308 as a mountain rifle

[netpackrat 566]

Seems like you know a lot about shoving shit up your ass......I think your on the wrong forum

 

No, that's a standard bear joke... As in "don't forget to file down the front sight on your revolver so it won't hurt as much when the bear shoves it up your ass." I'm surprised I forgot to use it in my initial reply.

[leadslinger 37]

motoppilot1 i am with you. It took me totally by surprise. excellent job shaneman153a too funny.

Good luck drinking beer stay safe. Still laughing

 

 

If you do take the .308, use a low cap mag and no scope. You want to make the profile as slim and snag-free as possible so it doesn't hurt as much when the bear shoves it up your ass.

i was reading all intent until i came to the last part

[Bucc 0]

[shaneman153a 39]

.......

 

Did I miss the trolling!!!!???? Awwwwww

 

That is a pretty old one, realistically, I think a couple .308 rounds would do fine against pretty much anything living.

 

edit: Drinking beer, sorry didn't realize you were the OP, sorry to hijack the thread, all in good fun chap.

Edited February 21, 2008 by shaneman153a

[mr. fudd 0]

Geez guys....leather up, nine pounds ain't that much to lug around.

You dudes all sound like you were in the army or something

 

Nine pounds is nothing to pack around if you're bear hunting, but if you're backpacking with no intention of hunting, it's a huge amount of weight that could be better used for other things.

[Montana3gunner 13]

Geez guys....leather up, nine pounds ain't that much to lug around.

You dudes all sound like you were in the army or something

 

Nine pounds is nothing to pack around if you're bear hunting, but if you're backpacking with no intention of hunting, it's a huge amount of weight that could be better used for other things.

 

Sorry I'm getting to this post late. Like a couple on this thread I live in Montana (have most of my life) and spend as much time in the mountains as possible.

 

First, where are you hiking and when? Location and time of the year have a big impact on bear safety. Although Grizzlies have expanded their range recently (shit they sometimes range as far South as the divide West of Helena, and thus are only 30 miles from my house), there are still only limited places you need to worry about Grizzlies. Two of the most prominent are Glacier and Yellowstone, and you damn sure won't be hauling your Saiga in there...guns are quite verboten.

 

I love these debates about which gun to take for bear defense. I know a guy who killed a bear with a 9mm once, and I know another guy who shot a Griz up on the divide (back in the 40's when you could still hunt them) in the heart at 100y with an .30-06 and had the bear charge them despite the hole they found in his heart. There's really no right answer, but as big a gun as you're good with is general wisdom.

 

My best advice -

 

1) it is highly unlikely that you'll see a bear. Consider yourself quite lucky if you do, they are fantastic creatures. We just hope it's in the right situation. I've backpacked all over this State, including EVERY long distance AND short distance trip in Glacier and somewhere around 1/2 of the "Bob"'s trails (the Bob is damn big). I've seen very few bears in all my years, and only a couple have been at close range, although those were damn scary for a few minutes. It's still more likely that you'll be struck by lightning while in MT, and many more times likely that you'll be injured or killed in a fall of some kind.

 

2) The stories you hear about bear agility and speed are no joke. Bears can reach a top speed of 35mph in as little as 20 yards...and I've seen them do it on very rough terrain. Whatever you have for protection had better be easily accessable, and you'd better be good with it.

 

3) Remember that a good portion of your risk for a bad bear encounter will be at night. 3am in your tent is where I'd much rather have a pistola. They are easier to wield and most bear "experts" will tell you to stay inside the tent. "most" bears seem to perceive the tent as a barrier that they do not test and jumping out of one has the risk of scaring the bear thus inducing a charge. If a bear does come into your tent at night, blaze away until that bastard is dead. It's most likely a "predatory" bear. I've had Grizzlies just outside my tent at night (Oct of 92, Red Eagle Lake, Glacier Nat. Park. Yes, I had to bury my underwear the next day). That is some scary shit.

