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.223 dented shell casing AND Info on the boltface.


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#1 v_door

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 03:10 AM

Have put approx 50 rds thru my new Saiga,16in barrel,BHO,never has jammed but leaves a small dent bout half way down the shell caseing on ejecting. Anyone ran into this ? Thanks for any info,..JT.

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#2 pogy

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 07:43 AM

Yes, aka the AK kiss. It is apparently caused by the case striking the receiver cover or bolt handle or both upon ejection. Check for some solutions to the problem. I use the door molding myself and it works well. Photos
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#3 -Indy-

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 11:22 AM

Theres a sticky at the top of the x39 thread that goes into some input on this...

I should make one for this one too... this and the dimple around the primer... that you DO NOT Want to remove with a dremel from the boltface. LOL


:smoke:
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#4 -Indy-

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 06:00 PM

In retrospect...

I am going to STICKY *THIS* topic, and add the other detail into it... :up:

Link to post about the boltface dimple specific to the Saiga .223...

http://forum.saiga-1...showtopic=21769

I didnt see the post about the dented casing, but its been covered to death here... REALLY... the dent is NORMAL... no worries! do the above listed mod to make a shell buffer if you need to reload your brass. If using steel casings dont even be concerned. :up:

:smoke:
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."
~ Thomas Jefferson


It is impossible to make people understand their ignorance; for it requires knowledge to perceive it and therefore he that can perceive it, hath it not.
Jeremy Taylor
English prelate (1613 - 1667)


"The AG has determined that you're a potential terrorist, because only potential terrorists are interested in buying guns."

#5 -Indy-

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 06:06 PM

If anyone finds other topics in regards to the dented brass, please post links to them in here, so its a little easier for the people to find them.

I suppose I could look in the tech section too... LOL ah well...

:smoke:
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."
~ Thomas Jefferson


It is impossible to make people understand their ignorance; for it requires knowledge to perceive it and therefore he that can perceive it, hath it not.
Jeremy Taylor
English prelate (1613 - 1667)


"The AG has determined that you're a potential terrorist, because only potential terrorists are interested in buying guns."

#6 v_door

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 09:13 PM

If anyone finds other topics in regards to the dented brass, please post links to them in here, so its a little easier for the people to find them.

I suppose I could look in the tech section too... LOL ah well...

:smoke:

Thanks a bunch for the info,wondered why i couldnt find the caseings they were way up front from where i thought they should be(was shooting on brushed hogged ground)so hard to spot. Will be reloadeding, thanks again guys,..JT.

#7 Mad Rat

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Posted 05 June 2009 - 03:39 PM

This affordable mod worked! Looked odd at first. Nobody at range noticed or remarked yesterday!
Attached File  Saiga_.223_.30_Carbine_008.jpg   396.71KB   152 downloads
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#8 KiwiSilverfox

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Posted 08 June 2009 - 09:12 PM

Have put approx 50 rds thru my new Saiga,16in barrel,BHO,never has jammed but leaves a small dent bout half way down the shell caseing on ejecting. Anyone ran into this ? Thanks for any info,..JT.




I have a Norinco 84s in .223 and yes it marks the case the same as your one does. I found that it will not mark reloaded cases........I don`t know perhaps something to do with case lube resedue. Any way as I reload and use once fired cases from Police .223 Bushmasters that do not show the dent. Onee reloaded and lubed I can use them repeadedly without the AK kiss turning up on the case`s. Have thought to just try and lube some factory loaded ammunition and see if this also works.

Edited by KiwiSilverfox, 08 June 2009 - 09:14 PM.


#9 AKsarben

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Posted 22 June 2009 - 11:26 AM

DON"T lube the bullets. The case fire forms against the side of the bore and does 2 things. Seals and prevents gas from coming back, because the brass is undersized for efficient feeding. 2, and this is the important part, is that it provided an additional grip of the case against the bore to help to prevent all the rearward pressure from contacting the bolt face and lugs. It was, or is, an additional safety to help with the chamber pressures. Yes, the gun will still fire with lubed bullets, but without lube the brass now has tighter friction against the walls and you decrease the amount of pressure against the bolt face, which should save wear and tear on the lugs, etc over time.
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#10 imarangemaster

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Posted 03 February 2010 - 10:49 PM

FLASH! My 09 Saiga 223 does not dent the brass cases! Just a VERY slight, tiny, scuff with no dent. Hallelujah!
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#11 thunderheart

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Posted 23 June 2010 - 09:26 PM

I fired the first handful of rounds through my Saiga 223 this weekend. I get a very pronounced dent at the top of the neck. Every round shows identical dent. Unfortunately, I seem to have thrown the brass away without photographing it. Was firing Wolf 55 grain hollow points. Has anyone here heard of or experienced anything similar.

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#12 Infernil

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:48 PM

yup mine does that too

#13 diensthunds

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 11:37 AM

How much of a pronounced dent on the opening of the case (near the opening) can be had and still be safe to reload?

