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For those of you without S-12s (those lucky bastards), what do you consider your primary, fail-safe HD weapon?

 

Is it a large caliber handgun, pump shotgun or spiked baseball bat?

 

 

Myself, I'm particularly fond of the 12ga Mossberg 500. Reliable, tough, affordable, powerful. Nothing better than 00 buck in CQC. It's also 'tacti-cool' black. :ph34r:

 

Originally I was looking into AOW shorty shotguns, 12-14 inch barrels. But most places charge too much for those for my budget.

 

 

 

Kindof OT (even though I started the topic):

 

What are your opinions on putting a PG-only on a 12ga shotty? In my situation, space is a big concern, I'll save every inch from OAL that I can.

 

Just wondering what kind of severe pain I should be expecting in my wrist...

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1st - the dog.

 

2nd - 870 Express (the noise itself messes with peoples heads.)

1 rubber buck (feeds first) then 2-00 or 000 shot. lastly Bren slug.

 

3rd - Christian track handouts! Freaks the hell out of some people. sends 'em runnin'!

Also could come in handy if you were a would be attacker bleedin' out from some 00 in your gut!

Edited by Juggernaut
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Welcome to the wondrous world of CQC/Home Defense!

 

12 ga is a definite stopper/splatterer. 20 ga is more controllable in a high-tension situation involving a home invasion. Even .410 ga is a positive stopper at true home defense ranges as these involve distances of only 10-20 ft! At that range the .410 -- even loaded with #6 shot -- will blow a 1" hole in the rib cage of a 60 lb dog -- saw that happen about 47 years ago when my dadheard a ruckus in the barn and found such a dog going after our one and only cow. He'd thought that a .410 with #6 shot would just put a hurt on the dog and discourage it. Yes, it discourageit but rather permanently.

 

Using #4 shot or, better yet, 000 buckshot is even more of a stopper. You can ask Cobra about that. Myself? I use 3" slug loads (Brenneke) in my Saiga .410.

 

The .410 is also much easier for the diminutive lady of the house to use if it becomes necessary.

 

I shortened the shoulder stock by 1 3/4", repaced the rear sight, got rid of the front bead sight (replaced it with a modified AK-74 FSB) and put a muzzle brake on it. Also had cooling vents cut into the handguards.

 

As has been said by someone else already, the only thing I don't care much for is the 4-shot mag but I like even less the thought of somehow having to cough up the migh dollar amounts needed to get even one, much less two, high-cap mags. Even 4-shot mags seem to go for about $35-$40 each, so I am kinda restricted to one mag. However, if four shots don't stop an intruder, then I needed help in the first place.

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......in my pre-S-12 days, it was PG'd 870 w/ 00 Buck in the front room........., Mossberg Riot pump in the bedroom............., and Kimber Ten II's in between...........,

 

(among other selections.........)

 

 

 

( LOL, Cobra.......!!)

Edited by Jeaux E
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Even with S-12s, I still keep out my 870 with 3in 00' shells. Its got a pressure pad light, PG, and extension tube. I also keep out one 45 for carry. The rest is in the safe. I figure there's no need to risk anything more to theft, rust, mischef, etc.

 

Oh, and for those sporting 00 Buck, don't forget the BoxOTruth's test showing it goes through interior walls. (They also have a review of the S-308 on their page)

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XD-45 with Insight X2L light/laser on nightstand loaded with Corbon DPX, Mossberg 500 with LED light 2 steps from bed-loaded with 8 rounds 00 buck, HP .45 in Sportsman's Guide wall clock also loaded with DPX, and Saiga 12 loaded with 6 rounds 00 buck, very near. :smoke:

 

I'll soon have the 2 10 rounders that I just bought from AegisDei for the S12. :devil:

 

If an intruder should make it past this, I might have to stick him with the shark brake and crack open the safe.:lolol:

Edited by badman400
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What are your opinions on putting a PG-only on a 12ga shotty? In my situation, space is a big concern, I'll save every inch from OAL that I can.

 

Just wondering what kind of severe pain I should be expecting in my wrist...

