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hi. i just ordered a saiga .223 ... i have some noob questions.. sorry..

 

1. is it difficult to install the dinzag mag adapter? i don't have access to any big tools.. and have never done any gunsmithing. same question with the muzzle break?

 

2. are there any 10 round mags out there that are not factory plastic?

 

3. if i purchased the surefire 30 round mags, would i have to go 922r compliance ? not sure on the compliance as i thought it was for peoples who converted their rifles to AKs...

 

thanks :smoke:

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hi. i just ordered a saiga .223 ... i have some noob questions.. sorry..

 

1. is it difficult to install the dinzag mag adapter? i don't have access to any big tools.. and have never done any gunsmithing. same question with the muzzle break?

 

2. are there any 10 round mags out there that are not factory plastic?

 

3. if i purchased the surefire 30 round mags, would i have to go 922r compliance ? not sure on the compliance as i thought it was for peoples who converted their rifles to AKs...

 

thanks :smoke:

 

 

1. I think you men feed ramp. Make sure you have the right location on your gun. Drill with quality colbalt bits. I like Ridgid from Home depot. Also use oil. Drill A 3/32 hole then a 5/32 hole then drill a #21 hole then tap slowly. Finally install the screw and be sure to use loctite on those thread. I just shot 80 rounds with a loctited( if that a word) feed ramp and I had no movement Nice. Muzzle break. I would go with Tromix or somebody that has done one before. I never have done one of those but if the barrel is any where near as hard and the trunnion have somebody else do it. Somebody with the right tools. I mean it will be cheaper in your time to have somebody else do it. Also you would need to buy some special tools for treading a barrel.

 

2. No but you may get a gali 10rd to work. Orlites 35 are no mess just a little sanding on the side of mag. See Vojor posting. Orlites work nice.

 

3. Yes your gun must have enough parts cuz the mag does not count a 922. So you gun need the Us made stuff. I.E Firecontrol like Tapco g2 or redstar or Kvar or whatever. Also a stock and pistol grip must be US made and crap.

 

Side note I really think a .223 doesn't need a muzzle break, the recoil is already light. Also if you add a break you make the gun louder. I don't know if you know that. When you port a gun or add a muzzle break you are sending more gas back toward you. And out the sides. But more noise will be blown toward you then just a plain barrel.

 

Okay I shot a mini 14 with a break on it. It is like shooting a ruger 10/22 no recoil or little recoil I should say. Louder then any thing. With the break.

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Side note I really think a .223 doesn't need a muzzle break, the recoil is already light. Also if you add a break you make the gun louder...

 

Amen to that. Plus, a muzzle device of any sort adds length (and even a little weight). I threw one on my Saiga because I had it in the parts box, but I'm thinking about removing it, and just covering the threads with an American-made thread protector (also sitting in my parts box ;>)...

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Dude no probs with the NOOB questions...we love newbies here! We eat them for breakfast! Makes oue Saigas run better! :devil:

 

 

LOL...just joshin man, ask anything you want, just do some research along with the questions.

 

In your situation I highly recommend getting a bullet guide (or feedramp...same critter) from dinzag here on the forum. His are custom made to fit the Saigas and have all the tools you need to do the install with instructions. It's not a hard task if you are prepared.

Secondly he also has muzzle brakes that install easily without having to thread your barrel. Just drill two small dimples in the FSB extension for the setscrews tp seat in, stick it on there, tighten the screws with locktite, and you're done.

 

Welcome to Saigaland!

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the problem is i don't know how to tap or press or drill ..etc.. lol.. =( is it easy to do?

also if i use an aftermarket 10 rnd mag or a 10/30 mag (30 rnd mag modified to 10 rnd) . do i have to go 922 compliant?

 

also how many parts do i have to change? is the tapco trigger kit easy to install? my rifle is still at the store so i haven't had a chance to play around with it.

 

and how do i change the forum setting so i don't have to click on every post? what happaned to the old way of all the posts being seen?

Edited by ask80
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Go to the top of the page on the right and click on "options".

Set the display mode to "standard mode".

 

Go to the tech section in "Guestbook", read for awhile, and then ask any questions you have left. (After you have tried to find the answers yourself) ;)

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the problem is i don't know how to tap or press or drill ..etc.. lol.. =( is it easy to do?

 

If you've really never handled a power drill, then you should probably find a friend who has, and get them a six-pack (or similar inducement) to do it for you.

 

I just did mine, and while I'm familiar with the various tools, it's been a while since I've done any work with them. It really doesn't require a lot of precision, as long as you can substitute patience. I had a good DeWalt drill, and bought a tap handle at the hardware store (couldn't find my vise grips). Dinzag's full kit has literally everything else you need!

