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v188 wrote:

 

OK, here's my two cents, after reading the above thread. (BTW JWarren, excellent writing skills).

 

I've noticed that all the stories of crime, despair, SHTF, etc are either based in major urban areas or the South. I wonder why that is?

 

Central Nebraska went without power this Dec/Jan for about 4 weeks (or more in some areas). Nobody blamed Bush; nobody looted; nobody blamed FEMA, etc. I was in North Dakota a few years ago with the huge floods. Same thing, no riots, lawlessness, etc.

 

Now I'm not picking a fight here, but I am really curious, as to why the South has such SHTF crime problems during a storm/disaster? I understand urban areas and their crimes.

 

Is it a generic entitlement mentality? US Govt owes me? I'm owed, so I'll take someone elses?

 

My point again is that you don't see this behavior in the Great Plains, or Mountain regions. I suppose you might find an exception, which simply proves my point.

 

I'd like to learn, and if you have good answers, please, explain them to me.

 

(Not putting on flame suit, it's legit questions, but expecting flames, nonetheless)

 

 

JWarren, I don't know if this makes a difference on your hypothesis? Generic vs genetic

 

Nonetheless, I think that you properly summed it up, Poverty and Entitlement Mentality. My fiance is a school teacher down South, and you were exactly right, about parents pushing for a disability diagnosis from the schools. I'm as disgusted about it as my fiance.

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SHTF-All the time.....

Chaps I am not worried about the Fertilizer getting shredded by the air conditioning unit.

 

I have been active in custodial, janitorial, sanitary engineering, cleaning up messes when the SHTF literally, for almost 40 years.

 

This means I am officially an Ominpotent Lecherous Deadhead Flatulently Arthritic Republican Terminator [ or an old fart].

 

I grew up without Nintendo; without computers; without the Internet and walked everywhere unless I hadtake the bus. I rode a bike!

 

Anyway when The SHTF, [be it Zombies, Hillary in a Thong, Terrorists raiding the local schools I will respond in kind.

[saiga 12 in all three cases.] Actually in #1 and # 3 with no prisoners. Number Two gets dipped in Hoiney and sent to Gaddis.

 

I'll be on my porch locked and loaded and ready to rock and roll.

 

Time for the Wild Turkey and the little white pills again

 

PS: I shall apologoze to Gaddis for i may have inflicted damage upon his soul. Ther very idea of hillary in a Thong dripping with Honey-

 

[Mod. Note: At this point the entire forum began pelting Griz with dead carp.]

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Griz,

 

I will never forgive you for burning the image of Hillary in a thong into my mind. Even as I type this, I find myself wanting to curl into a fetal position.

 

Being the guy I am, my mind immediately fused that image with SHTF and now I am picturing Hillary's thong with a massive, horrible skid mark on it. brrrr....(shiver)

 

I'll get back at you with this:

 

Hillary and Pelosi in a sorid, illicit love triangle with Bill....

 

 

Sleep well :)

 

 

John

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v188,

 

Yep.. good catch there. I need to pay more attention. "Generic" definately does hit the mark-- that's exactly what it is. We have a society that is obsessed with materialism and "things." Furthermore, this society has a "taker" mentality. I suspect that it began with some of the entitlement programs and was only furthered with our culture of litigation where it is someone else's fault if you can't understand that coffee is hot before you dump a cup in your lap to the tune of 2 or 3 million dollars. Add the cherry on top of the "thug life" imagery of Bentley's, platinum "grills" and Crystal champagne, and we have a toxic swill to drink....

 

 

John

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DAMN! I go offline for a couple days and this place goes APE!

Still-some good info here. Let me add..

 

Electric lines- a $1.50 pocket tester-the kind that has an orange (neon) bulb that lights when touched to or comes close to a live wire, taped to a 6' piece of PVC pipe will identify live wires safely.

 

Chainsaw-If you aren't used to using one-DON'T. Get a bowsaw instead. Even if you have, and use a chainsaw, a bowsaw is cheap,quiet, and uses no gasoline.

 

Generators- I have one AND a X-fer switch to power the 'fridge, furnace, and well when the power goes out. I am in a suburban

area, but BG&E power is not a reputable utility- the power goes out TOO regularly. DON'T forget to use StaBil in the fuel both in the gen and that wich you keep on hand. (start the generator monthly-if it don't work you might as well NOT have one)

 

Dog.- GOTTA HAVE ONE!