 

I've shot a few of these w/18 inch barrels, and they're not too bad with BIRDSHOT. The main thing is that you are hip-firing it, and you have to put your wrist at an extreme angle to do it. Couple that with the shotgun pushing that angle even further, and you've got yourself some pain, after repeat shots. If I were gonna do it, I'd saw off the butt portion of a "sporter" type stock and leave the "grip" portion (See Terminator 2). This makes your hand rest at your side more naturally, so you can hip fire without it putting you in a wristlock.

 

One other point, if space is a factor, I assume you're not taking long shots. At short range, birdshot should suffice for HD, and you don't have to worry about killing your neighbor. Slugs and 00 buck would just tempt me to take a shot at someone running away, down the street (Lawsuit).

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What are your opinions on putting a PG-only on a 12ga shotty? In my situation, space is a big concern, I'll save every inch from OAL that I can.

Just wondering what kind of severe pain I should be expecting in my wrist...

I've shot my old S12 one handed with magnum loads and was fine. You won't get the fastest follow-up shot, but the gas system is so good that with magnum loads you can limp wrist to absorb the recoil. If you're shooting with two, it's cake and allows for very fast magazine changes because you don't have to unshoulder/reshoulder your gun.

 

I keep a Mossy 500 on hand all the time, and usually I let my Sig P226 out whenever I'm home. You're definitely right about space concerns, the Mossy has a 20" barrel and full-size stock, so it's super long. That's why I keep the Sig out...I'm not sure how long it would take me to stand up then lift, swing, and shoulder the shotgun The pistol I know I can grab and point as quick as it takes me to sit up and it's easier to find with night sights. But I'm always worried about someone breaking in while I'm away, and I don't always remember to put up my toys, so I don't want to risk losing anything worth more than a few hundred bucks (Mossy=$225). So if the Mossy disappears, I'll be pissed but I'm not out as much if I lost any of my others.

 

I'd recommend a cheapy (but reliable) shotgun for if you have time to get to it, and a cheapy (but reliable) pistol for if you don't. Pawnshops often have hunting Rem870s and Moss500s for <$150. They're not high cap and the barrel would need to be hacked down, but it's a good way to spray. Combine that with a Hi-point and you'd have a strong combination IMO. If stolen, you're only out about $300, way less than a single S12, but you have enough firepower to defend against near any home invasion.

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Before using 00 buck or slugs, consider your line of fire. I have a brick house, kids grown, no houses in lines of fire.

Unless you have a simular situation, use #4 through #1 buck. only and NO slugs.

Gun controll isn't just hitting what you aim for, you need to be SHURE- NOT to hit any thing you didn't make a decision TO HIT!

 

With gun ownership goes RESPONSIBILITY.

 

Use the propper tool for the job.

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I keep a 3 inch barreled M64 S&W 38 Spl loaded with safety slugs as a primary house gun. Theres a Mossberg 500 locked up in the closet as a backup, loaded with low recoil OO buck. I like the low recoil ammo as it allows a faster followup shot. Concerning the small birdshot loads, consider this: You wife/girlfriend/mother calls you and says a guy is breaking in the door. "What ammo should I put in the shotgun?" Are you going to say a birdshot load? I dont think so. Its time to reach for OO buck, a proven stopper. I use the 38 as a main gun as it belongs to my wife and she can handle it. Also if someone comes to the door you cant always have a shotgun in your hand. The 38 is easily concealed. For the shotgun with a pistol grip only the low recoil loads work ok. The regular loads sting too much for me. Just my .02.

Edited by ironhead7544
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....."if someone comes to the door you can't always have a shotgun in your hand."

 

Around my house, you can. Although, really, to tell the truth.......it's not always in my hand.......but my hand is always on it

 

One at the front door, and one at the back............

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Kimber Tactical Custom in the nightstand. I have to make like 3 turns to get to my living room, I'd be better off with the night sights and short barrel. I've also got the S-12 under the bed, but with a 22" barrel and two bad guys in the living room, who knows what I'd grab. Probably both.

