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Surefire mags work great without the need for a bullet guide. The surefire polymer mags have a last shot hold open and have 3 countable us parts for 922 compliance. The surefire metal (steel) mags have no last shot hold open and have no us 922 parts. I prefer the surefire metal mags (I am just one of those 'steel is better' kinda guys i guess), however i have both types and they work great. The surefire polymer 30rnd mags can be had for a little over $30 and the surefire metal 30rnd mags for a little over $40.

 

Now I know that there are cheaper mags both metal and plastic, but they all require the use of a bullet guide. If installing a bullet guide and then tweaking all your mags to work is what you are into, the galil/weigner/yugo mags are for you. If you just wanna get a mag that will work flawlessly without the need for a bullet guide and tweaking of the mags, go SUREFIRE.

 

Hope this helps.

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Polymer Galil mags work great and require no mods to the rifle.

 

saiga556_662.JPG

 

Bulgy 5.56 / .223 waffle mags work great, too. You just have to grind out the rear tab in the mag well ( no need to touch the mag latch on the rifle or mod the magazine )

 

saiga556_1246.JPG

 

Weiger mags (or their Romanian clones) will work fine, but you'll need to do the most mods to your rifle when using these.

 

The 5.45x39 and 5.56x45 have different case profiles. The commie rounds are bottlenecked in shape which cause the commie mags to be curved. The 5.56x45 (and 7.62x51) are straight walled cartridges.

 

When using .223 rounds in a 5.45x39 magazine - even with the RobArms followers and other mag mods - it's the curvature of the mag that won't allow much more than 15 or 20 rounds to reliably work in them.

 

You can see the differences in the below picture.

Far left: Bulgarian 5.56x45 ( .223 Remington ) waffle mag

Far right: Bulgarian 5.45x39 AK74 mag

 

akmagsge2.jpg

Edited by nalioth
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Thanks for the reply nalioth. With the galil mags you mean no mods except a bullet guide, right? With the galil 50 rounders work as well or only the 35s?

 

Kind of a random question, but would it be possible to butcher a metal surefire or the like and mod it onto a beta c mag and have the mag actually work, or are there other issues that have to be taken into consideration?

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Surefire mags work great without the need for a bullet guide. The surefire polymer mags have a last shot hold open and have 3 countable us parts for 922 compliance. The surefire metal (steel) mags have no last shot hold open and have no us 922 parts. I prefer the surefire metal mags (I am just one of those 'steel is better' kinda guys i guess), however i have both types and they work great. The surefire polymer 30rnd mags can be had for a little over $30 and the surefire metal 30rnd mags for a little over $40.

 

Now I know that there are cheaper mags both metal and plastic, but they all require the use of a bullet guide. If installing a bullet guide and then tweaking all your mags to work is what you are into, the galil/weigner/yugo mags are for you. If you just wanna get a mag that will work flawlessly without the need for a bullet guide and tweaking of the mags, go SUREFIRE.

 

Hope this helps.

 

So far I've got 4 of the Surefire polys, but I'd prefer my gun take a more universal (read: cheaper) mag, and dropping 30-40 bucks per kinda sucks. Plus they are a wee bit oogly whereas the Galil mags are cleaner, and the waffle mags just look awesome.

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Thanks for the reply nalioth. With the galil mags you mean no mods except a bullet guide, right? With the galil 50 rounders work as well or only the 35s?

 

Kind of a random question, but would it be possible to butcher a metal surefire or the like and mod it onto a beta c mag and have the mag actually work, or are there other issues that have to be taken into consideration?

I've no experience with the metal Galil mags.

 

It can be done, but I'd have no idea how to go about it.

 

... and yeah, all military magazine usage requires the bullet guide for reliable operation.

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nalioth.

With all due respect to your Saiga knowledge, Galil polymer mags do not work without a bullet guide.

Because I have read many of your posts, I tried chambering a round in my .223 with a modified Galil 30 round mag in my .223 Saiga. (by modified I mean that the filing was done to make it fit) It does not work! The rifle needs a bullet guide for it to work properly.

I wish you were right but...

Respectfully,

pg

Edited by pogy
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nalioth.

With all due respect to your Saiga knowledge, Galil polymer mags do not work without a bullet guide.