 

4) Each to his own in terms of your pack weight - it's your back, hips, and feet. Personnally, I have a lot more fun when I pack with a light pack, and in MT the odds of a bad bear situation is extremely low. For those reasons I carry a Taurus Tracker .44mag. I shoot at least 400 rounds a year through it practicing. I run drills that are (as best as I can do) simulate bear defense situations. I load it with tougher than crap solids - in the 240 grain range, but only because I haven't found a 300 grainer that the Taurus likes. And yes, I agree that depending, the .44 may not be enough, but then anything less than a crew served weapon might be a little light....

 

Having been to AK a couple of times to fish, if I lived there I'd carry exactly the brush rifle Netpack suggests. I felt pretty puny with my little .44. I just don't personnaly find it neccessary here. You'd absolutely find plenty of experienced people here in MT that hike with their 12ga loaded with slugs, or their big bore bear gun. Just my humble opinion.

 

Finally, it's a whole lot easier to... shall we say.. "carry" a pistol into an area where guns are...shall we say...not exactly allowed. Keep in mind that if you do get caught with a gun one of the parks, it's likely that the rangers will confiscate it, fine the crap out of you, and it's even possible (although not likely, depends on the sitch) you'll visit the local big house.

 

If you let me know where you are planning on hiking, I can give you much better local intel. You can PM me too.

[Montana3gunner 13]

I did think of one more thing... for whatever reason (and there are plenty of theories as to why), last year bear attacks in MT were WAY up although I don't remember the exact number we had. Most survived, with varying degrees of injury.

Edited February 23, 2008 by Montana3gunner

[ClickClickD'oh 1]

My dangerous game protection/ out in the wilderness gun is a Marlin 1895G in .45/70 backed up by a hot loaded .45lc revolver. I know guys that use pump shoties with slugs. Remember, you can't bring too much bullet to a bear fight.

[uncle jerky 1]

My dangerous game protection/ out in the wilderness gun is a Marlin 1895G in .45/70 backed up by a hot loaded .45lc revolver. I know guys that use pump shoties with slugs. Remember, you can't bring too much bullet to a bear fight.

 

I agree with the 45/70 Guidegun suggestion. I owned one in the 18" barrell and with open sights,it is one of the easiest handling,quick shouldering,lightweight guns that I have ever used. You can carry it out in the field all day long and not get tired. For me the sidearm would be a 44 magnum double action, 2" or 4" revolver on a hip holster, and don't forget,a long handled,strong,sharp quality steel hunting knife and bear spray.

[kahrak 2]

Here's my anti-grizzly combo for hiking/camping (modded Marlin Guide Gun in .45/70 and S&W Mountain Gun in .44 Mag.):

 

 

 

 

 

Here's a picture of the bullets I'm loading up for the Guide Gun (460 gr. hardcast from Cast Performance) next to a loaded .40 S&W round for size comparison:

 

 

 

 

 

I'd have to agree that .308 is on the weak side, you at least want one of the .30 cal magnums in a rifle against grizzlies. The Marlin Guide Guns are one of the best combinations of weight (slightly over 7 lbs), power, and compact size in a rifle for bear protection. A few 400+ grain bullets in the right places will break down a charging bear real fast. I carry mine on a Kifaru "Gun Bearer" which allows the rifle to be brought into action a lot quicker than when slung on the shoulder. Up here in Alaska, pretty much anywhere you go is in bear country, much less so in the lower 48 but I'd still rather go prepared for the worst than become a pile of bear crap.

[Havoc308 3]

After I had a foster slug go splat on the shoulder of a large hog and fragment like crazy, I just don't trust them any more. I started using Dixie Slug Terminators, now nothing runs away. With 730gn of hard cast lead at 1200fps it replicates the old British black powder paradox load. Here is a link to what a Terminator can do: Terminator vs Angus Bull 28" of penetration of heavy muscle and bone. I wouldn't feel undergunned in bear country with these. Now if we could get a S12 with a fully rifled barrel......