 

I also keep a shotgun news and a K-bar by the toilet. If someone breaks in while I'm takin a shit, I'm gonna "terminate with extreme prejudice"

 

:chris:

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LOL!

I thought it was just me with the S-12 by the shitter! That's in the master BR all the way around behind the King waterbed (bulletproof if I have to roll out of it real quick and grab said tactical S-12 from the bathroom doorway). Come out of there and there's a nice clean 25' shot down the hallway with the brick fireplace wall between me and my neighbor (and it's 8' underground on that side of the house). Hopefully whoever I'm shooting at hasn't already found the other shotgun by the door (front or back). If so They'll be blinded by the tac light first and then a muzzle blast soon after.

 

Oh I forgot to mention the G-17 with 18 rds of hollow points between my pillow and the bed frame.

 

Moral of the story...don't dare follow a snake into his den or try and sneak up on him while he sleeps, especially a cobra!

Edited by Cobra 76 two
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Good thread.

 

Nightstand, my side- XD-.45 ACP 4", Wife's side-XD-9mm, both with Insight laser/light combo's.

Bedroom corner- 870 Express w/ 18" barrel, Surefire front griplight, Knoxx CopStock.

Bedroom closet- Wife's old Taurus .38 Ti w/ Lasergrips

My living room- Glock 36 w/ night sights and that laser in the recoil spring (forget the name...), and S-12 with......

Her living room-Beretta Storm .45 ACP w/ 2x Aimpoint and Surefire light.

Not far away or pocket-holstered- KelTec .380 w/ frangibles (me and mah bitch...).

Garage-Taurus Millenium Pro .45 ACP

 

Soon to be delivered/added- Red Jacket AK-47 Tac shorty pistol w/ light, green laser, Eotech.

 

I consider my best defense my 3 German Wirehaired Pointers, you don't even walk on "their" sidewalk without being completely aware that they are guarding "their" house! I once had an ADT alarm salesman back away from my front door one evening as I answered it, he admitted that I probably didn't really need his product....

 

That, plus custom-made solid Oak doors and frames, lag-bolted to reinforced studs, try and kick that, sucker!

 

BTW, anybody catch Sir Ted Nugent at TX Governor's re-election inauguaration party last night? He pretty much dis'ed Prick Perry for his 180 deg. turnabout on illegal immigration...Ted's the epitome of "man w/ 'nad's!!

 

Guido2 in Houston (full compliment of Zombies to choose from here...)

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Alarm system, S&W .38 Airweight, Flashlight, Telephone. All the heavy stuff is locked up. An AK or .308 overpenetrates WAY too much to use in a house.

 

I don't understand you guys leaving guns all over the house. Burglers usually try to break in when your Not there. Cash, guns, and drugs is what they're looking for. When the steal your gun you not only lost it but you armed a criminal.

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Macbeau: Great taste man. Great effin' taste. Mine is too pretty to be kept under the bed. It has a near perfect finish, full stock, and original 7 round magazine. Used to belong to the Dep. of State in my state. I had a Chinese version (black synthetic, 5 round mag) that I kept behind the bed. That was the best $139 I've ever spent. lol It was loaded with #4 buck. Ideal for indoor work - according to someone with experience. Loved that gun to pieces. I gave it to my last GF as a house-warming gift when she moved into her own place. Now *that* is love, gentlemen. She'd not liked having it behind my bed when she stayed the night in the past, but by the time she moved it gave her a sense of comfort to know it was there.

 

Now, I keep my Romy 74 with ten round magazine at the foot of the bed. There's also my Baby Eagle (earned the nick-name: 'Tex' shooting 6 inch groups at 75 yards with it - not from a rest), 40 S&W loaded with 11 Federal 165grn Hydrashoks. It lives in my underwear drawer. lol I'd actually like to get another of those Chinese M37's, or perhaps a Win 97 replica for bed-side duty. The sound of the slide on that is... incomparable. I like my 37 too much though...

 

I also keep the doors locked and a cell phone - on it's charger - next to my bed. The only thing I'm missing so far is a flashlight.... That shall be remedied soon.

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