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To prohibit citizens from owning the FN FiveseveN or any 5.7 x 28mm SS190 and SS192 cartridges, and


`© any other handgun that uses armor piercing ammunition.


It don't think the bill actually defines armor piercing except referencing "minimum standards for LE use determined by AG".


The body armor standards are downright awful and at least historically, based on terrible testing standards.


This bill authorizes further testing to determine which calibers would be considered "armor piercing". In time, I have no doubt that the government would find a way to change both the "minimum standards" and the caliber testing circumstances until anything they fell like banning gets banned with clause © up there.


This is another one to watch and fight --

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IMO armor piercing as a definition should include only those bullets specifically designed for enhanced armor penetration, I.E. teflon jacketed bullets, tungsten carbide core rounds, etc. It should include traditional pistol and shotgun ammunition only as a lot of commercial/surplus rifle calibers and many high velocity pistol calibers have the ability to defeat most body armor without trauma plates as it is.


Really, I think citizens should have the right to own whatever the government or LEO's can use, but that sure as hell will never happen. Bullets can kill...they can ban what they want but that'll never change.


What the hell kind of criminal is going to use a $1000 pistol anyway?

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Sorry about the link, seem to be having issues w/ the URL's Thomas is generating. Here's the bill summary page.





Here's the current definition of "Armor Piercing". The definition was changed with the 1994 "crime bill", but I'm pretty sure so-called armor piercing rounds for handguns have been banned for longer. I don't like them being banned, but just the same, this definition isn't open to political BS like the attorney general's opinion on "minimum LE body armor standards" are. It looks to me like 1784 would replace this standard with a new one.



The definition of AP ammo is at 18 USC 921(a)(17):

"(B) The term `armor piercing ammunition' means-


(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and

which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other

substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass,

bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or


(ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and

intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25

percent of the total weight of the projectile.

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That's fine. I'll just go for the head.


No, it's not fine. We shouldn't have to go for the head. It is our God-given right to shoot for the chest.


Seriously, this is too wide-open for interpretation by some ignorant or ill-minded schmuck. I think this ranks as one of the Top Five Worst Gun Laws of May 2007. Maybe even of all 2007. :unsure:


On the other hand, it is much easier to hide/bury illegal ammunition than an illegal rifle/shotgun.

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You boys better be fighting this one with all you've got! Vectors Arms, Olympia and others make a pistol in both the .223 and the .308 calibers. That would effectively knock us out of ANY ammo, surplus or otherwise for those rifles because it is also a psitol ammo. Same damn thing happened to the PS-90 owners because the FiveSeven pistol uses the same ammo. Not your ox getting gored? Think again.

Edited by 1911
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