Any mosin gurus in the house

[wally 2]

What should I look out for when making a purchase, (M 91/30)other than the norm, bore,metal finish etc.just looking for a nice shooter and maybe another to make a sniper clone with a PE not PU scope mount,would also like to pickup a m38,on the 38,s how do tell if its in the correct stock some of them come in a M44 stock

[ArcFault 4]

I'm no guru but I'll take a shot.

 

I would look for matching serial #s and a decent bore, really the bore and overall condition of the rifle are probably more important than the serial #s if you plan to modify it anyway. Don't bother looking for one with a crisp trigger, there really aren't any out there. Some triggers are worse than others but none of them are what one would call light.

 

The M44 stock has a groove cut into the side to accept the side folding bayonet.

 

Poke around some of the mosin and surplus rifle forums, there are plenty of good tidbits there.

[WardenWolf 6]

Matching serials aren't a huge deal. Many of these rifles were rearsenaled and had parts replaced. Really what you want to look for is a bright bore with strong rifling, and good overall condition. Pricing varies wildly. I paid $75 for mine with 4 stripper clips, an ammo pouch, and a box of ammo. It was in very good shape, too. I've seen some places that want $110 to $130 for comparable ones. I'd consider it a good value even at $130 if you truly get a good one.

[scoutjoe 276]

M38 stocks don't have a cutout for a bayonet like the M44 stocks do, that's the main difference I've noticed between mine.

 

As for the overall condition, I have a M44 from 1946 that holds the tightest groups out of all my guns...it doesn't match where as my unissued M44 and 91/30 do. So matching ain't a big deal.

 

Stay away from a countrerbored muzzle, if possible. Not saying they are junk but I'd like all my rifling thank you very much.

 

If you want one hell of a shooter, pony up for a Finnish. Course that's a bigger and bigger leap anymore

 

Don't know if i qualify for a guru....but you're getting what you paid for

[WardenWolf 6]

Actually there's been evidence that counterboring doesn't hurt. I've talked to a few people on the Russian Mosin Nagant forum (Google it) and they've said counterbored rifles can be just as accurate as unaltered ones.

[wally 2]

counter bore,meaning the crown is gone/fked up?

[wally 2]

ok ,had a brain fart,the old sticking a bullet in the end of the barrel trick/to see if it s been c -bored

[WardenWolf 6]

Counterboring basically means they drilled out worn rifling near the barrel tip to restore accuracy.

[IndyArms 10,186]

I bought an old 91/30.... was pretty rough... however it was a re-arsenaled sniper... you could see the welded up side holes in the left side of the receiver, where they filled in the mounting holes for the scope mount.

 

I still sold it for a song... it didnt shoot worth a fuck. I still have a 38... in the ATI stock... that rifle is just about worthless too... boat oar... club... yanno...

 

Although the WORST mosin I ever had was one that Classic Arms chromed... talk about a BEAUTIFUL rifle... it was worthy of a frame on the wall... it was GORGEOUS... SERIOUSLY GORGEOUS!!!

 

then I shot it...

 

Keyholed bullets at 25 yards....

 

needless to say I shipped it RIGHT BACK! NEXT DAY....

 

They sent me a K-31 and 60 rounds of ammo instead. I am MUCH happier with that purchase! Its almost a tack driver!

 

 

[WardenWolf 6]

What type of ammo were you using? I ask, because occasionally dishonest reloaders will use improper bullets in the casings (30-06 instead of 7.62x54R or 7.7Jap, etc.). Ammo that's too small for the bore will do that, just the same as a shot out bore.

[wally 2]

thanks for the info guys

[nalioth 405]

Counterbored Mosins are common. They only took about a centimeter (just enough to get rid of the steel-cleaning-rod abused factory crown).

 

You guys haven't mentioned that with every counterbore, they got a new crown, too.

 

They are easily as accurate as any Mosin without a counterbore.

[mstranglr 9]

if you want an excellent Mosin, stay away from Big5. Big5 guns are still caked with so much cosmoline that you will never determine bore, chamber, and bolt health. Its hit or miss - but mostly miss. Same goes for mail order.

 

The best place to buy a Mosin is at a gun show. There, you can inspect cleaned-up rifles. Expect to pay more for an excellent rifle though - sometimes over $100.

 

very good to excellent Condition 91/30s are the best shooters. More accurate and less recoil than the shorter Mosins. The problem is that 91/30s with excellent boars are hard to find. If you find a good one and install a Huber trigger, it will outshoot Mauser K98s.

 

And Indy, K-31s rock. Scary accurate for a mil-surp rifle. The surplus ammo (GP11) is also match ammo! I empty the magazine on steel plates at 400 yards with the irons, and hit every time.

[IndyArms 10,186]

What type of ammo were you using? I ask, because occasionally dishonest reloaders will use improper bullets in the casings (30-06 instead of 7.62x54R or 7.7Jap, etc.). Ammo that's too small for the bore will do that, just the same as a shot out bore.

 

 

WOLF is what I was shooting... go figure....

 

[WardenWolf 6]

Wolf Gold 7.62x54 is normally very accurate and reliable ammo. It's the preferred ammo of Dragunov and PSL shooters because it's highly accurate and available in 150 grain. The only real problem with it is they cut it with black powder so it gunks up your gun like no tomorrow. Most people can get around .75 MOA out of this ammo with a PSL.

