Jump to content

Are saiga 20ga's worth buying


Recommended Posts

Hi I recently seen a saiga 20ga on gunbroker.com and I like the way it looks. I have been browsing the internet and have been hearing nothing but good reveiws on the reliability of the saiga 12, so i figure the 20ga can only be as good. So when I went down to my local gun store for the price on one, the owner said don't buy one there nothing but junk do to excessive jambing, and there made very cheap. Is this true, because i have been reading coments buy other people on this site saying they jam like crazy to. Could the jambing be do to using the wrong mag for the size shell, and or improper gas setting 1 for low powered shells and 2 for magnum's. Another thing, if there not junk how much do the usualy go for for th 19". :dollar:

Link to post
Share on other sites

He's right, don't buy them, they are crap! :rolleyes:

I think they're great, get 'em tuned in & you're good to go.

These ran about $199 each when Dunham's was closing them out.

Probably $350ish now.

 

post-2093-1180150135_thumb.jpg

 

post-2093-1180150178_thumb.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites
He's right, don't buy them, they are crap! :rolleyes:

I think they're great, get 'em tuned in & you're good to go.

These ran about $199 each when Dunham's was closing them out.

Probably $350ish now.

 

post-2093-1180150135_thumb.jpg

 

post-2093-1180150178_thumb.jpg

 

What do you mean by geting them tuned in?. Does tuning it in consist of puting about 200 rounds through the gun to break it in, or by modifying the gas ports etc. Also i have another ? how do you figure out if you got the backwards gas setting selector, do you have to take it all apart to see what way the ports face. I thing if i get a s20 most likley i will only be shooting Remington 3" nitro mag 1 1/4 oz high brass, Or S&B 3" magnum low Brass, and maybe the ocasional 2 3/4 game loads. So if i set the gas seting to the correct seting for mags, what ever that may be, it should shoot fine right. :killer:

Link to post
Share on other sites

The problems that people have with the s20's are mainly with cycling with low payload shells (ie cheapo practice ones), and the feed angle of the magazines to the chamber when using 2.75 in shells in 3 in mags. Both of these can be improved upon.

 

There are some wedges that you can make if you don't reload your own 3 in shotty shells to have the 3 in mags function reliably with the cheapo shells. Check the site for some posts about that. The 3 in mags are generally what you'll find in the aftermarket here in the US.

 

The issue with gas settings can easily be improved upon by using an 8-10 lb 1911 45 pistol recoil spring instead of the stock spring. The new spring allows the bolt to move quick enough to have a greater likelyhood to cycle all shells, and even lessens the feed angle issues by giving the shells some more oomph when entering the chamber (less likely to hang up due to slight misalignments). Polishing the bottom of the bolt, and top of the hammer where they contact each other during the "reset" of the trigger also improves things a bit by lowering friction during the cycling. The gas port enlargement that many people do isn't really necessary in my estimation (try the other things first as they are far less involved).

 

I'd say they are worth buying, as the price is generally less than an S12. It's tough to have full confidence in any new gun until it's at least 99% reliable, and with so many that are close to that from the store, a little tweaking is uncharted ground for many people. The result is worth it however, since it's really about the only 20 gauge mag fed shotty you will be able to find. Personally, I like the 20 as much as the 12. If you reload your own shells, then you will appreciate the "range" of the 20 in that it is a good choice for small stuff like birds, rabbits, and squirrels, and light in the field when hunting. At the same time the 3 in shells have enough wallop to perform deer and self defense duties.

 

If you look at the S12 board, you will see that they have some issues as well. Both are sweet tools once they get in tip top shape.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I polished the FCG in mine, but the real performance upgrade to use 2 3/4" ammo in mine was opening the ports and break-in. Funny thing was on one of the S-20's I got had the ports enlarged already. It was an EAA reworked gun. I've since applied that same mod to any S-20 I work on. (0.093" on all 3)

 

If you plan on using 3" ammo, you won't need to touch a thing. I like having the option of using any ammo I want. :up:

Link to post
Share on other sites

a guy at fun show a dealer even. said he was reading a article in a gun mag that said siaga was best shotty money could buy. and was wondering were he could get one. this was in a main stream mag not from us who know the words getting out better buy now. :devil:

Edited by devin_c1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Some folks claim that the Saiga's are finicky eaters, is that as a result of mag problems of gun feeding problems?

