors on white is when I notice it the most and it is very distracting, targets, lol, some days are better than others)

2- No.

3- No.

4- No.

5- Yes.

6- No.

7- No.

8- No.

9- No.

 

For fun, I would be interested in seeing how others would answer these same questions if you had to answer them right now.

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# 1 The eye thing. That "astigmatism".  I have it and it sucks. Red dot sights look oval and sometimes double dotted. Scopes are no problem. Front iron sights are ok in bright sunlight. If shady, they can be an issue. 

 

Squeaky indicated in one of his posts that he doesn't have the skill or equipment to do the job.

On 7/14/2018 at 6:07 PM, Squeaky said:

I mention using the services of a gunsmith simply because I do not have the skills or tools of a gunsmith to do things like change a barrel, replace a trigger, or glass bed a gunstock, blueprint an action, etc.

One thing I'll mention on his behalf is that pillaring is usually a prerequisite for glass bedding. 

 

I'll admit that I have never hired a gunsmith. I've always done my own work. I was fortunate that as a child I was able to sit at the bench of an old-time gunsmith and was fascinated to the point that his work overpowered my hyperactivity. I was like a sponge and learned so much about guns before the age of 8 that I've retained. Gunsmiths are a funny bunch. As GunFun said, they seem to impress that they are the only ones with enough knowledge and ability to turn a barrel into an action, remove a burr, and change sights. Licencing, expertise and equipment are surely a benefit to making a business, but don't disqualify anyone else. Only their own ability does that.

Edited by YOT
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I know a lot of DIY guys that blow away the average gunsmith. They usually have better paying jobs than gunsmithing, lol. There are a lot of guys out there calling themselves a gunsmith yet they do not machine, they do not file, they do not weld, and generally have no fabrication skills. Part installing and part swapping is usually their entire range of skills.

 

Good catch, I missed that part about the lack of tools and skills. 

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I am sort of a beginner gunsmith. I converted my Saiga, I've bedded a rifle, I've done some trigger work, milled an 80% receiver and assembled two AR15s from stripped receivers. I'm mechanically inclined and have a good dose of common sense so I can usually figure stuff out. It would be neat to take an actual gunsmithing class and get some bigger and cooler tools to play with.

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On 7/21/2018 at 5:50 PM, evlblkwpnz said:

I know a lot of DIY guys that blow away the average gunsmith. They usually have better paying jobs than gunsmithing, lol. There are a lot of guys out there calling themselves a gunsmith yet they do not machine, they do not file, they do not weld, and generally have no fabrication skills. Part installing and part swapping is usually their entire range of skills.

Part of the reason those guys can blow away the average gunsmith, is the average gunsmith is trying to make a living at it, and can't afford to play perfection games.  But I'm sure you know that!

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