 

Bugout- Unless you GOTTA (position is unsafe or untenable) DON'T. If everyone is on the road panic will rule. If you are SAFE in you'r location, and have 5 days food and water you will be in a much better position to move out AFTER the panic. (Impending cat 5 hurricane and you are on the coast EVACUATE!)

 

Without spending a fortune, I have a 4WD, guns and ammo, woodburning stove, tools, and a secure room (will withstand hurricane/tornado ect) the rest of the house can blow away and the LARGE trees in the yard and neighborhood can come down and we will be OK

 

MOST of what i have is multi purpose. Very little was purchased STRICTLY for SHTF. However, I do keep an eye out when making normal purchases for their SHTF potential.

 

Assembly point- We have locations to assemble the family if bugout IS necessary. My kids are grown and on their own, but We know where we will be going TO if we bugout. Do YOU?

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Seriously [and I will never use this word again] Back in the late 60's and early 70's I got 'stung'

by the Survival school of thinkinking, which is what the SHTF thinking was called way back then.

 

OK, back then there was a 'wilderness fortress concept which was intriguing but completely impossible

for me to realize because at that time I lived in the middle of Seattle, didn't drive a vehicle nor owned a boat.

 

40 years later, I agree with GOB regarding having a generator. I own my home now and as my house is heated by oil and I have a 350 gallon capacity tank and am installing a diesel generator with a capacity to run the Microwave, the Fridge and Freezer. Part of my plan, adds specific new electrical plugs which the generator will feed exclusively. I plan to stay put and defend at all costs. Apartment dwellers may want a smaller generator either gas or propane powered.

 

Immediate BUGOUT in Seattle and it's environs is not recommended. The streets/ highways will be a mess. Why anybody put a major interstate UNDER a convention center is beyond me. Seattle is a city surrounded by bridges. That ribbon of asphalt will become a parking lot.

 

A dog, you bet. A small little dog that barks every time a flea farts or somebody approaches the property. Always keep a well stocked pantry . As my medical needs are great, I keep a 90 day supply on hand.

 

G O B is right on about thinking when the SHTF think multi purpose. That 6 man tent system and all my camping gear could become our home. I never tosseed out my CB and when I bought walkie talkies got crystals that tie in with the Cobra. My old orientation compass and maps will come in handy as well.

 

Just my two bits.

 

Griz

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v188 wrote:

 

OK, here's my two cents, after reading the above thread. (BTW JWarren, excellent writing skills).

 

I've noticed that all the stories of crime, despair, SHTF, etc are either based in major urban areas or the South. I wonder why that is?

 

Central Nebraska went without power this Dec/Jan for about 4 weeks (or more in some areas). Nobody blamed Bush; nobody looted; nobody blamed FEMA, etc. I was in North Dakota a few years ago with the huge floods. Same thing, no riots, lawlessness, etc.

 

Now I'm not picking a fight here, but I am really curious, as to why the South has such SHTF crime problems during a storm/disaster? I understand urban areas and their crimes.

 

Is it a generic entitlement mentality? US Govt owes me? I'm owed, so I'll take someone elses?

 

My point again is that you don't see this behavior in the Great Plains, or Mountain regions. I suppose you might find an exception, which simply proves my point.

 

I'd like to learn, and if you have good answers, please, explain them to me.

 

(Not putting on flame suit, it's legit questions, but expecting flames, nonetheless)

 

 

v188,

 

Thank you for the compliment.

 

You bring up a good question-- one that will likely have as many opinions as to its reasons as there are posters following this thread. You could expect, if you ask enough people, answers that have emotionally charged viewpoints such as ethnicity, etc.

 

I'll give my take on it from some experience growing up in the South, living in various urban cities, and also going through that storm. I'll stress that this is only one of many opinions and comes from my observations. I would not be so arrogant to believe that I have the full answer, or even the definitive one.

 

Some have blamed it on a ethinc or cultural catalyst. It is a fact that there are higher concentrations of black persons in the Central South and also in inner-city urban environments in various areas of the US. Some have made racist comments about the looting as such in the aftermath of Katrina (not on this board, but other places.) However, I don't see ethnicity as a primary cause.

 

In my opinion, poverty is a primary cause. It is no secret that income levels are significantly lower in the Central South and in urban environments. It has been my experience that a significant portion of the lower income persons in these areas are black. Somehow, that has translated in some people's minds that the civil unrest is a result of black persons, not the economic realities in many persons' lives. There were a lot of people that did not have the means or the inclination to prepare for such events and became desperate. I even saw some people who DID have the means to be prepared, but didn't become desperate when thier food ran out.