 

One guy claimed that the worst shells known to man are the Winchester Universal "Promo" ammo that Wally World sells. I currently have about 8 cases of that exact stuff sitting on the floor of my reloading room. My other 20ga (Remington 1100) eats the Winchester stuff like candy and has never jammed with the stuff. Can the Saiga be made to work reliably with the Winchester crap?

Link to post
Share on other sites

thats too funny mine run just the other way around my 1100 wont cycle cheap light loads. my siaga never misses except 2 ftfs when i first got my new 10 rnds after a few times using 10s no problems. of course mine r 12ga not 20ga. dinzag is the man when tuning 20s hell know what u can do did u try what he suggested in previouse post.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I had the new 19" 20 ga out today for the first time with 2 boxes of Winchester Universal (promo ammo). The first 5 shells failed to eject (stovepiped) and I had to pull them the rest of the way out with my fingers. After that it started to eject intermittantly and was 90% functional by the first 25 shells. It continued 90% functional and fed perfectly out of the 5 and 10 rd magazines (after a homebuilt follower mod as described on this board) through the second box of shells.

 

For next time I intend to take a few lighter recoil springs and see if it can be made to function 100% with the promo ammo, or if I will need to enlarge the ports to achieve 100%.

 

Thanks for all of the help and info.

 

Leo

Link to post
Share on other sites

Glad to hear the Cobra wedges saved yet another...

It will also help a lot if you run a bunch of heavy loads thru it. Get the heaviest thing you can find and beat the hell out of it. It likes that. ;)

Also it doesn't hurt to store it with the bolt locked back for awhile. Part of the "break in period" is actually breaking in the spring.

Another thing that seems to help mine is the wooden AK furniture. It's heavier.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Being a 1911 pattern gun junkie, I have just about every recoil spring weight that Woolf makes for a 1911 from about 7 lbs to 18 lbs.

 

The stock recoil springs in the saiga measure out to be about 16-18 lbs springs. I replaced one of the springs with an 11lb spring for the next outing. Since I was already getting pretty close to 100% with the heavy spring, the lighter spring should allow the gun to cycle 100% with the wimpy Winchester Universal promo loads.

 

Thanks again.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I think they are worth every penny. I'm amazed that more people aren't choosing the 20 gauge. I've got plenty of experience behind a 12 gauge. For years I owned a Franchi Law 12. At the time when I bought it it was said to be the fastest semi-auto shotgun. The claim was eight rounds down range in 2.3 seconds. I tried this kind of speed shooting many times and I can tell you that after the first round, or maybe even the second, point of aim was no longer relevant. At that point you are holding on for dear life and accuracy is no longer a reality. I'm a big guy and that kind of shooting would back me up five to ten feet.

 

On the other hand, from my experience with 20 gauge, the round is much more suitable for follow-up shot accuracy and control with a lethality that doesn't pale in comparison to the the 12 gauge. The Saiga was developed for tactical police and military use (if I recall correctly) so I would think that control and second shot capability might be a bit more high in desirability than a full bore 12 gauge. Overall I've got to imagine that the 20 gauge has to be more desirable than the volume of traffic on the topic at this forum would indicate, especially for tactical use.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I still have two converted Saigas, one S12 and one S20. The only difference is the Polychoke on the -20 (to the factory chokes on the -12). Same stock, grip, trigger, and idiot running the mill...they are set up with the same "bits."

 

Shooting both with 10 round mags (factory 20s and Frankenmag 12's (this was 17 months ago before I got run out of Texas on a rail, pre-AGP ;) ), the -20 felt more like a rifle than a shotgun. Snappy, fast, back on target like a tuned Major rifle instead of a shotgun. I (hanging head in shame) like the 20 better.

 

However, as a competition guy, I tune my gun using different shot for different stages. Easy to do with a 12 (I usually run 3 3/4 dram 7 1/2, but my ammo bag always has everything from max dram 1 1/8 slugs to 4, 6, and 9 shot), harder with the 20. I usually just have one ounce max dram slugs and S&B heavy 6's for the 20. More choke in that game ;)

 

Anyway, all that boils down to...yes, you fool, buy one. You need one for the collection anyway :angel:

 

 

 

Alex

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Chatbox

    Load More
    You don't have permission to chat.
×
×
  • Create New...