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Parts count on saigas


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#1 vjor

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Posted 30 March 2007 - 07:01 PM

LIST OF PARTS FOR YOUR POSTBAN
THAT QUALIFY AS USA MADE

§ 178.39 Assembly of semiautomatic rifles or shotguns.

(a) No person shall assemble a semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun using more than 10 of the imported parts listed in paragraph © of this section if the assembled firearm is prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) as not being particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.

© For purposes of this section, the term "imported parts" are:

(1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings
(2) Barrels
(3) Barrel extensions
(4) Mounting blocks (trunions)
(5) Muzzle attachments
(6) Bolts
(7) Bolt carriers
(8) Operating rods
(9) Gas pistons
(10) Trigger housings
(11) Triggers
(12) Hammers
(13) Sears
(14) Disconnectors
(15) Buttstocks
(16) Pistol grips
(17) Forearms, handguards
(18) Magazine bodies
(19) Followers
(20) Floorplates

On your Saiga
you have

1 Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings
2 Barrels
3 Mounting blocks (trunions) only 1 front
4 Bolts
5 Bolt carriers
6 Gas pistons
7 Triggers
8 Hammers
9 Disconnectors
10 Buttstocks
11 Forearms, handguards
To use 20 or 30 rounds imported mags that counts as 3 more imported parts
for a total of 14 parts, you may need to install.

USA parts to be install
1 USA made Hammer
1 USA made Disconector
1 USA made Trigger
1 USA made Buttstock
1 USA made Pistol grip
1 USA made Upper and Lower Forearm set
1 USA gas piston
1 usa made mag( count as 3 parts, mag body, follower and floor plate) but I will don’t count on the mag alone for counting USA parts and I count the mag as one part to go over kill on USA parts.

Total of 8 USA made parts take or give on a simple conversion
any extra imported part install on the rifle counts as imported
look at general list of parts for imported parts, remember 10 or less
imported parts on the list on any rifle.


The magic number is 10 or less imported parts.

Edited by vjor, 30 March 2007 - 07:08 PM.

Some people say I'm a grumpy, mean, old man.
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No man is a match for a woman's tears.
When in need! Use and RPG……

If you've got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow.

Not everything that can be counted counts and not everything that counts can be counted.

I don't care what people say as long as I get what I want.

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#2 rflives

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Posted 31 March 2007 - 07:17 AM

This needs to be pinned/stickey'ed good post

#3 vjor

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Posted 31 March 2007 - 02:08 PM

This needs to be pinned/stickey'ed good post



No way is hell is going to happen, I mean for the Mods to pinned or stickey it.

LOL.

Edited by vjor, 31 March 2007 - 02:09 PM.

Some people say I'm a grumpy, mean, old man.
That's not true.
I have the heart of a kind and gentle soul...
in a jar on my desk.


No man is a match for a woman's tears.
When in need! Use and RPG……

If you've got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow.

Not everything that can be counted counts and not everything that counts can be counted.

I don't care what people say as long as I get what I want.

I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!

"One of the most horrible features of war is that all the war-propaganda, all the screaming and lies and hatred, comes invariably from people who are not fighting."
—George Orwell, Homage to Catalonia, 1938

I CAN HAVE THE WEAPON I REALLY ALWAYS WANTED !!!! I DO IT MY SELF,
WHY!!!!!! BECAUSE I CAN, CAN YOU?????

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#4 rflives

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Posted 31 March 2007 - 06:17 PM

Any mod that dose not see the value in this is a silly goose :lol:

#5 napalm281

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Posted 06 April 2007 - 05:53 PM

GREAT POST!!!! I have searched for months for this exact info!!!

#6 vjor

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Posted 06 April 2007 - 08:36 PM

By the way when you guys look at the list, remember, is 10 imported parts
that means looking at the lists you can juggle the parts on your gun
until you get 10 or less imported parts, is no order just fallow
that means you don't have to have a pistol grip
on the gun but the count have to be 10 or less imported parts.

