AK308_in_AK99709 0 Posted September 23, 2008 Report Share Posted September 23, 2008 Oops!! I guess I am a newbie so I should know that I can't put the 7 of 8 158 grainers into a 4" cup saucer at 500 yards (not meters) last Saturday. No wind. Barometric pressure falling very slowly. The scope does in fact cost some $350 more than the $400 I laid out for the rife.....so.....yup, a Saiga 308-1 will do the trick. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shootist 3 Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 We just finished with a class here taught by a former Spetznas Sniper. We had a heavy population of SVDs and Saigas. We shot out to 500 yards (laser measurement). While I could not get out that far due to scope problems, we had one man shooting a 16" Saiga 308 with a POSP scope and Spanish Surplus (1978!) ammo hitting the 500 yard steel regularly. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fixer 0 Posted October 12, 2008 Report Share Posted October 12, 2008 Perhaps, there is a new contender..... Yeah but where can you get one? I'd like to buy one of those if I can find one... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Oswald2001 0 Posted October 20, 2008 Report Share Posted October 20, 2008 If you are new to long range precision rifles, just get a Savage .308 bolt action. You can fix it up as much as you like, but, it shoots real sweet right out of the box. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigjimcalhoun 0 Posted October 26, 2008 Report Share Posted October 26, 2008 What Oswald said... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted November 5, 2008 Report Share Posted November 5, 2008 Except the OP was interested in SAIGAs, not Savages.................... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted November 9, 2008 Report Share Posted November 9, 2008 ...and he was asking the equivalent of "What's the best diet food? Chicken fried steak or bacon cheese fries?" So? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted November 9, 2008 Report Share Posted November 9, 2008 So stick to the topic! It's MY job to hijack threads! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Oswald2001 0 Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 Except the OP was interested in SAIGAs, not Savages.................... Well, that was my way of saying NO SAIGA is up to being a 500 yard rifle. While a .308 will easy reach 500 yards with a Saiga...or any other .308..., it will not do it with great accuracy. I have shot a Beretta 92 at a torso sized target and hit it at least 80% of the time...all day long. Of course, this was after months of regular shooting at the same spot and I was finely tuned. I couldn't do it today as I am waaaay out of practice. Do I have a 100 yard 92? No. I do not. Just as a .308 Saiga is not a 500 yard rifle, IMO. A lot of Saiga owners are drawn to Saigas because of low price. And Saigas are remarkable bargains. Now...being that the poster appeared to be looking for a '500 yard solution' in a 'budget' rifle...and the fact that 500 yards is not the territory of most semi-autos, especially budget semi-autos...another solution was suggested for consideration. 500 yards...with accuracy...in the 'budget' world...is the world of some bolt action rifles. And Savage rifles are great since they are bargain priced and will easily handle 500 yards...with accuracy. So...I don't consider it a hijack...simply a 'wake-up'. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lonerider 1 Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 500 yards Time to call either artillery or Air Support Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 "Arty" was the best friend I had back in my Army days... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 But I can't call in a fire mission on that 12 point buck at the end of the treeline................... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BigBump 1 Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 Since everyone's beat your face about not buying a saiga to "snipe" I guess I'll answer the question. .308 in 21" then the .223. If you are serious about long distance target shooting, there's a really nice beginner setup at SC for $1000 Sniper Central Entry Package -Bump Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted November 14, 2008 Report Share Posted November 14, 2008 If you are serious about long distance target shooting, there's a really nice beginner setup at SC for $1000 Sniper Central Entry Package -Bump I've looked at that package before and it really is a nice deal! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rick_a 13 Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 We just finished with a class here taught by a former Spetznas Sniper. We had a heavy population of SVDs and Saigas. We shot out to 500 yards (laser measurement). While I could not get out that far due to scope problems, we had one man shooting a 16" Saiga 308 with a POSP scope and Spanish Surplus (1978!) ammo hitting the 500 yard steel regularly. Even in boot camp I managed to hit 8/10 on a 3/4 silhouette with an M16A2 with iron sights @500 yards. Scope problems?... ...500 yards is not that far for a man-sized target with a .308 MBR IMO (or even a good 5.56mm for that matter). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted November 15, 2008 Report Share Posted November 15, 2008 Except they were not shooting man size targets. They were shooting steel plates. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