 

Modifying my 3 Galil Orlites took me more time than the actual metalwork on the rifle (not counting cleaning out the metal chips and waiting for the cleaner to dry).

 

HTH!

Bill

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Hey, Compadre! Some of those brakes are super-efficient: (as you know) they were designed to keep the rifle under control, during full-auto fire. Examples might include the Ak-74 brake, the AMD-65 'snake' brake, and your Polish Wz brake. I'm guessing that's probably why they work so well for some of the sportsmen here, who compete with their AKs. But if you're shooting semi-auto, and not competing, brakes don't always buy you much (although I will admit, they might look nice... ;>).

 

The noise can be a problem. I've owned a couple of JP Enterprises brakes, and I swear, my shooting buddies thought I was trying to kill them (especially one time, I had a JP brake on a Mini-14, and at the same time my buddy was losing his hearing, he was getting blazing-hot .223 brass dumped down the back of his shirt, because he set up right where the Mini was launching the empties. OUCH!!!).

 

Pay attention to your hearing. I had ringing in my ears once, for three months, just because I popped off a few rounds of .357 Magnum in a borrow pit with a shooting buddy. We were wrapping up for the day, and I had put my ear-plugs & head-set away, so when my friend remembered he hadn't fired his .357, I figured I would just stick a couple of cleaning patches in my ears (after all, that's what I used to do when I was a kid, shooting a .22 rifle). Let me tell you, it doesn't work when firing hot .357 loads inside a hole in the ground.

 

Word to the wise...

 

;>)

 

 

LOL I know about what you say, about the hearing, been there done that, about the muzzle brakes

I have been there done that too, the muzzle brakes gives and takes, is how you see

what you need, and yes they, were design on full auto fire control in mind I mean the comblock brakes, yes the Ak74 style

brake works the best on rapid fire, the more and quicker you fire your gun the best it work

on one shot they are ok no big deal, if U use a brake better make sure you can take it off

to clean your gun, that end of the barrel will be like hell on cake powder, same for the inside of the brake

itself, corrosion on barrel ends and brake itself is something I have notice on guns, not much

but after several hundreds of rounds you can start to see it on inside of brakes

and partition of chambers on the brake and a lot of other more interesting stuff, what people

don't realize is that, for the brake to work is limits on how big the holes on the brake suposed to be

what pattern on the brake, type of chamber or chambers, if not done right U just adding death

weight to the end of your barrel.

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if i'm too lazy and decide to use the surefire mags ( i know it's expensive), and if i change the trigger group ( i understand to be 3 US parts) and the gas tube thing ( 1 US part), will that be ok? i'm so confused on the 922 rule

 

If I remember the Surfire mag is a imported mag that has been modified to be used with the saiga. So they do not qualify as a U.S. compliance part on the 922 rule (Anyone with info to the contary please correct me!). (If so then..) Using them in your saiga would require you to still have 5 U.S. parts added to the saiga (without a muzzle device) or 6 U.S. parts (with a muzzle device).

Easy fix is (without muzzle device)

Your FCG (fire controll group: trigger, hammer, disconnector) =3

Your grip =1

Your stock=1

Easy fix (with muzzle device)

Your FCG (fire controll group: trigger, hammer, disconnector) =3

Your grip =1

Your stock=1

Your muzzle device=1 (go with the one sold on this site)

 

or you could substute one of these:

Your forearm=1

your gas piston=1

Edited by Longhunter-CO
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if i'm too lazy and decide to use the surefire mags ( i know it's expensive), and if i change the trigger group ( i understand to be 3 US parts) and the gas tube thing ( 1 US part), will that be ok? i'm so confused on the 922 rule

 

If I remember the Surfire mag is a imported mag that has been modified to be used with the saiga. So they do not qualify as a U.S. compliance part on the 922 rule (Anyone with info to the contary please correct me!). (If so then..) Using them in your saiga would require you to still have 5 U.S. parts added to the saiga (without a muzzle device) or 6 U.S. parts (with a muzzle device).

Easy fix is (without muzzle device)

Your FCG (fire controll group: trigger, hammer, disconnector) =3

Your grip =1

Your stock=1

Easy fix (with muzzle device)

Your FCG (fire controll group: trigger, hammer, disconnector) =3

Your grip =1

Your stock=1

Your muzzle device=1 (go with the one sold on this site)

 

or you could substute one of these:

Your forearm=1

your gas piston=1

 

 

The absolute easiest (not cheapest) way to go might be the Surefire mags (assuming they are RELIABLE - I've never used one), plus a quality US-made fire control group (hammer, trigger, & disconnector), plus a US-made pistol grip, and finally, a US-made butt stock. (Add a US-made muzzle device if you want one - I would recommend dinzag's products).

