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sKott's Saiga 12-C Conversion


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Thanks for all your photos, and experience sKott. It helped me greatly to buck up and do it myself. I don't think I'm gonna ship most of my AK's off to other people to build. I see where the time comes in. But other than welding. It was awesome doing it myself.

 

I'm shipping my S-12 off to Elk River tommorrow morning!

 

Getting her welded, and riveted. Can't wait to get her back!

 

I can't wait to see the picts...

 

Is there chrome pics yet?

 

I slid a chrome carrier from one of my AK's in there just to look and that's a LOT of chrome.

 

I kinda like it black. So for the time being, I'll just moly-res the balance of the parts to match.

 

I did get a hold of some Brownells lacquer stix and I whited the SN and some of the logos.

P1060520.jpg

P1060890.jpg

I really like it on the Gas Plug "Red of Hot Loads"

 

Besides I'm in the middle of an FAL build that is sucking all of my gun budget. I can always plate it later but I need to finish this FAL quickly.

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Riveted trigger guard and an AK100 folder.... clearly superior and makes Mikhail smile.

sKott - Since this thread has been resurrected from the dead, I thought I should credit you with inspiration for my build.   For everyone else's information, one of the hardest aspects of this build

Very Nice!   What model did you start with? And did you do the work on it?   What mags do you use, and also which would be the best to get?   I like the idea of wood on this! Is there any avail

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Exceptional conversion!! :up:

 

I didn't see any mention to the methoid used to remove the import markings. Were they welded over then ground down, or did you just sand/grind them out? Those import marks were the one thing keeping me from daring to do a conversion like this myself. I was considering the triangular stock, but yours looks great too.

 

Do those solid stocks come in OD green, do you know?

 

 

Thanks for posting this.

 

 

Corbin

 

I was really lucky in this respect. My import marks just kissed the surface and most came off after buffing the welds and cleaning up the cuts. If the marks were deep I would have had it welded and ground down.

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  • 1 year later...
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  • 1 year later...

Hey Shannon. Your PM box is full.

 

Do you still have any side folder latches for sale? I bought a ver. 030 and want to add a polymer side folder from K-VAR to it. I may pick up a railed gas block for it as well.

 

 

Also, do you guys have any input on who makes the best 10 hole flash hider replica?

 

 

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Hey Shannon. Your PM box is full.

 

Do you still have any side folder latches for sale? I bought a ver. 030 and want to add a polymer side folder from K-VAR to it. I may pick up a railed gas block for it as well.

 

 

Also, do you guys have any input on who makes the best 10 hole flash hider replica?

 

I think cnc warrior makes a fairly close copy

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  • 1 year later...
After a good aluminum oxide blast and a MEK bath The Saiga 12 was ready for a new coating. For this I chose the Black Flat Thermal Cure Norrell Moly Resin.

This stuff works great, easy to apply and really looks like a professional finish. Trust me, its not my skill with an airbrush - Ive never used one until now.

 

P1050216.jpg

 

P1050220.jpg

 

P1050219.jpg

 

P1050221.jpg

 

Last thing to complete is to Hard Chrome Plate the Bolt carrier, Hinge Pin and Folding stock lock.

 

sKott

Excellent write-up and detailed craftsmanship! Makes one want to a DIY build. I'm curious about what is cost do this project. Could you give a rough estimate of what was spent in making this superior conversion? Besides the time involved, because I know the time was well spent and work planned out in advance. Also, what would you guess the difference to building vs. buying would be?

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Could you give a rough estimate of what was spent in making this superior conversion? Besides the time involved, because I know the time was well spent and work planned out in advance. Also, what would you guess the difference to building vs. buying would be?

 

Cost is one thing, availability is another. You'll have to do your own leg work on this...

 

materials

  • Ak 100 folding stock, folding mechanism, retaining pin = rusmilitary
  • grip, trigger guard, trigger = CSS

I'm struggling with why you think this is a superior conversion? Is it that sexy folder with that shinny button?

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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Could you give a rough estimate of what was spent in making this superior conversion? Besides the time involved, because I know the time was well spent and work planned out in advance. Also, what would you guess the difference to building vs. buying would be?

