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16" vs 22" barrel?


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#31 Havoc308

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Posted 09 July 2008 - 09:34 PM

Midway sells the A+B rifled blanks. I don't know of anyone that has off the shelf barrels for a Saiga 308. Some gunsmithery might be required......
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#32 Dancing Bear

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Posted 04 November 2008 - 07:14 PM

For some reason, I always have trouble reading Havoc's posts..........................
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#33 Unknown Poster

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Posted 22 November 2008 - 05:12 PM

I purchased the 16" barreled 308 saiga first and went after the 21.5" barreled 308 saiga next when i see it in the rack. I figured the longer barrel would be for longer distance shots. I haven't shot the 21.5" barrel yet we been to busy hammering the saiga in 308 with the 16" barrel. My 21.5" barreled saiga has the same black stock as my 16"/308 does too. I got these on the first importation.

#34 superhawk138

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Posted 28 November 2008 - 01:07 PM

For some reason, I always have trouble reading Havoc's posts..........................

I just thought he never types anything. :big_smile:

#35 Hangfire13

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 10:42 PM

I figure a .308 needs a little more barrel but I'd love to have a smaller cal. with the sweet 16, maybe a .223
I'm only shooting black guns until they come up with something darker...

#36 Hangfire13

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 10:44 PM

For some reason, I always have trouble reading Havoc's posts..........................


Who is Havoc? :rolleyes:
I'm only shooting black guns until they come up with something darker...

#37 Bouncer042

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Posted 12 December 2008 - 11:58 AM

I bought the 16" bbl for the portability of it, but if I wanted to make long range shots I've got access to a 7 mag.
Practice makes permanence...only PERFECT practice makes perfect.


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#38 Unknown Poster

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Posted 14 December 2008 - 11:52 AM

I read on another forum that some are shooting 400+ yards with there 16" barreled saiga's which makes me wonder at what yardage will the 16" barrel actually go and still shoot good groups. So where does the 16" barrel drop off and were does the 22" barrel go out too? How far can both barrels shoot in 308? I only have a 100yd range here.

The 16" barreled 308 saiga is awesome, its short and accurate. I do have a 22" barreled 308 too but i haven't shot it yet. I been too busy with the 16" barreled 308's.

For long shots i have a 338win.mag with its 4,000ft.lbs @ muzzle and 2,700ft.lbs @ 200 yds thats the muzzle energy of a 30-06 @ 200yds. with a 250gr bullet. I can put two bullets thru the same hole at 100yds.

Edited by Unknown Poster, 14 December 2008 - 11:54 AM.


#39 cscharlie

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Posted 23 December 2008 - 07:33 PM

For some reason, I always have trouble reading Havoc's posts..........................


Edited due to getting in trouble for the mouth watering comment. :oops: That is quite the talent that gal is demonstrating in Havoc's avitar.

Edited by cscharlie, 25 December 2008 - 05:38 AM.

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Matt 24:5 For many will come in my name, claiming, "I am the Christ", and will deceive many. 24:6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 24:7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 24:8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.
 

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#40 desert dog

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Posted 24 December 2008 - 12:33 PM

16” is great for a close / medium range fighting rifle, and if that’s what you want, definitely go with the 16”. You should get great accuracy inside of 300 yards, but this is an EXTREMELY short length for distance shooting.

The 16” Saiga is way too short for a .308 rifle used for long-distance accuracy. In hunting / sniper / bench shooting, 22” is considered a short rifle, so by .308 shooting standards, the 21” Saiga is a short barreled gun. Palma shooters that shoot 1,000 yards with the .308 use 30” rifles. Longer barrels give the powder more time to work on propelling the bullet and generally provide higher velocities.

TacOps and the Los Angeles County Sheriffs Department took a standard 26” 308 barrel sniper rifle and cut the barrel down in 1” increments, all the way down to 18”, and tested the rifle at each increment. They found that a 20” barrel provides a complete propellant burn and no velocity loss when using Federal 168-gr BTHP rounds. Velocity loss began to occur under 20” of barrel length. QuickLoad data seems to confirm this. Now, the best selling tactical marksman rifle is a Reminton 700 LTR in .308 with a 20” fluted barrel.

