Shotgun vs. Assault Rifle

[Bvamp 604]

How is it determined by the BATF that a gun is a rifle or a shotgun? I know, laugh it up. Does it go by the original caliber of the gun that is registered with the reciever? Or does it go by current chambering? I know how stupid this question sounds Reason I ask is I had my AK-types apart this week cleaning them all, and I noticed that one can quite readily swap out a milled AK type reciever with a little trouble and cutting. Would THAT milled reciever still be considered an assault rifle even though it has the saiga parts on it? If it is still an assault type rifle at that point, obviously the magazine capacity is no longer an issue, as are shorty stocks, pistol grips, etc etc. again, reciever or caliber? If not, Im still thinking of a better quality milled reciever for my saiga.

[Simeon 0]

I BELIEVE(don't hold me to it as I am not BATF) it goes by current chambering. As far as, how you know if its a shotgun that also has to do with chamberings any caliber is considered a rifle while any gauge is a shotgun. This is how the .410 is a rifle and not subject to 5 capacity limit on mags while a 20gauge is a shotgun and so limited.

[Lagomorph 0]

It seem that the BATF like to leave things open at their discretion. They like to leave alot of issues unaddressed until it really becomes and real issue. Its alot like the thumbhole grip we've all been debating about. They give us some iffy reply and we can't make heads or tails of it. In this case they can deam anything anything. There are some qualifications that put rifles in the rifle category, and shotguns in the shotgun category. Ususally its common sense but there are the exceptions. Rifles usually have a rifled bore, fire one projectile, require two sights, and are ment for long range. Shotguns on the other hand have smooth bores, fire more than one projectile, usually use only one sight, and are ment for short range. The confusing part comes with the ammunition type. If slugs are shot from a riffled shotgun it is being used as a rifle, but since that shotgun can still fire multiple projectiles like buckshot or birdshot its still considered a shotgun. I don't know of any smooth bore rifles, but I know they do exist. There are very few and most are from the 1800's. Since a rifle only fires one bullet, it has to be a rifle. But, back in the 70's, during the Viet Nam War, the military experimented with several multiple projectile weapons. An example of this would be a 30-06 with a really long neck housing three 30 cal. bullets. This didn't work to well because all the bullets hit withing one to two inches of each other and its kinda impractical. Multiple projectile firing rifles do exist but there all collectors items now. Another thing that should be considered is the bore diameter, like Simeon said, .410 is considered a rifle, it can't carry a very heavy load so its more likely to be used as a rifle than a shotgun. Its kinda like a low pressure 45-75 gov. 20 gauge on the other hand is larger than .50 inches and it has a substantially larger payload making it better for shot than a single bullet. This is partially how the BATF classifies a destructive device. A destructive device is a weapon of .50 inch diameter or greater, of semi-automatic nature that can hold more than 5 rounds, and is usually has "non-sporting" like features such as a detachable magazine or drum, a pistolgrip, and non-wood furnishings. I think thats retarded but that may just be me . As for your idea of putting a new reciever together with your saiga parts, im pretty sure its all right. I was looking to build a Galil see, there are parts kits to make them but there are no recievers to be had anywhere, I was thinking about hand machining one or modding a valmet or ak reciever, because to buy a Galil out right is just too expensive. My father makes custom sniper rifles for police, military, special forces, and private citizens, so hes familiar with gun laws. You can aquire a reciver new, old, stamped, milled, marked, unmarked, you can replace it with your saiga reciever, transfer the serial number from your saiga onto the new reciever, and destroy the old reciever. Its a big hassle labor-wise, but if you want too, go ahead.

[Bvamp 604]

I guess my saiga stays as it is then. I really dont care if I can only use 5 rounds at a time, its just a hassle. I prefer to go to the range loaded up already, and i dont like to have to sit there and reload all my magazines, especially reload the same one or two over and over again. thats mainly my issue here. clay shoots and hunting is one thing. I HAVE had state troopers come up and check my #'s on me on my own family's property before. twice, actually. the second time it happened, i invited the officers back the next weekend on thier day off to blast off some rounds, and they actually accepted. I dont relish the idea of a trooper showing up, checking my arsenal, then having it all seized because of some technicality I overlooked, never to own a firearm again. but, if anyone has seen my other posts in here...one thing i firmly believe in are laws and a system of implementing them. yeh one can say laws are only for the ones who would follow them, but what if we were all lawless? then where would we be? some of the people on here i swear are neo-nazis or in the montana freemen or something along those lines by the way they reply to some of the posts on here and other boards out there. I would bet those same people dont buy pistols anymore because of the spent casing that accompanies a new pistol from the police ballistic chamber. just another law that is making its way across the country that i believe is right and just. if someone opposes that, they must want to get away with something i say. I wouldnt care about a fine or whatever, but my guns going bye bye because of something i did out of ignorance or stupidity? i dont think so....not this character here, thanks.

[shotgun_lobotomy 0]

the plain fact is that most of the laws on the books shouldnt be there in the first place, sure i understand felons shouldnt have guns (most of them) but the gov has no right to tell me what i can and cant own. like assult rifles, ill tell you right now a deer rifle in the hands of some1 who knows how to use it is 100s of times more deadly than any assult rifle. these laws are just the anti gun nuts way of slowly taking everything away. and of course theres the fact that they are used in less than 1% of all gun related crimes. i own all my guns for either hunting or target practice but they also work great for home defense, where im from its just as common to see a few rifles in the window of a truck as it is to see a baby seat in the back of a car, and i dont carry pistols because i dont see much use in shooting with em, id rather sit around and take my 100+ yard shots from the back porch, my shotgun was bought for hunting and nothing else, sorry im rambling. but for some readson you strike me as a man that will sit back and let them take ur guns just like they did in britan, i myself will make thgem come take them off me by force if ever that time comes

[Bvamp 604]

no, they wont be taking mine anytime. i just dont believe in unregulated firearms. thats all. there should be a law for everything you can think of. works great here in new york where i am. anyone thinks about screwing with me, i can have them arrested and put in jail. i can use deadly force to defend myself. i CANT shoot deer out of season, tho a lot of ppl do anyway. CANT take a full auto out back and blaze away with it even for fun. i dont mind things like that. CANT carry concealed unless you have proper permit. fine. cant even OWN a pistol here without a concealed carry permit. i say fine as well. here they take a ballistic sample from each pistol now when its sold new. FINE. what do i have to worry about? i had a neighbor up here that would shoot clays ok? the guy happened to drop the bird shot on the siding of our house when i was a kid. i think it was on purpose because of the range involved and it being a fairly small house, he would hit it every shot almost. theres an idiot right there. how about that crackhead that tried to rob my ass at gunpoint? what do you think his face looked like when i threw my wallet up in the air and produced my .40? what about if i didnt know my weapon and just shot him? you know that round goes THROUGH people. who would i have hit? what i say is there shouldnt be a free for all with guns in this country. thats all. if we CAN have it, there should be a legal way of getting it. there should be laws on both ends of the deal.

 

oh yeh, i dont think im going to go through the paperwork hassle and time consuming adventure of changing out the reciever on my saiga with a good quality milled one. if i break it shooting it, which im sure i will eventually, ill get a new saiga and donate the broken one to the cops for 100 bucks.