 

I don't see a genetic-entitlement function, either-- or perhaps I haven't fully wrapped my brain around the "genetic" component. I don't see anything genetic about entitlement. I do, however, see a lot of people in this country who have been promised repeatedly that the US government will take care of all thier needs-- and they believed it. I'm not talking about welfare, SSI, etc. I'm talking about all these agencies and programs of the government and the promises they have made to justify spending our tax money on them. When everything breaks down, and these agencies rectify the issues in a manner expected, people begin to cry foul.

 

I will say that there is a cultural component to this mentality. A lot of the poorer persons-- regardless of race--- have learned through 3 or so generations how to use the system. To give an example: My wife is a pre-k teacher in a poor section of the a nearby city. Of 20 children in her room, only 6 actually had a father listed on their birth certificate. Of those 20 children, only one had both parents in the household. Of the 20, every single one was recieving government benefits based on this. A number of parents over the years has requested thier children to be tested for learning disabilities to be classified as "developmentally delayed." Those that qualify get an extra check every month from the government. Often, parents whose children were found not to be developmentally delayed will approach my wife to re-test the child repeatedly until they fail the test.

 

This is the world we live in.

 

I personally dislike FEMA, but not for the reasons one would expect. What I saw in the hurricane's aftermath was people working to solve thier own problems and to take care of thier own communities. All that stopped EXACTLY when FEMA showed up. I don't know what it is, but the instant FEMA was seen, no one felt that they had to do anything anymore. Everyone sat back and waited for FEMA to do it for them. I hate that FEMA was immediately relyed on by able-bodied persons when before they relied on themselves and each other. I saw people become lazy, greedy, and taking on an air of pitifulness that simply didn't exist before FEMA came in. It wasn't FEMA's fault, but it shows our want and need to depend on the government.

 

 

 

 

I hope that helps.

 

 

John

 

Hello, John

I don't recall ever singling out "blacks" as a reason for the problems. The reason I mentioned "ethnics" is simply that white, Anglo youths are the only "group" that are under-represented in the violent gang picture. Here in Houston, and as I recall in CA, hispanic groups such as "MS-13" and the Latin Kings are some of the most visible. Asian gangs have shown to be brutal, although a large part of their victims appear to also be Asian.

And. I'm not trying to hang blame on anybody or any group of people, but to deny that violent, ethnic-based thugs are not an integral component of urban violence is just a "head-in-the-sand" mentality. They have also shown to be among the first to "mobilize" when conditions around them appear to be deteriorating to the point that society is less-able to defend against them.

 

Poverty is a contagious disease. Until the contagious chain is broken ("Gee, some people actually get out of bed before the sun comes up and go to work?"....)

we will continue to battle it's symptoms.

Unfortunately, it appears things will continue to get worse and more difficult to battle this disease, as the middle class is becoming less visible and the lower classes ranks are swelling.

 

-Gosh, tht's the same socio-economic structure that is "enjoyed" south of the border, what a coincidence!

 

Respectfully posted,

Guido2 in Houston

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Ack... no Guido! You didn't, and none on this board have. That wasn't addressing anything other than the multitude of media/talk on the street/various posting across a multitude of boards/etc.

 

I hope that I didn't sound as though I was addressing you or anyone here. It seemed like a good thing to point out in leui of all the press I have read around.

 

For the record, I am 100% in agreement with your analysis... :)

 

 

John

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old habits die hard, caspian.

 

did you also notice that half the time, I dont bother with proper punctuation and such? i bet it means that i could give two shits and im sure you still understand what im talking about.

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Oh yeah, SOPMOD...

 

"You are a functional retardate if you think the market will beat guns in the next 20 years"...well there are a lot of us 'tards out there, I guess I'm in pretty good company. I guess you could invest in transferrable machine guns, they do pretty well- and just hope they won't be eventually outlawed.

 

"...I started college 1 month before Black Monday 1987 and saw suckers like you blowing their brains out and jumping in front of busses..." Well, I was there too. I'm quite a bit older than you, actually. I didn't jump in front of any buses and in fact, my investments are all more valuable than ever (Like your parents, I also invest in real estate).

 

"...your little "yuppie bubble"..." lol dude. just lol.