Because I have read many of your posts, I tried chambering a round in my .223 with a modified Galil 30 round mag in my .223 Saiga. (by modified I mean that the filing was done to make it fit) It does not work! The rifle needs a bullet guide for it to work properly.

I wish you were right but...

Respectfully,

pg

My apologies.

 

I just ASSUME everyone will install a bullet guide before using military surplus magazines.

 

After the bullet guide installation, no further mods to the gun are required for use with the Galil Orlites.

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nalioth.

With all due respect to your Saiga knowledge, Galil polymer mags do not work without a bullet guide.

Because I have read many of your posts, I tried chambering a round in my .223 with a modified Galil 30 round mag in my .223 Saiga. (by modified I mean that the filing was done to make it fit) It does not work! The rifle needs a bullet guide for it to work properly.

I wish you were right but...

Respectfully,

pg

My apologies.

 

I just ASSUME everyone will install a bullet guide before using military surplus magazines.

 

After the bullet guide installation, no further mods to the gun are required for use with the Galil Orlites.

 

 

But otherwise the magazine fits perfectly and otherwise does not need to be modified?

 

The bullet guide is a mod that I didn't want to mess with until I absolutely had to, and with galil mags being more affordable I might as well. What do I have to do to my surefires to make sure they keep working?

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But otherwise the magazine fits perfectly and otherwise does not need to be modified?

 

The bullet guide is a mod that I didn't want to mess with until I absolutely had to, and with galil mags being more affordable I might as well. What do I have to do to my surefires to make sure they keep working?

No. The polymer Galil magazines will need their front ribs ground down so that they can fit in the Saiga mag well. Here is a thread covering where to grind the mag body.

 

It's a very minor operation and doesn't affect the mags integrity in any way.

Edited by nalioth
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I purchased 2 Polish Beryl mags off of Gunbroker for my .223. Cool thing is they look a LOT like the black Izhmash AK74 mags, but are design for and marked with "5.56". As soon as my conversion is completed I will give these a shot and see how they work, of course, a bullet guide is required.

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Installing a bullet guide was really just too easy. I've found the romanian SAR-3 mags, which look just like Weiger mags require the least mods to get them to work. Dimensionaly the front of the mag is lower than other millitary mags* so you don't need to do anything to the rifle except file the back of the magwell (or just file the rear lug of the mag).

 

weigervssar3nk9.jpg

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=27615

 

*I haven't tried galil orlites, they may be just as easy to use.

Edited by JK-47
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*I haven't tried galil orlites, they may be just as easy to use.
Not just easier, they are the easiest. Only a bullet guide is required for your rifle. No mag catch grinding. No mag well scraping. Just a trim off the sides of the mags as shown, and you're in like Flynn.

 

Galil_223_35rd_Orlite_side_.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

The Galil Orlites might be easy to get to work in the gun, but they suck. The spring loads up terribly as you load it, and it gets harder and harder to load with each round. They have a real mushy shitty feeling to them as you try and load them. The best .223 AK mag available is the StG940/SAR3/Weiger mag. The rounds snap in place perfectly, are held tight, strip out with ease, and are easy to load all the way to full capacity with no spring load-up.

 

Tony

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Tony, have you tried the Polish Beryl mags? You might be pleasantly surprised with how well they work.

 

That being said I have a Bulgarian "Circle-10" mag and 2 Polish Beryl mags. The only mods to the weapon are a bullet guide and the tab at the rear of the mag well was ground down. The Beryls lock up really well in the mag well with virtually no wobble much like the factory mag. I did have to file the tops of the mags ever so slightly to get a good "click" on insertion but they will insert with no mods at all. The have proven to be 100% reliable and are my favorite mags so far for the weapon. The Bulgarian took a fair amount of modding with a dremel tool to work, and it does wobble a wee bit, but it works flawlessly when firing. I would like to pick up a Weiger to try out, but man they're so hard to find for a reasonable price these days!

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The Galil Orlites might be easy to get to work in the gun, but they suck. The spring loads up terribly as you load it, and it gets harder and harder to load with each round. They have a real mushy shitty feeling to them as you try and load them. The best .223 AK mag available is the StG940/SAR3/Weiger mag. The rounds snap in place perfectly, are held tight, strip out with ease, and are easy to load all the way to full capacity with no spring load-up.