I have lots of AKs and ARs in intermediate calibers with 16” barrels for fighting rifles. I got the 21” Saiga .308 to convert into a “Saiganov”. I am quite please with it, as it easily hits the 500yd gong on my range. I have more accurate, longer shooting bolt guns but wanted a semi-auto magazine fed rifle that can hit at longer distances. But admittedly, my PSL comes out of the safe more.

#41 t165

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Posted 15 January 2009 - 04:42 AM

Talent...perhaps! She looks 12 years old. I used to drag guys off to jail for that.
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#42 cscharlie

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Posted 19 January 2009 - 03:42 PM

solution:

Posted Image

one of each!


I like bender's idea. :super: That wooden furniture is really nice! Nice rifles!

Note to self: WWJD/post? What good is salt if it looses it's saltiness?

Matt 24:5 For many will come in my name, claiming, "I am the Christ", and will deceive many. 24:6 You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 24:7 Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 24:8 All these are the beginning of birth pains.
 

 To say that my God isn't real is like me saying your Dad isn't real since I've never met Him . 


#43 Paladin_Hammer

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Posted 02 March 2009 - 02:12 PM

One of these days I will get a pic of one of my buds 308 sagia. It has a 26" Adams & Bennett barrel on it. I have seen him shoot 3/4" groups at 100 yds with Nato surplus ammo. I am not talking about how how everyone measures their groups by shooting 20 rounds and you find one group of the 20 that measures 3/4". This is a real 10 shot group, all 10 shots.

He made it to look just like a RPK. He took all of the diamensions from an actual RPK barrel, Then turned the barrel to match it. Carved all of the wood out of Burled Walnut.

We have to start on some handloads. I know we will be able to get it to at least 3/8-1/2" groups.

All it takes to make one of these things shoot is to get a good barrel on it. I plan on doing one like this soon. Just have to get some more $


What? Adams and Bennett make a .308 barrel for a saiga? What?

#44 tcox4freedom

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Posted 04 March 2009 - 02:07 PM

I just prefer the longer barrel on a rifle.
Posted Image Posted Image

#45 unclejake

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 09:12 AM

I am in the middle of converting my x39 now, but will tackle the 308 after that. Mine is the 22" barrel....was all that was availible, and I would prefer a shorter one. I have bolt guns for long range shooting so barrel length isn't an issue for me. Has anyone used the crowning kit from Midway? What is the average cost of getting a barrel cut down and recrowned vs the cost of doing it yourself and buying the tools to do it?
Thanks

Edited by unclejake, 13 March 2009 - 09:12 AM.

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#46 jase

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 02:05 PM

Meh...don't worry about flash, use sunglasses :P If you're really brave take the muzzle brake/flash suppressor off and then shoot it at night from a 14.5" barrel :P

Don't blame me, I voted for Kalashnikitty!


#47 bobotech

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Posted 13 March 2009 - 10:08 PM

I am in the middle of converting my x39 now, but will tackle the 308 after that. Mine is the 22" barrel....was all that was availible, and I would prefer a shorter one. I have bolt guns for long range shooting so barrel length isn't an issue for me. Has anyone used the crowning kit from Midway? What is the average cost of getting a barrel cut down and recrowned vs the cost of doing it yourself and buying the tools to do it?
Thanks

Wanna trade?

I'm serious.

I have a converted 308 19 inch barrel Saiga that I would like to trade for a longer barrel.

#48 Shepherd Thiel

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Posted 31 March 2009 - 04:31 AM

IMO: Anything less than 18" on a 308/7.62x51 is more of a plinker/for fun gun. (Though it has more punch than 5.56, or 7.62x39 out of similar length barrels.)

If you want a working rifle with a sub 18" barrel you should look at a different cartridge.

A 308 necked up to 338 might make a good CQB round in a sub 18" barrel.

To me 308/7.62x51 is a MBR round.

1 Corinthians 2:2


#49 shortround

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Posted 19 April 2009 - 09:00 AM

IMO: Anything less than 18" on a 308/7.62x51 is more of a plinker/for fun gun.


You need to spend some quality time with a chronograph. It doesn't work out that way in real life.