 

Cost is one thing, availability is another. You'll have to do your own leg work on this...

 

materials

  • Ak 100 folding stock, folding mechanism, retaining pin = rusmilitary
  • handguard, trigger guard, trigger = CSS

I'm struggling with why you think this is a superior conversion? Is it that sexy folder with that shinny button?

Riveted trigger guard and an AK100 folder.... clearly superior and makes Mikhail smile.

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Riveted trigger guard and an AK100 folder.... clearly superior and makes Mikhail smile.

 

That stock is sure sexy but superior to what? Don't get me wrong, I like it as well. But it needs to be explained to SaigaNW that for the cost of materials and the amount of cutting that needs to be done on the receiver there maybe better options out there. I hope he read the whole post and understands what "cutting the tang" or "latch set" means.

 

How many of us got into S-12's because "the sexy look" it gave off in when in the AK configuration? Then after we get to buying we find out it's not so easy or cheap for that matter. This dude is on the market for a shotty. At this moment he doesn't need to be concerned with the stock configuration. If he want's an "AK looking" shotgun he needs to be more concerned with the plug/hand guard setup.

 

I gotta say that if "superiority" is akin to "looks" then that factory forearm is the Achilles heal to that build...

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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Riveted trigger guard and an AK100 folder.... clearly superior and makes Mikhail smile.

 

That stock is sure sexy but superior to what? Don't get me wrong, I like it as well. But it needs to be explained to SaigaNW that for the cost of materials and the amount of cutting that needs to be done on the receiver there maybe better options out there. I hope he read the whole post and understands what "cutting the tang" or "retaining ping" means.

 

How many of us got into S-12's because "the sexy look" it gave off in when in the AK configuration? Then after we get to buying we find out it's not so easy or cheap for that matter. This dude is on the market for a shotty. At this moment he doesn't need to be concerned with the stock configuration. If he want's an "AK looking" shotgun he need to be more concerned with the plug/hand guard setup.

 

I gotta say that if "superiority" is akin to "looks" then that factory forearm is the Achilles heal to that build...

Well, it looks like a 'real' 12C, and the minimalist design is simple = less to go wrong. And the rivets and the AK100 folder give the bare bones military look. I've noticed shooting other rifles that have folding stocks seem to have play in them when firing, and I would want a sturdier stock. And I DO like shiney buttons!

 

Is CSS a company?

 

I did do some more searching around on some auctions sites and did find one for sale. I wonder what it's worth? And if I could build one for less... What do you think 'drifter?

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CSS is Carolina Shooters Supply

 

rusmilitary is a confusing site, click on "future stock update" for the good stuff.

 

SaigaNW: Dude we're rowing the same boat together. I ordered a build from a reputable custom shop: 2k and 18 months later it still hasn't shown up! I've read a lot in that time. After all the panic buying I got nervous that my build wouldn't show before a ban. So to prevent myself from being fucked twice I purchased a sporter configuration from Legion. After all the reading my conclusion is most of the work that you'll want done can be performed by you in your own garage or kitchen for that matter.

 

For me it's like dip netting for salmon in Alaska. I didn't appreciate the taste of fish until I went out and put in the work myself. Now salmon is a staple in our family diet.

 

If you have the knack for research, time, and most importantly patience to get it right then buy a sporter and configure away! I personally love that stock setup but I am leaning towards a more traditional all wood stock/hand guard configuration.

 

As for that 2k build, that fucker is going to auction or put up on here for the taking...

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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Back from the dead again...

I finished up this build in 2008.

My goal for this build was to make a S12C at a time when the correct parts were next to impossible to find.

The rear trunnion, front latch parts and 10 slot flash hider are Russian and were ordered from rus military.

To get the correct trigger guard I had to modify virgin Bulgarian parts (I have a write up on this on here somewhere).

I still remember cutting the receiver with a hacksaw thinking "if I cut this wrong I'm screwed!!!"

The S12C conversion is still my favorite build and of all my builds It gets shot the most.

 

Great learning experience. Glad people still use it for reference.

And yes, I think I made Mikhail smile.

 

sKott

Edited by sKott
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Back from the dead again...

I finished up this build in 2008.