 

Tony

 

As always, I defer to your opinion. I will note, just for the sake of argument, that I've never had a failure-to-feed or any other malfunction with Galil Orlite mags in my Saiga conversion (that includes mags with 'WECSOG-US-made' floorplates - obviously not a major modification). I prefer steel mil-spec mags for everything I shoot (Lee-Enfield & FAL, for example), but when the Galil Orlites were going 8 to 1 for the cost of the 'Weigers,' I figured I would try them out. They have not failed in any way during my (obviously limited compared to yours) use.

 

(I bought a bunch, and I'm not selling any.)

 

Obviously, you can no longer buy the Galil Orlites for five bucks each. And as I said, I prefer steel mil-spec mags. As always, I would suggest that any one interested in Saigas check in with Tony first...

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Just a trim off the sides of the mags as shown, and you're in like Flynn.

 

Galil_223_35rd_Orlite_side_.jpg

Actually, you don't even have to trim that much (based on my personal experience). I trim the top 'horizontal' section of the rib, and the 'vertical' section of the rib, but have never had a problem leaving the bottom 'horizontal' section intact. That may just be a result of how I insert my Saiga mags, so obviously "your mileage may vary." If there are any potential reliability problems (not encountered by me ;>) associated with leaving the bottom 'horizontal' rib intact, I would suggest shaving it off. Better safe than sorry...

 

;>)

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  • 1 year later...

Heya Peeps,

 

I know everyone says the Pro Mag magazines built specifically for the Saiga .223 suck monkey balls.....but has anyone ever tried modding the standard .223 AK Pro Mag mags for use in the Saiga .223? I have read reviews on the product that say it sometimes works without a bullet guide and only requires some filing on the rear mag catch.

 

GIJeff

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Heya Peeps,

 

I know everyone says the Pro Mag magazines built specifically for the Saiga .223 suck monkey balls.....but has anyone ever tried modding the standard .223 AK Pro Mag mags for use in the Saiga .223? I have read reviews on the product that say it sometimes works without a bullet guide and only requires some filing on the rear mag catch.

 

GIJeff

Is a Chihuahua turd more appetizing than a Great Dane turd?

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Heya Peeps,

 

-1 for wiseass remarks and no real information to add.

 

I am sure many people have experienced companies that make some good products and some not so good products....any company can build a lemon once in a while. In deference to Nalioth's previous contributions I'll refrain from making a troll comment here. Anyone out there with anything USEFUL to add to the discussion?

 

Jeff Waite

aka GIJeff

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nalioth's comment had plenty of hidden knowledge. is the mag any different without the feed lip enhancement. no. it just had the larger feed lip. they are the same otherwise. so his statement says a pos is a pos. i love those southern analogies.

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Heya Peeps,

 

I don't want "What everyone knows" or some person trying to make everyone think they know everything by being inscrutible......I want someone that has experience with the actual mag in question to relate same. Anything else is conjecture and supposition...or in the case of your assumption about Nalioth's motives...self promotion.

 

Does anyone have firsthand experience of using these mags for the SAR/AK in the saiga? promag sells magazines for AR's and I have never heard anyone complain about those magazines, so it's not necessarily a given that EVERYTHING they make is a turd. If that were the case...I doubt they'd still be in business.

 

If so please tell us about your experience....if not....well I suppose you could waste time posting, but what's the point?

 

Jeff Waite

AKA GIJeff

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every promag I have ever tried worked really good and is still working good. My star-30m metal promags did need some fitting though. I have 6 promags for my saiga 223 (the promag saiga mags with plastic bullet guide), and they all work great and 1 of them (my oldest one) probably has 500+ rounds through it.

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Heya Peeps,

 

I know everyone says the Pro Mag magazines built specifically for the Saiga .223 suck monkey balls.....but has anyone ever tried modding the standard .223 AK Pro Mag mags for use in the Saiga .223? I have read reviews on the product that say it sometimes works without a bullet guide and only requires some filing on the rear mag catch.

 

GIJeff

I,ve got the ones marked with AK-A5 on the tag. Up to 10 minutes of file work on three places (file down a bit on front-top, deeper recess giving more space for bolt carrier, thin down the rear mag catch) plus Dinzag flat trunnion bullet guide. Works perfect. The reason for such a solution -> Factory 30rd mags cost here around USD 100, orlites&bulgies not available. Good value for money, I guess.

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