[Vultite 57]

yea, best thing i got for a bear gun is a .357 mag outfitted with 200 grain monsters....i'm looking into a .460 or 500 SW, i wonder if there is a rifle type gun to shoot the 500 SW? hrm, or i could just go cheap and get a 8 gauge or 10 gauge

 

 

EDIT: if you got some major $$, get a nitro express 700 ...1000 grain bullets, last box i saw sold for 382.99 for **5** rounds!!

Edited March 2, 2008 by Vultite

[SOPMOD 254]

If you do take the .308, use a low cap mag and no scope. You want to make the profile as slim and snag-free as possible so it doesn't hurt as much when the bear shoves it up your ass.

 

 

"You want to make the profile as slim and snag-free as possible so it doesn't hurt as much when the bear shoves it up your ass"

 

ROTFLMAO!!!

[royke 0]

.......

/quote

Too bad the weapon I would want against one of those monsters is so heavy and expensive.....if it has to be in the .308 class.... the MG 42...... or a rather larger caliber:rolleyes:

[RangerM9 1]

budget option i'd go with an 870 with slugs, and believe it or not, 12 ga flares as the first round.

 

I've read that a flaming ball smacking a bear in the chest, lighting the fur on fire really scares the shit out of them...

 

that said...if i wanted to make sure i was gonna drop whatever charged me, the 308 sounds good....the 45-70 guide rifle sounds better.

 

I've camped out (unknowingly) in bear country (thought i was out of their range) wiht just my GP-100 (.357). Will not be camping out in that area again with anything less than a 12 ga

[sggrosso 0]

If you do take the .308, use a low cap mag and no scope. You want to make the profile as slim and snag-free as possible so it doesn't hurt as much when the bear shoves it up your ass.

 

 

ROFLMAO-!!!

 

Way to go!~

 

Well said Shaneman

 

"Carry the biggest Caliber long gun you can, then carry the biggest caliber handgun as backup you can. Keep spray as a final option, but keep it with you."

That was the advise from a guide for an Alaska hunt above the Brooks Range for Caribou, land of the polar bear.

He used a Marlin .444 and a Desert Eagle .50AE.(Over ten years ago)

[Oswald2001 0]

I had a professional Alaskan hunting guide tell me once that he suggested a 12 gauge with slugs for bear protection on the trail.

 

Even then, he said, you will need to have a lot of luck on your side.

 

 

 

For a longer shot (if you are hunting), he suggested a 30 06 as the bare (no pun intended) minimum.

Edited April 5, 2008 by Oswald2001

[saigafreake 27]

wild west guns makes a lever action 500s&w 2000 for take down model 1500 for non take down. Thought bout getting one to go with my s&w model 500

[SOPMOD 254]

wild west guns makes a lever action 500s&w 2000 for take down model 1500 for non take down. Thought bout getting one to go with my s&w model 500

 

 

Does having a caliber commonality really matter when you pack an S&W 500? It already weighs as much as some lightweight rifles and doesn't have the beans that a 450 Marlin does.

 

Seriously though,both poachers and game wardens in Africa have taken down charging bull elephants and lions by dumping a magazine from an AKM or an FN/FAL into the critters dome so it's not an impossibility but how many of us are used to carrying a rifle in your paws while hiking and could whip that sucker out and accurately dump 20rds of 308 into a 2ft bobbing and moving circle heading towards you at 30MPH?

 

 

I think a Saiga 12 with a 5rd mag full of Brenneke slugs might be the answer but the minute you prop that sucker up against a tree to take a poop is when the bear will come and you'll wish you had something a little more portable and handy.

 

 

maybe a custom 410 Saiga AOW full of high brass slugs in a shoulder rig?

Edited April 6, 2008 by SOPMOD

[saigafreake 27]

ballistics on the 450 marlin and the 500magnum are about the same out of the same length barrel and with the 500 u can get bullets up to 700 grain. plus it is nice to have commonality between handgun and rifle