My goal for this build was to make a S12C at a time when the correct parts were next to impossible to find.

The rear trunnion, front latch parts and 10 slot flash hider are Russian and were ordered from rus military.

To get the correct trigger guard I had to modify virgin Bulgarian parts (I have a write up on this on here somewhere).

I still remember cutting the receiver with a hacksaw thinking "if I cut this wrong I'm screwed!!!"

The S12C conversion is still my favorite build and of all my builds It gets shot the most.

 

Great learning experience. Glad people still use it for reference.

And yes, I think I made Mikhail smile.

 

sKott

Hey sKott,

 

I've always liked the 12C, but they are hard to find and pricey. But your build looks like the way to make it a possibility. BTW, my first post to this forum was to this thread and brought me out of lurker status! cool.png

 

I'm thinking of doing this build. Is there anything that you would do different with todays available parts?

 

SaigaNW

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Not really.

Stuff would just be easier to find.

K-Var has the rear stock and trunnion.

DPH has a good copy of the flash hider.

The retainer plate for the S12 became a stocking item about 3 weeks after I posted the Picts of the standard one I modified.

Ak builder has front latch parts and the trigger guard sets (although the trigger guards they offer need to be modified to be astetically correct).

 

I guess the only thing I would have done differently is not worried about the pistol grip plate. The length of the plate limits you on the grip you can use. ( I can't use the modern Russian grip or MD Arms Molot grip because the grip base is too long for the plate). If you want the larger grip I think AK builder has longer plates for that application.

 

Other than that I wish I would have bought 7 more 8 rounders before the price went through the roof!!!

 

sKott

 

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It seems the time to just get started in this hobby is going to be very expensive even for a fairly mild build. Just a stock S12 price is rising every minute. Does it make a difference which model to start with?

 

And the mag prices are ridiculous - and they are plastic! Are there any metal mags out there somewhere?

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Not sure what a new S12 now (mine was $439 shipped from Gilbert's). But if I were to get another start with an IZ-109 (19" with bead sight). If you can pick one of those up with the factory LRBHO installed then that would be better.

 

Yes the mag prices are redicilous. I think I paid around $100 each for ny 8 rounders. I think I saw some on Gunbroker for $450...Crazy.

 

sKott

 

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sKott - Since this thread has been resurrected from the dead, I thought I should credit you with inspiration for my build.

 

For everyone else's information, one of the hardest aspects of this build is the rivets. There are press kits available for the AK, but I am not sure if they work with the Saiga 12 or the Saiga 100 series for that matter. I built my own fixture and used an air hammer. Riveting was the hardest for me because I had access to a mill for the receiver and trunnion modifications. Good tools make all the difference I suppose.

 

Another word of caution: If you end up finding an Arsenal US made folding stock with the 4.5 mm pin, it will require additional modification. The plastic buttstock needs to have material removed near the catch for the front latch. Evl should know a thing or two about this.

 

While the installation of the Russian folding stock can be a major PITA, the reward is even greater. The Russian polymer or triangle are the most solid folding stocks I have come across.

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C'ish.... with subtle improvements.

 

attachicon.gifevl 16.jpg

attachicon.gifevl 18.jpg

attachicon.gifevl 15.jpg

attachicon.gifevl 11.jpg

 

This is the one I used in the 100, 200, and 300 round dump videos.

Very Nice!

 

What model did you start with? And did you do the work on it?

 

What mags do you use, and also which would be the best to get?

 

CSS is Carolina Shooters Supply

 

rusmilitary is a confusing site, click on "future stock update" for the good stuff.

 

SaigaNW: Dude we're rowing the same boat together. I ordered a build from a reputable custom shop: 2k and 18 months later it still hasn't shown up! I've read a lot in that time. After all the panic buying I got nervous that my build wouldn't show before a ban. So to prevent myself from being fucked twice I purchased a sporter configuration from Legion. After all the reading my conclusion is most of the work that you'll want done can be performed by you in your own garage or kitchen for that matter.

 

For me it's like dip netting for salmon in Alaska. I didn't appreciate the taste of fish until I went out and put in the work myself. Now salmon is a staple in our family diet.