slinkyjosh 0 Posted November 18, 2008 Report Share Posted November 18, 2008 (edited) -The S=.308 is the best for longer range work, BUT 500 YARDS? that is the territory of $$$$$$ semi's amd most decent bolts. If you think you are going there for less than $500 --keep dreaming, I don't know where you get your info but planty of rifles can shoot 500yds no problem. You don't have to spend an arm and a leg to do it. In fact if I can't shoot a rifle 500yds withought a scope I don't even want it which is why I'm in this forum to figure out if this rifle can preform at well over 500yds. Just to clerify, I'm not saying every rifle can but plenty of em can. And the steel plate thing, In the Marine Corp and out I have kept my 500yrd group so about 5" and I have never used a scope in my life. My next rifle will be my first scoped rifle. Let me steer this back in the direction that the op probably intended. This is an ak remake so dose it have the same accuracy problems or is it actually usefull at lets say over 800yds. (500yds is a joke) Edited November 18, 2008 by josh78 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drusagas 2 Posted November 23, 2008 Report Share Posted November 23, 2008 ...and he was asking the equivalent of "What's the best diet food? Chicken fried steak or bacon cheese fries?" So? Bacon cheese fries, most definitely Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted November 23, 2008 Report Share Posted November 23, 2008 ...and he was asking the equivalent of "What's the best diet food? Chicken fried steak or bacon cheese fries?" So? Bacon cheese fries, most definitely I agree. If I'm gonna get fat, it's gonna taste food! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted November 23, 2008 Report Share Posted November 23, 2008 I forgot..... I LIKE PIE Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rick_a 13 Posted November 30, 2008 Report Share Posted November 30, 2008 Except they were not shooting man size targets. They were shooting steel plates. its going to be for shooting stuff like gallons of milk, dummies and steal plates at around 500 yards... Sniping implies practice shooting man-sized targets. Regardless, so long as the targets have a diameter of around 10" or more, with a skilled shooter, it should be no problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hangfire13 0 Posted December 5, 2008 Report Share Posted December 5, 2008 If you are serious about long distance target shooting, there's a really nice beginner setup at SC for $1000 Sniper Central Entry Package -Bump I believe these are the same as Weatherby Vangard rifles. (Sub-MOA) Awesome tack drivers for the money! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mstranglr 9 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 The word "sniper" means various of things to alot of different people. * With a delta force sniper, a .50 caliber shot half way across across a country may define peoples idea of a sniper * To a varmiter, an eyeball shot to a groundhog at 700 yards defines a sniper * To a hunter, a perfect shot on a running ram across a rugged canyon would indicate sniper-like skill * To the marine scout sniper, being able to move in and out of position unnoticed, survive for extended periods without support collecting intel, and administering accurate fire undetected is sniper skill * To a police sharpshooter, Putting that bad guy down with a ultra-precise shot at less than 200 yards will get you called a sniper * The guys who were originally called snipers, they made precise shots at little birds (snipes) from short distances * To troops and civilians on the ground in conflicts all over the world, anyone making precise shots from a concealed position, whether it be from a window accross the street or out of a storm drain at passing vehicles, is a sniper. As for the saiga 500 yd shot, The 308 is your best option. And if you are hellbent on doing it with a military-grade semi-auto rifle, the Saiga is also you cheapest option. If you are not Hellbent on a mag fed semi-auto, the Savage option is good advise. I am currently building and testing a 308 Saiga and trying to get some accurate distance shots. With $1,200 optics, a re-crown, benchrest, meaured distance, known wind speed, direction, tempurature, and humidity, magazine out single shot, and match ammo - I can currently get about a 10" 5-shot group at 500 yards (best) and 1" at 100yds. I am currently changing optics, mount, and going to test different loads and will post results in a couple of weeks. Please be minful that this is the internet and people greatly exagerate both extremes of every topic. People who say its imposible to hit with a saiga at 500yds are wrong, they assume this because they can not do it. But also, the guy in this thread who says he gets 1 MOA at 500 yards with iron sights only is really full of it, because he is a mall ninja. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paladin 37 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 I've stayed out of this thread because, frankly, it was lame to start with. DD, you're spot on. The term "sniper" is one of the most overused, misused, and abused terms out there. It ranks right up there with "tactical". I, for one, am very interested in your testing and would like to stay abreast of them via post or pm if you would be so kind. I want to build a DMR style rifle with my Saiga 308. So far I have sitting on my bench a virgin 22" 308, a Red Star Adjustable trigger, A Millet DMS scope with an ArmaLite one piece rings/mount. My plan is to take the barrel down to 18"-20" (going back and forth) recrown, and thread. I'll have a folding stock with cheek piece. Light weight Harris bipod. A can is in the plans too, as it serves so many purposes-suppressor, flash hider, improved accuracy, brake-how could I not? (With both the goto and the DMR being .30 cal. I'll be able to use it on both.) The goal is to have a rifle that is handy enough to be a back up to my goto rifle while also extending my area of influence out beyond what my goto can reasonably be expected to reach if the need arises (static defense, overwatch, etc). If I can consistently put first round hits on a man sized target at 300-400yds I'll have achieved my goal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Juggernaut 11,054 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 Here is MY definition of a sniper.... and I'm stickin' to it! One shot, one kill! Edit: more shots from the greatest living sniper..