[mstranglr 9]

Yep, Wolf Gold shoots excellent out of a good Mosin.

 

[WardenWolf 6]

Was at Cabela's today and they had an M44 in their used gun rack for $125. I took a look at it, of course, but despite looking good on the outside I found the entire front half of the rifling was effectively GONE. Worn off, not counterbored. Back half was okay. Someone bought it while I was there, because when I went back that way again it was gone. Dumb gits, bought a gun with a shot out bore.

[G O B 3,516]

My internet ordered M-38 is my favorite shooter. Accurate to a fault. i have never even needed to adjust the sights. It loves surplus light ball. The Check silver tip especially.

[waltham_41 52]

I have a M38 made in 1944, and it has a non-laminate M44 stock on it. I went through all sorts of looking trying to find the "right" stock for it, to be told at a MN forum that since mine was made in 1944 when the M38 was discontinued and the M44 was introduced, that the M44 stock may very well be the correct one for it anyhow.

[gandog56 0]

counter bore,meaning the crown is gone/fked up?

Nope, counter bore meaning they fixed that bad crown without having to rebarrel.

[hkusp45 8]

I am not a Guru and am just getting started on my own sniper project. However, the internet is your friend so go here. http://www.surplusrifle.com/mosincarbine/index.asp

 

Great website with lots of info and also has many other gun models listed along with links to parts, aftermarket, bent bolts, etc.

[Cobra 76 two 2,677]

I've been doing a little Mosin research lately, in preparation for buying my first one. I'm surprised no one has mentioned the hexagonal receivers as opposed to the rounded ones. Aren't they supposed to be more desirable or rare? They were made first but from what I understand, some were reused on later guns. And what about the Arsenals? From what I understand, the Tikkas are far more desirable than the Tula or Izhevsk rifles. (I believe these are the ones stamped "SA" with a "T" in a point down triangle in a circle?) Between the Izhevsk and Tula rifles, which are the most desirable? According to what I read about the 91/30, there were more Izhevsk rifles made in '43 and '44 alone, than all of the Tula rifles, making the Tulas more rare, so to speak. Also the machining is said to be better on the Tulas during the WWII period of MFG. Then finally, the barrel stampings are more pleasing to the eye (to some). The large Tula star with arrow is more impressive looking to some, than the small Izzy arrow in triangle stamp.

These are just a few differences in characteristics I've been reading about. They are supposedly highly debated by Mosin collectors though, as far as which ones are the most collectable. I'm sure, if one had the opportunity to pick through a large selection of these rifles, one would probably do best starting with the older and more finely machined Russian examples with good bores, and of course the super nice Finnish guns if those were available. I would also prefer a laminate stock myself. One thing I read about matching numbers vs. not.....The most desirable Mosins, from what I've read, are the Finnish rearsenaled ones, and they rarely have matching numbers, so matching numbers don't mean all that much as far as value goes. I'm sure there are many different ways to determine what is most deirable though, and different strokes for different folks. Like the old beatup looking rifles may not be as pretty as the nice refinished ones, but each scratch, dent, and scar have an interesting story to tell. Even the finish of the metal can mean good or bad. It has been determined that some of the more rough looking examples that have pitted receivers and barrels, from old rust that was cleaned up and reblued, got that way from being old battlefield pickups, and some even salvaged from Russian shipwrecks.

I think it's pretty cool that there are so many of these old World War historic weapons still available to the public, and at very reasonable prices, even less than $100 with accessories.

 

Here's a good link to a lot of Mosin info, from what I found so far....

 

http://7.62x54r.net/

[Paulry 50]

I like the fact that my Mosin's are made at the same factory as my Saiga's.

 

Right Comrade?

[sharkbit 109]

I just bought one of these from Classic Arms, and am waiting for it to ship. I'll get some pics up along with a range report once i get it.

 

 

http://classicarms.us/ (mid page)

 

had to watch "Enemy at the Gates" again IMMEDIATELY after ordering it!

 

was thinking about picking up one of these to go with it...

[rocinante 100]

I bought a 91/30 this last weekend at a gun show. It is an arsenal refurbish with the counter bore crown but it looks real good. The wood doesn't have a single ding or scratch on it, the rifling near as I can tell is perfect and all the serial numbers match and the metal finish is actually pretty. Doesn't look like it saw much if any real use at all. It is a 1943 Tula. My thought is that is about the time the soviets were beginning to issue submachine guns to ground grunts instead of rifles so maybe it did spend more of its life on the shelf than in the field. Plus the word I get that in the war era the Tula factory did a better job at turning out nicer rifles than the Izhvesh factory. To my eye my new old rifle doesn't appear too crude at all. I too have been looking at classicarms.us but at 130 this one had the 99 dollar rifle beat with the after shipping and transfer fees. The trigger is a little stiff and you can feel a slight catch just before the hammer falls.

[Bean.223 365]

Hey all, Im thinking REAL HARD about buying one from Aim Surplus, HAS anybody bought a Nagant from them AND is the extra 10$ worth it for hand picked???