#50 gothchick

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 01:56 PM

Ah yes, but will quality time with a chronograph give him a friendly reach around?
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#51 JulianH

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Posted 28 April 2009 - 01:38 PM

So on the barrel stiffness issue, would cutting a 22" down to 20", 18" or even 16.25" improve the stiffness? Would the stock 16" be stiffer or more precise than a 22" cut down to 16"(assuming the crown us cut well), or would it be about the same?

#52 dmckean44

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Posted 28 April 2009 - 10:07 PM

So on the barrel stiffness issue, would cutting a 22" down to 20", 18" or even 16.25" improve the stiffness? Would the stock 16" be stiffer or more precise than a 22" cut down to 16"(assuming the crown us cut well), or would it be about the same?


A 22" cut down the 16" would be the same. The advantage of 18" or 20" is that it would allow all the powder in the 7.62x51 or .308 round to burn.

#53 tritium

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Posted 28 April 2009 - 10:31 PM

I asked this question to a very seasoned gunsmith who amongst other things builds custom sniper rifles and he favors the 22 inch barrel.
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#54 desert dog

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Posted 26 May 2009 - 10:21 AM

SVD Dragunov = 24.5" barrel
PSL = 26.5" Barrel
M24 US sniper rifle = 24" barrel

It would seem that most sniper / field marksman systems have a preference for the longer barrels.

#55 csspecs

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Posted 06 July 2009 - 09:22 AM

Ok I know this one is old as dirt..

But my reason for going with a 21 inch barrel over the 16 had to do with me using this as a hunting rifle from time to time. I don't wear ear plugs while hunting, and a 16 inch barrel on a .308 is about deafening on the first shot. I have fired my 22 inch s-308 with out ear plugs a couple times, while not pleasant I did not suddenly lose my hearing and have it replaced with a loud ringing/whistling sound (Mossin nagant M-38 did that)
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#56 Cryptkeeper

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Posted 10 July 2009 - 10:42 PM

if you convert the 16" and put a light weight stock on it. you will increase the recoil by quite a bit by makeing the weapon lighter. one thing the 22' does have is that long heavier barrel so it weighs a bit more and would reduce the recoil a bit and its bullet velocity will be higher because of the longer barrel.

if you do choose to go with the 16" and convert it and put on a light weight stock you might look into adding weight to it to calm the recoil down .

if your going hunting with it i would let your terrain decide what you need if you are in open terrain or can move easily in the forrest area your in then the 22" would be fine, but if you live where there is really dense forrest i would get the 16" to make it easier to move around ,and to quick draw and aim.


if you want a stiffer barrel you need a thicker barrel. that why BULL barrels are thick. they are MUCH stiffer

Edited by Cryptkeeper, 10 July 2009 - 10:52 PM.


#57 Tacticool

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Posted 11 July 2009 - 12:42 AM

OK, I'm going to chime in here. I'm getting my barrel cut back to 18.5 inches because it's a happy medium for me. It's more like a scout length (like and M1A). NOt so much that I lose velocity and short enough to help with the handling.

#58 cbr

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Posted 12 July 2009 - 08:45 AM

has anyone here weighed the cut portion of barrel (22 cut to 16). I am leaning towards cutting mine but want to know if all the work will be worth it.

#59 GunnyR

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Posted 15 July 2009 - 03:58 PM

I did not suddenly lose my hearing and have it replaced with a loud ringing/whistling sound (Mossin nagant M-38 did that)


Dude you do know that ringing/whistling sound is permanent damage to your hearing? I used to be able to hear a mosquito fart in a windstorm but after 16 years in arty and a tour of combat in Iraq....well, it's all been permanently degraded. Also all those Black Sabbath tours in the 80's didn't help, especially one concert where I was right next to the speakers. Oh well.

Wear hearing protection man!
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#60 Gopher

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Posted 15 July 2009 - 05:11 PM

ok, so after reading this thread twice over, its looking to me that the best way to go is 22" but then have it cut to 20" or 18". im use to hiking around with a PSG-1 while playing airsoft in some pretty heavy brush, so lenght doesnt bother me. so my question is: if i get a 22" would i be gainning or loosing anything by cutting it down to 20" or 19". and also would getting a thicker barrel help greatly? i plan to hunt pig and deer/elk.

and about the hearing protection... does anyone make good hearing protecting for hunting?

Edited by Gopher, 15 July 2009 - 05:12 PM.

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