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bayoupiper 738 Posted January 16, 2009 Report Share Posted January 16, 2009 The word "sniper" means various of things to alot of different people. * With a delta force sniper, a .50 caliber shot half way across across a country may define peoples idea of a sniper * To a varmiter, an eyeball shot to a groundhog at 700 yards defines a sniper * To a hunter, a perfect shot on a running ram across a rugged canyon would indicate sniper-like skill * To the marine scout sniper, being able to move in and out of position unnoticed, survive for extended periods without support collecting intel, and administering accurate fire undetected is sniper skill * To a police sharpshooter, Putting that bad guy down with a ultra-precise shot at less than 200 yards will get you called a sniper * The guys who were originally called snipers, they made precise shots at little birds (snipes) from short distances * To troops and civilians on the ground in conflicts all over the world, anyone making precise shots from a concealed position, whether it be from a window accross the street or out of a storm drain at passing vehicles, is a sniper. As for the saiga 500 yd shot, The 308 is your best option. And if you are hellbent on doing it with a military-grade semi-auto rifle, the Saiga is also you cheapest option. If you are not Hellbent on a mag fed semi-auto, the Savage option is good advise. I am currently building and testing a 308 Saiga and trying to get some accurate distance shots. With $1,200 optics, a re-crown, benchrest, meaured distance, known wind speed, direction, tempurature, and humidity, magazine out single shot, and match ammo - I can currently get about a 10" 5-shot group at 500 yards (best) and 1" at 100yds. I am currently changing optics, mount, and going to test different loads and will post results in a couple of weeks. Please be minful that this is the internet and people greatly exagerate both extremes of every topic. People who say its imposible to hit with a saiga at 500yds are wrong, they assume this because they can not do it. But also, the guy in this thread who says he gets 1 MOA at 500 yards with iron sights only is really full of it, because he is a mall ninja. Very good post! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PapaSmurf 3 Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 The word "sniper" means various of things to alot of different people. * With a delta force sniper, a .50 caliber shot half way across across a country may define peoples idea of a sniper * To a varmiter, an eyeball shot to a groundhog at 700 yards defines a sniper * To a hunter, a perfect shot on a running ram across a rugged canyon would indicate sniper-like skill * To the marine scout sniper, being able to move in and out of position unnoticed, survive for extended periods without support collecting intel, and administering accurate fire undetected is sniper skill * To a police sharpshooter, Putting that bad guy down with a ultra-precise shot at less than 200 yards will get you called a sniper * The guys who were originally called snipers, they made precise shots at little birds (snipes) from short distances * To troops and civilians on the ground in conflicts all over the world, anyone making precise shots from a concealed position, whether it be from a window accross the street or out of a storm drain at passing vehicles, is a sniper. As for the saiga 500 yd shot, The 308 is your best option. And if you are hellbent on doing it with a military-grade semi-auto rifle, the Saiga is also you cheapest option. If you are not Hellbent on a mag fed semi-auto, the Savage option is good advise. I am currently building and testing a 308 Saiga and trying to get some accurate distance shots. With $1,200 optics, a re-crown, benchrest, meaured distance, known wind speed, direction, tempurature, and humidity, magazine out single shot, and match ammo - I can currently get about a 10" 5-shot group at 500 yards (best) and 1" at 100yds. I am currently changing optics, mount, and going to test different loads and will post results in a couple of weeks. Please be minful that this is the internet and people greatly exagerate both extremes of every topic. People who say its imposible to hit with a saiga at 500yds are wrong, they assume this because they can not do it. But also, the guy in this thread who says he gets 1 MOA at 500 yards with iron sights only is really full of it, because he is a mall ninja. Very good post! This is one of the best descriptions that I've read. Well done! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 The thread that will not die! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
t165 30 Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 And I thought all this time a "sniper" was simply a "bushwhacker" from early western folklore. The name change occurred because of all the negative connotations associated with ambushing a man instead of having the courage to face him. The United States Armed Forces couldn't have a bunch of cowardly bushwhackers shooting people in the back. I remember watching a news show about the Vietnam conflict where I heard the abovementioned comments. The war protester was very upset about our occupation of vietnam. I do not remember him being saddened over the young american soldiers who were "bushwhacked". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Texian 0 Posted February 17, 2009 Report Share Posted February 17, 2009 Here is MY definition of a sniper.... and I'm stickin' to it! One shot, one kill! Edit: more shots from the greatest living sniper..... Jug, That did my head!!! I've always been a hockey fan. Thank you! Tex Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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