 

(You also might add a Red Star Arms axis pin retaining plate, just because they are so dang easy to install & remove, and won't make you afraid to 'tear down' your AK... ;>)

 

With that setup, you presumably won't have to drill and tap any holes in the front trunnion - it's as close to a simple 'bare bones' conversion as I think you will get.

 

FWIW, your mileage may vary, etc., etc.

 

;>)

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The absolute easiest (not cheapest) way to go might be the Surefire mags (assuming they are RELIABLE - I've never used one), plus a quality US-made fire control group (hammer, trigger, & disconnector), plus a US-made pistol grip, and finally, a US-made butt stock. (Add a US-made muzzle device if you want one - I would recommend dinzag's products).

 

 

I think that there is still one US part missing. While the pistol grip does not count against you if its US made, it doesnt really count towards compliance either as it isnt replacing a foriegn part... I think.

 

 

 

Im confused though. If you dont feel ready to do a conversion, and you dont mind being restricted to 10 rds, then why mess with it at all? The factory mags are good and they are available if you look around. Enjoy the rifle the way it is for a while and keep reading around the forum. When you feel ready, go for it, convert. If you buy a few more factory mags it isn't a loss because they can be converted to work with Dinzags guide after the conversion is done. Having a few 10 rounders is nice if you ask me.

 

I dont know, food for thought.

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If you dont feel ready to do a conversion, and you dont mind being restricted to 10 rds, then why mess with it at all?

One reason might be the God-awful trigger pull that some Saigas come with, courtesy of the 'politically correct' factory fire control group ('paging Rube Goldberg'). Doing a conversion, and smoothing the contact surfaces on your new 'compliance' FCG before you install it, can definitely improve the trigger pull...

 

;>)

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Can't disagree there.

 

I'm just sayin theres plenty of time, no sense rushing in and buying stuff that you probably wont be able to use later when you decide to dive in fully (which he will).

 

That said, the conversion process is fun and there is tons of info to be had here that can help you through. So, why not, everybodys doing it. :angel:

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hi. i just ordered a saiga .223 ... i have some noob questions.. sorry..

 

1. is it difficult to install the dinzag mag adapter? i don't have access to any big tools.. and have never done any gunsmithing. same question with the muzzle break?

 

2. are there any 10 round mags out there that are not factory plastic?

 

3. if i purchased the surefire 30 round mags, would i have to go 922r compliance ? not sure on the compliance as i thought it was for peoples who converted their rifles to AKs...

 

thanks :smoke:

Here you go, and I'm not, BTW, a lawyer or a professional gunsmith.

 

FWIW, your mileage may vary, etc., etc.

 

1. I didn't have any trouble at all installing the dinzag 'mag adapter' (bullet guide). I bought the 'full monte' kit (rule of thumb: you can't have enough quality drill bits & taps ;>). Because I'm not perfect, I got the hole drilled (& threaded) a little bit off-center - no big deal. I just opened up the bolt-hole in dinzag's lovely bullet guide with a hand file, and it installed, and functioned, 100% perfect. PLEASE REMEMBER: THIS IS NOT BRAIN SURGERY! (I should know, my wife - the better half of my life - has worked in heart-transplant units, burn wards, hyperbaric-oxygen wards, etc., etc. And anything we do here is 'kids play' compared to the really serious stuff... ;>)

 

2. I've got a couple of the 12-round Galil steel mags (designed for blanks, for grenade lauching, IIRC). They work fine in my Saiga with stock (mil-spec 55 gr.) ammo, although I had to thin the mag catch a bit, because I left the front trigger-guard tang 'long,' to keep the Orlites tight. They're pretty cheap from CDNN, if you want to try them (plus, you can make - or maybe even buy - US-made mag floorplates for these magazines, to keep things 'federal law compliant.' Let's all do that, to avoid problems... ;>).

 

3. From what I hear, the answer is "YES." But 'complaince' is not (currently - keep that in mind, with the new pelosicongress) really a big problem. Going to a standard AK FCG can actually improve your trigger pull (and with it, 'safety' ;>), and US-made butt stocks and pistol grips are available, to (in the opinion of one of my more experienced buddies) help you control your firearm, and avoid accidents.

 

As for converting any legal firearm to an "AK," let me point out that an "AK" is, by many definitions, a weapon capable of full-automatic fire. No Russian Saiga sold in this country is capable of full-automatic fire - they are designed, marketed, and sold, in a completely law-abiding manner, as sporting firearms, just like those imported from Britain, and Spain, and Japan, and other western countries. Nor can any of the Russian Saigas be 'easily' converted to full-automatic or any similar illegal status, IMHO (and that opinion is based on my work with so-called 'military-style' firearms, for a decade or more, as an average, law-abiding American citizen)...

Edited by Bad Bob
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