One way to keep the gun on original form and use large mags
is to change butt stock, hand guard, gas piston, hammer and
disconnector, that's if you like the trigger as it is on your Saiga
but the major alteration to pistol grip or regular AK form
usually gives you a better trigger that the one that comes with the
rifle .


1 butt stock
2 hand guard
3 hammer
4 disconnector
5 gas piston.

5 parts that can be had USA made.

About the butt stock and hand guard you can ask battlerifleG3 to make you
American made identical to the Saiga and about the piston, hammer and disconnector
you can buy after markets like G2, FSE and use them but leave the trigger alone
if you think of changing the trigger well it can be done, I mean grind the trigger
until looks like the one the rifle comes with and install it.

But is a lot of work for the same look, better be off with full conversion, but is people
that likes the original look.

Just two cents worth of nothing.

Edited by vjor, 06 April 2007 - 08:48 PM.

Some people say I'm a grumpy, mean, old man.
That's not true.
I have the heart of a kind and gentle soul...
in a jar on my desk.


No man is a match for a woman's tears.
When in need! Use and RPG……

If you've got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow.

Not everything that can be counted counts and not everything that counts can be counted.

I don't care what people say as long as I get what I want.

I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!

"One of the most horrible features of war is that all the war-propaganda, all the screaming and lies and hatred, comes invariably from people who are not fighting."
—George Orwell, Homage to Catalonia, 1938

I CAN HAVE THE WEAPON I REALLY ALWAYS WANTED !!!! I DO IT MY SELF,
WHY!!!!!! BECAUSE I CAN, CAN YOU?????

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#7 csspecs

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Posted 07 April 2007 - 12:54 AM

I did my conversion with 5 US parts for a total count of 15 with 10 imported parts.

Pistol grip
buttstock
trigger
hammer
disconnecter

I want to pick up another and keep the sporter stock but set it up to use 30 round magazines.

http://stores.csspecs.com/
For metal Saiga-12, Saiga .308 and Vepr .308 magazines.

 

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#8 buckmeister

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Posted 07 April 2007 - 12:30 PM

LIST OF PARTS FOR YOUR POSTBAN THAT QUALIFY AS USA MADE

On your Saiga
you have

1 Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings
2 Barrels
3 Mounting blocks (trunions) only 1 front
4 Bolts
5 Bolt carriers
6 Gas pistons
7 Triggers
8 Hammers
9 Disconnectors
10 Buttstocks
11 Forearms, handguards
To use 20 or 30 rounds imported mags that counts as 3 more imported parts
for a total of 14 parts, you may need to install.

Saiga parts to remain
1 Receiver
2 Barrel
3 Trunion
4 Bolt
5 Bolt carrier
6 Gas piston
7 Forearm


Foreign parts used
8 Mag body
9 Mag follower
10 Mag floorplate


11 USA hammer
12 USA disconnector
13 USA trigger
14 USA buttstock
15 USA pistol grip
_______________

10 foreign parts (Compliant)

+ any number of USA made parts = Compliant

Did I miss anything?

buckmeister

#9 vjor

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Posted 07 April 2007 - 08:30 PM

LIST OF PARTS FOR YOUR POSTBAN THAT QUALIFY AS USA MADE

On your Saiga
you have

1 Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings
2 Barrels
3 Mounting blocks (trunions) only 1 front
4 Bolts
5 Bolt carriers
6 Gas pistons
7 Triggers
8 Hammers
9 Disconnectors
10 Buttstocks
11 Forearms, handguards
To use 20 or 30 rounds imported mags that counts as 3 more imported parts
for a total of 14 parts, you may need to install.

Saiga parts to remain
1 Receiver
2 Barrel
3 Trunion
4 Bolt
5 Bolt carrier
6 Gas piston
7 Forearm


Foreign parts used
8 Mag body
9 Mag follower
10 Mag floorplate


11 USA hammer
12 USA disconnector
13 USA trigger
14 USA buttstock
15 USA pistol grip
_______________

10 foreign parts (Compliant)

+ any number of USA made parts = Compliant

Did I miss anything?

buckmeister


No you did not.
Some people say I'm a grumpy, mean, old man.
That's not true.
I have the heart of a kind and gentle soul...
in a jar on my desk.