 

This society will implode because of it's excesses not because of some insurmountable catastrophe or war and SHTF is just an excuse to drag guys like you into the street,execute you and take all your stuff by people who didn't have it quite as easy as you growing up:D ...This may be the funniest thing I've ever read on this board, actually.

 

 

You live in Tulsa(or Broken Arrow or Bixby or some other such place) so turn on a police scanner and give it a listen and see what's going on right down the street from you and you'll start to figure out just how close that shithole is to totally imploding.

 

It has already imploded there a couple of times(race riots and the big flood) before but now that the population density is 10x what is was during the Tulsa Race Riots and the percentage of people below the poverty line(many of whom don't speak English nowadays) you are sitting on the edge of a Golf Course that's only 2 weeks of supply interruption away from being a parking lot for roving bands of criminal looters..Right across town are 100,000 people that will push you into the trunk of your car while you are loading your groceries at the Albertson's at 101st and Memorial and you'll never be heard from again and that's during "normal" socioeconomic conditions and they are already collecting on the edges of the nicer areas specifically to prey upon people like you and your family in "Yuppie Land" instead of staying out near Turley or West Tulsa where you could comfortably forget they existed.

 

Add a massive string of tornadoes like OKC(looting,crime and murder were rampant for over a month) and an already stressed economy and then interrupt the Gub'ment Cheese on top of that and you will be right in the middle of a Sarajevo Style SHTF scenario and you're too stupid to even realize it :D

 

If you live there and all you see is shopping and golf courses and red castle then you could easily poopoo the idea of SHTF but if you work Emergency Management or LE in that area for one summer then you start to get a much broader picture of a large urban population looking for an excuse to "pull the pin" and frankly if SHTF isn't part of your mental landscape then you dead already and don't even know it;)

 

That's why I moved out of Tulsa and eventually out of Oklahoma entirely and other than a few friends and some rental property I have no desire to ever see that timebomb again:o

 

Good Luck Pollyana(you'll need it one day;))

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Hello

meant to ask this when this thread was a bit more current, but I forgot...

 

I have a gas powered generator (110/220V) that I purchased a little over a year ago (Hurricane fiasco...)

I filled the crankcase with oil, but have never put any gasoline in the engine, and obviously, have never ran it.

I periodically turn the motor over manually to splash some oil around, but I've been wondering if it would be better to fuel it up and actually start the motor, to spin the generator and such.

Any advice from those of you who might have a more in-depth knowledge than I do on this matter?

 

TIA,

Guido2 in Houston

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guido2,

Yes, crank up the generator with fuel and let it run for 20-30 minutes every 2-3 months. More often is better, but I know how the time goes by. Just the temperature change for the metal parts, particularly the cylinder and piston assembly, over 24 hours will cause condensation and rust to form inside the cylinder and on the piston. Running the motor long enough, to the point of heating up the oil and burning off the moisture in the oil, will get the oil everywhere it's supposed to be and remove all the condensed moisture. This will slow the rust process and keep bearings/seals, etc. properly lubed. It will also keep the rust off the contacts in the generator parts so it will keep generating, to put it simply. Also, be sure to change the oil at least once a year even the generator is never used, change more often if it is used. I've had my generator since about 1987/1988, still works perfectly with the above steps followed. Also, use a fuel stabilizer in the fuel. Lastly, if the fuel tank has a separate fuel cutoff installed before the carburetor, close the fuel cutoff at the end of the 20-30 minute run time and let the engine starve to shutdown. This empties the carb and fuel bowl and helps prevent old fuel from gunking up the inner carb works if it sits too long. 'Course, use of the fuel stabilizer should prevent this also.

Sorry for the long post about this, but you wanted an answer.

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Thanks, kyhelo

Long and detailed is fine with me. That is kinda what I've been suspecting, I had a feeling it may not be there for me when I need it if I didn't start some PM program on it now....

 

Appreciatively,

guido2 in Houston

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  • 6 months later...

Hey all.

I hate to drag up an old thread (OK, I couldn't really say this definitively, I think to date I've made a whopping 10 posts).

 

But I decided to do so for two reasons.

 

The first is that this is the type of information people need to think about on a semi-regular basis. The more you think about it, the easier it will be able to recall when you need it. If you haven't read this thread (and admittedly it's a long one) you should think about it. Not necessarily specifics (I, for one, would need drastic changes to some of the suggestions here, considering several months here the temps are below zero) but the mentality.

 

Look at things around you, and think once in a while: "If I have to leave, what can I grab quickly?" "If I want to stay, what do I have to do to make this place defendable?"