 

If you have the knack for research, time, and most importantly patience to get it right then buy a sporter and configure away! I personally love that stock setup but I am leaning towards a more traditional all wood stock/hand guard configuration.

 

As for that 2k build, that fucker is going to auction or put up on here for the taking...

I like the idea of wood on this! Is there any available sets that fit, or can be modified to fit?

 

Sorry about the double quote - I'm still a Newbie afterall! rolleyes.gif

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I like the idea of wood on this! Is there any available sets that fit, or can be modified to fit?

 

I'm posting two pictures off of Ironwood Designs.website. I will probably purchase my stock set through them. I want you to pay attention to the particular look created by the 2 different site block/tube assemblies. Which model you end up purchasing will play directly into which look you will achieve. Getting a standard Iz.109 into a more traditional look can be done but it's expensive. Check out Dinzag Arms for that...

 

Traditional AK handguard setup. Easily obtained now by purchasing a Legion model.

post-35052-0-75704700-1359100695.jpg

 

Standard Saiga gas assembly.found on sporter Iz-109's

post-35052-0-54371400-1359101119.jpg

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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sKott - Since this thread has been resurrected from the dead, I thought I should credit you with inspiration for my build.

 

For everyone else's information, one of the hardest aspects of this build is the rivets. There are press kits available for the AK, but I am not sure if they work with the Saiga 12 or the Saiga 100 series for that matter. I built my own fixture and used an air hammer. Riveting was the hardest for me because I had access to a mill for the receiver and trunnion modifications. Good tools make all the difference I suppose.

 

Another word of caution: If you end up finding an Arsenal US made folding stock with the 4.5 mm pin, it will require additional modification. The plastic buttstock needs to have material removed near the catch for the front latch. Evl should know a thing or two about this.

 

While the installation of the Russian folding stock can be a major PITA, the reward is even greater. The Russian polymer or triangle are the most solid folding stocks I have come across.

+1 on all points, especially the "inspiration" ;) Thank you, sKott!

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C'ish.... with subtle improvements.

 

attachicon.gifevl 16.jpg

attachicon.gifevl 18.jpg

attachicon.gifevl 15.jpg

attachicon.gifevl 11.jpg

 

This is the one I used in the 100, 200, and 300 round dump videos.

Very Nice!

 

What model did you start with? IZ-109 And did you do the work on it? I did everything except press the rivets on the folding rear block. I wasn't set up for it yet then. I do 100% of the work now, on everything.

 

What mags do you use, and also which would be the best to get?

I don't have experience with all Saiga 12 mags, but there are mags that I have experience with and prefer. I prefer Russian 5 and 8 round mags, SGM mags, and MD-20 drums.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Sorry to necro this but what an outstanding thread...

Everything I wanted to know even some sources to try. Just wonder what it will cost for the stock, latch, trunnion, and folding mechanism, pluss all the pro smithing work I need, in 2013eyes_droped.gif

 

A couple years ago I was creaming for this guy on Warriortalk's RJ custom S-12C (18" counting perm. attached 10 slot), IIRC was 2700. I knew it was a hell of a deal, even then. This shotgun will be my most expensive weapon even if I win the lotto and get a Scar 17. But has been a dream since 99.

Badass and the only western thing about it besides minium compliant clones of Russian parts, might be Cerakote in Burnt Bronze. Why not. Or NP-3. 14k plating would cost less than this stuff and having a Saiga-specialized gunsmith put it on, but worth it. I just dig authenticity and factory stock especially when those are otherwise forbidden.

Edited by Steppe Sweeper
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Just wonder what it will cost for the stock, latch, trunnion, and folding mechanism, pluss all the pro smithing work I need, in 2013eyes_droped.gif

 

First find the parts then find a gunsmith. I am not sure of the odds in finding a smith with the parts in hand willing to do it cheaply. If you find one, do tell! Good start for the parts are at rusmilitary. I'll save you the time of looking as they are currently "out of stock" and not taking any preorders.

 

Update: You can preorder the stock and butt pad in batch 9. You'll need the complete folding action kit which looks like it will be available to preorder in batch 10. Also understand that his ETA times keep getting pushed back on a monthly basis.

Edited by HighPlainsDrifter
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  • 5 months later...

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