No man is a match for a woman's tears.
When in need! Use and RPG……

If you've got them by the balls, their hearts and minds will follow.

Not everything that can be counted counts and not everything that counts can be counted.

I don't care what people say as long as I get what I want.

I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it!

"One of the most horrible features of war is that all the war-propaganda, all the screaming and lies and hatred, comes invariably from people who are not fighting."
—George Orwell, Homage to Catalonia, 1938

I CAN HAVE THE WEAPON I REALLY ALWAYS WANTED !!!! I DO IT MY SELF,
WHY!!!!!! BECAUSE I CAN, CAN YOU?????

Posted Image


#10 Cryptkeeper

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Posted 23 April 2007 - 12:05 AM

so if I'm useing 20rnd mags from FBMG(3 usa parts) all i have to do is change out 1 item on the list (like the hand guards) to a standard s 308 skeleton stack tobe legal?

Edited by Cryptkeeper, 23 April 2007 - 12:16 AM.


#11 busy_squirrel

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Posted 23 April 2007 - 02:35 AM

Depends how old your FBMG mags are. Older ones have an imported follower I believe, so only 2 US parts. :haha:

That was why I thought the .40 would suffice, with normal, cheaper loads for everyday gunfights and the only need for the 200 grain hardcast loads would be bears, biker gangs, and mimes.


#12 Cryptkeeper

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Posted 23 April 2007 - 10:38 AM

ill be useing the newer mags that has a 3 count

#13 5Adam

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Posted 09 May 2007 - 02:29 PM

ill be useing the newer mags that has a 3 count


Sorry for the rookie question, but is converting a Saiga converting it from a "sporter" back to a "military" style rifle?
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#14 tritium

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Posted 09 May 2007 - 04:36 PM

Sorry for the rookie question, but is converting a Saiga converting it from a "sporter" back to a "military" style rifle?


Main point of conversion is moving the trigger group forward and adding a pistol grip, so yes, you are changing it to more of a military style.
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#15 Archael

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 01:22 PM

I've always been under the impression that regardless of how many american aprts there are in a magazine it's still 1 part.. the magazine unless they are counting the three parts of the magazine as three imported parts... which would bring the list of required parts up even higher... you dont' get compatible by adding US parts you have to replace import parts with US parts correct?

#16 Juggernaut

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 01:24 PM

Floor plate, body and follower.
3 parts as far as I know

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#17 Navy87Guy

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Posted 22 June 2007 - 03:44 PM

I've always been under the impression that regardless of how many american aprts there are in a magazine it's still 1 part.. the magazine unless they are counting the three parts of the magazine as three imported parts... which would bring the list of required parts up even higher... you dont' get compatible by adding US parts you have to replace import parts with US parts correct?


No, that's incorrect.

Here are the 16 countable parts of an AK-47 style rifle under 18 USC 922R:

(1) Receiver
(2) Barrel
(3) Trunnion
(4) Muzzle attachments(flash hiders, brakes, barrel extensions, barrel nuts)*
(5) Bolt
(6) Bolt carrier
(7) Gas piston
(8) Trigger
(9) Hammer
(10) Disconnecter
(11) Buttstock
(12) Pistol grip
(13) Forearm handguards
(14) Magazine body
(15) Follower
(16) Floorplate

A stock Saiga sporter does not have a pistol grip (12) or a muzzle device (4), so that brings the total parts count to 14. Note that includes the three magazine parts (14, 15 and 16)

So if you take a foreign magazine and replace the follower and the floor plate, you get 2 US parts out of it.

Jim

Edited by Navy87Guy, 22 June 2007 - 03:45 PM.

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#18 TTR

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Posted 10 May 2008 - 11:45 PM

I have a stock Saiga 12. I'm not moving the trigger forward for now and I ordered the $199.00 USA made Tromax folding stock and pistol grip. So this means I am removing the Russian butt stock. I am also removing the Russian screw on choke and installing a USA made shark brake. OK, so with using the USA made 10 round mag what else do I need to do to be compliant?
Thanks
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