 

I have the option of going into the woods - I wouldn't bug out to a city - they're gonna have their own problems in a long-term scenario, and in a short-term scenario there's no need to go so far. Some people don't, but you still have to think about it sometimes - "what would I do?" You will read most often that playing the "What-If" game, just being mentally prepared, helps you infinitely in just about every situation.

 

The second, and equally important issue I'd like to bring up, for those of you who read this post before, or are doing so now, and maybe taking notes (Like I know I have) I would like to address this:

 

on a sidenote, honey is a good thing to have:

 

- it gives a lot of energy

- it doesnt go bad, so you can stash it in big amounts (good honey forms a protective layer to seal itself off in case you store it for ages. there could be some dirt/mold etc on it, but you can scrape it off, and then heat the hard honey to prepare for consumption. a decade ago they found a stash of honey in some pharao's grave, after scraping off a layer and heating it to render it liquid, it was still edible according to the doctors. how neat is that?)

- you can use honey to disinfect wounds (ancient egyptians already knew that components of honey fight bacteria and infections if you smear it on. rather handy if you run out of normal healing supplies.)

- and it's tasty!

 

PS: this is all assuming you didn't buy some cheapskate's honey that was laced with sugar, water, etc to boost production.

 

This is a great idea - honey doesn't go bad, makes things taste better, and with a little effort (not much at all) you can make alcohol (mead anyone?)

 

There is a caveat, which some people know, but many don't -

 

NEVER FEED HONEY TO AN INFANT!

 

Obviously, people don't go around pouring honey down an infant's mouth, but if you're living off rations, and trying to spread some flavor, keep this in mind. Honey contains botulism spores. You won't get sick eating honey because the acid in your stomach neutralizes it.....BUT children less than about a year old have a less acidic stomach fluid, and will not kill the botulism. Bottom line - not only are you stretched thin, but now you have to deal with a child that has botulism.

 

Just file this little bit of info away, please. I would hate to hear of anyone hurt through ignorance.

 

Oh, and if I have committed some sort of social taboo by resurrecting a 7 month old thread, please let me know and I will refrain from doing so whenever possible, but I felt this was necessary.

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Up until I started backpacking, the SHTF scenarios, documentaries, and apocalyptic movies held little real meaning. Miles from civilization, with the burden of all one needs carried on one's shoulders, necessity is defined. Three things come to mind: water, water, and water. I had relatives stranded in East Texas after Katrina. Their experience paralleled the reality that water is the primary concern. They were over a week sans civilization.

 

Having had to pack a weeks worth of supplies into a wilderness, hunkering down is preferred over bugging-out. Homes come with at least one form of water storage: a bathtub. Even after most natural disasters, water pressure remains for a short period of time. Fill the tub while water pressure remains. Buy a portable backpacker-style water filter.

 

A few additional thoughts:

 

Can foods have a long shelf life, require no refrigeration, and can be heated over primitive heat sources... or eaten at room temp (make sure you have a non-electric can opener). Insect repellent is more than a luxury. A good first aid kit is a must, including any meds needed (I have lots of OTC allergy meds and aspirin/Tylenol). Everclear is a good disinfectant, fire-starter, fuel, and pain reliever. Those who are ill-prepared will seek out those who have forethought; contemplate the concept of triage and self-preservation. Practice self-sufficient living... camp out w/o the electric, sewer, and water hookups, even if it's in your backyard. Have a plan, even a basic one beats "winging it".

 

Retirement more closely resembles what will most likely occur to most, but I had rather have a backup plan which includes acts of God and man.

 

buckmeister

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Wow!

 

I, for one, am glad this thread was resurrected. I would have never found the MOT (Mother Of all Threads)

 

There is some great advice, riveting tales, insightful comments, scary insights into personalities, and some just outright entertainment.

 

Being a realistic moderate liberal 3rd generation immigrant/native American capitalist tradesmen businessman educated wrong side of tracks conservative atheist idealist, etc, etc....I'm planning to retire on a pile of cash WITH equipment/guns for SHTF scenarios.

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My opinion hasn't changed.

 

If you really want to prepare for the future in a realistic way, invest for your retirement.

 

+2

 

And Bob, I agree with you (I didn't actually address this in my post) insofar as that goes - I am currently investing for retirement (albeit modestly, at this point.) It's like John said back on page 3 or so - (paraphrasing here) - "I don't want to end up with in a situation where I'm better off if the world DOES end"

 

The point I wanted to bring up is the preparation, the mentality. John turned out fine in the situation, and he didn't stockpile supplies and go nuts beforehand. It's the mental preparedness that matters, thinking about things, thinking outside the box. People need to be able to have the mindset to Improvise, Adapt, Overcome. I'm glad you feel confident that you would make out well (and honestly, I would like to have your training - and you! - by my side in a SHTF scenario) but there are others without your training who would not necessarily be prepared, even with a stockpile of food, supplies, and weapons.

 

I hope that by reading some of these posts, and the kind of mental strategies necessary for this sort of thing, that people who are less prepared in the way of "organized training" (like me, and I'm sure many others) will be able to glean something useful.

 

Also, John, if you read this, I would like to join the others who have complimented you and thanked you for your time and elucidation.

Edited by BlackBear
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Fortunatly I am a mechanic, and a natural "McGuiver". That alone iis the greatest "SHTF" survival skill. The ability to adapt what you can find into what you need to provide one's self and family with shelter, water and food.

 

I am rapidly approaching retirement. So I have provided to have a decent retirement income and the money to buy some land, build a decent shop and a small house. I have suficent weapons and ammo to defend that against 2 or 4 legged varmint, and

grow,preserve,and store food and water. A "bugout kit" is more important for those who are in dense urban areas or areas that need to be evacuated such as Gulf coast or bottom land ect. . However a pack with a poncho and liner, brick of .22 lr's ,an AR-7, a knife,shovel,rope,multi-tool ,water purifier and water bladder, and some food will be sufficent for almost any unforseen situation. An S-12 is also part of any "SHTF" scenario. For those who cannot use 12ga. due to age or infirmity-an S-.410 will do.

 

Nothing keeps a mindless bunch of zombies at bay like a shotgun, and no other shotgun carries the instant visual impact and respect of an AK based weapon in that type scenario.

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IMO this is a thread that NEEDS to be resurrected from time to time. Even those of us who are somewhat prepared, can always glean new information and benefit from "reminders" included here.

 

The differences of opinion are great also. It shows things from more than one point of view. We are all "opinionated" to some extent and tend to exclude other points of view until confronted with them. This is just such a thread. One that confronts us with new and different information. One that prompts us to think outside our usual comfort zone.

 

All in all a very useful collection of information. I want to thank all who contributed. What I've learned here or been reminded of, may very well save my life, the lives of my family and friends, and/or enable all of the above to live more comfortably no matter what comes. :smoke:

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  • 4 weeks later...

Wow... The Return of the Living Thread... :)

 

 

Like Bob, my opinions haven't changed and, in reality, we are not diametrically opposed in perspective. Preparation means BOTH preparing for emergencies and PLANNING for a life without them (i.e. investing)

 

 

I appologize for not being around much lately. In March, my wife and I undertook the massive project of restoring a home built by my Great-Grandfather. It's turned into a dream home and we are living there now. It's taken most of my free time.

 

It's slowing down now, so I should be around more.

 

 

-- John

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good to know john, and this is the thread I've been looking for my whole life. Now all this has been excellent for southern, suburban or rural areas, but I really want to know about urban survival techniques. I know Ragnar Benson touched bas on his "survival retreat' book, but stuff like defending 250 gallons of gas in a walmart parking lot is one of the things I would probably have to face.

 

I'm getting my stuff together as we speak, ordering some MREs, magazines, ammo, other gear. Brobably would benefit from a few 5 gallon gas cans, but I drive a beat up ol Explorer so my cargo space is not limitless.

 

My big question is where to go? I live in Houston, and many of you know how insane it was during Rita, when though FEMA specifically told only the coastal areas to evacuate- everyone from Victoria to Conroe jammed every inch of highway. And of course the government only made things worse by not allowing both inbound and outbound highways be set for evacuations, and then the exits were blocked to make sure people couldn't get gas- from one of the 5 gas stations that did'nt run out within 5 minutes. Can you imagine this happeneing to the entire country?

 

So any ideas of what to do in an urban environment? depending on amount of time you have to prepare I mean.

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I agree totally with JWarren regarding a balanced approach to preparation.

 

I take a kind of militant attitude toward this subject because I see so many guys living out some kind of apocalyptic fantasy while neglecting the more mundane aspects of preparation for the future, in particular the "far" future of retirement.

 

Wow John, sounds like an exciting time of life for you!

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