#14 thar3v3r3nd

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Posted 26 November 2010 - 12:54 PM

Hey Mens, I hope this helps yall. It helped me. Had the same problem with mine. I was running high capacity mags promag 30 rndrs, i noticed on the mags that there is a little plastic bullet guide on the mag, and mine was broken off when i forgot to hold the bolt hold open button and thye bolt slamed into that piece of the mag when i was taking the mag off to reload it. didnt notice it until i loaded it up and tried to fire, the shells that didnt jam while loading where dented after spent. Ok you have 2 options buy more mags, or buy the metal bullet guide from DINZAGARMS.com. I bought the bullet guide and mounted it myself, and im no gunsmith so its not to hard to drill a hole and tap it. With a little fieling on the mags that had the plastic bullet guide busted off they fit right in and damn the gun runs perfect now. I like shooting this thing better than my MP15. Let me know if you peeps need any pics or help. Just take your time and dont rush. Man i love shootin shit. Laterz

#15 -Indy-

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 04:31 PM

How much of a pronounced dent on the opening of the case (near the opening) can be had and still be safe to reload?


I know this is a WHILE since the question was asked... but...


If you can run the brass through a FULL LENGTH RESIZING die... It will be OK to reload... if its deformed TOO BAD, you can always take something and gently round out the case mouth before you run it through the resizer...

No worries... no fuss no muss. :up:



:smoke:
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."
~ Thomas Jefferson


It is impossible to make people understand their ignorance; for it requires knowledge to perceive it and therefore he that can perceive it, hath it not.
Jeremy Taylor
English prelate (1613 - 1667)


"The AG has determined that you're a potential terrorist, because only potential terrorists are interested in buying guns."

#16 7.62x51

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 08:26 PM

The case head is inscribed because of the shape of the bolt face. I believe they do it because they do not want you to reload. It is about control, not gun control.

Edited by 7.62x51, 01 February 2011 - 08:26 PM.


#17 NPGILL

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 03:06 PM

I haven't noticed any dents on any of my spent casing however i have another interesting thing happening to some rounds I have put threw my Saiga .223. I own a high cap promag that lost the feed guide and a few rounds were miss feeding and pushing the ball back inside the case, I purchased a AR adapter from renegadebuck and the rounds feed perfect. Now for the strange part, I had a box of American eagle recycled brass. A few rounds tore in half while the bolt was ejecting them. I chalked it up to weak brass until the problem happened with Remington and wolf ammo, The problem is very hit and miss. If anyone has any thought or info i would like to hear it.

#18 josey88

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Posted 11 March 2011 - 03:08 PM

Well, I had almost the same problem with my PSL 7,.62x54R ... the cartridges , when ejected , will hit the receiver`s cover lightly, nicking the paint . I don`t reload , so I don`t care about that, but I do care very much about the finish of the receiver`s cover , so not wanting to spend $45 on the Valmet device, I put 4 pieces of electric black tape , about 2 inches long , one on top of the other ,( to make it a bit thicker and therefore more cushionable) on that part of the cover . I went to the range and it was perfect. The shells will eject touching the tape on the part that was protected by the tape and bounce off . No damage to the cover at all. If the tape gets damaged later on with the continue use, I will simply cut 4 more little pieces and put them on. On my .223 , I haven`t fired it yet , but after reading here that Saigas .223 have the same problem more or less, I already put the tape on mine. The electric tape will adhere to the cover without damaging the finish. If you want more cushion , add more pieces of tape , but 4 pieces work fine in my PSL . This is a perfect and cheap solution to an annoying problem.

#19 brokenfeather

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Posted 12 March 2011 - 03:39 PM

This was my solution. spring steel clip, inter tube, contact cement. Did have to drill small hole in dust cover.

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#20 hunkylynch

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 08:54 PM

It's my understanding that dent casings aren't really an issue unless you reload, it's not going to damage your rifle.

#21 Silvercreek

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Posted 12 March 2012 - 01:47 PM

My Saiga .223 throws brass 20+ ft, could the case dents be somewhat related to over gassing?

#22 twoskinsoneman

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 10:48 AM

My Saiga .223 throws brass 20+ ft, could the case dents be somewhat related to over gassing?


My .223 throws the brass that far and some times farther. Got a little friendly bitching from a female shooting an AR about 20 ft away when some shells hit her at the range yesterday. :) The RSO just laughed and said "that little f---er really slings some brass!"

#23 -Indy-

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 12:25 PM

My Saiga .223 throws brass 20+ ft, could the case dents be somewhat related to over gassing?


Case dents are from hitting the dust cover...

OVERgassed?? I doubt it... just the nature of the unit...


:smoke:
"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."
~ Thomas Jefferson


It is impossible to make people understand their ignorance; for it requires knowledge to perceive it and therefore he that can perceive it, hath it not.
Jeremy Taylor
English prelate (1613 - 1667)


"The AG has determined that you're a potential terrorist, because only potential terrorists are interested in buying guns."

#24 TacticoolTim

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Posted 23 March 2012 - 01:22 PM

My Saiga .223 throws brass 20+ ft, could the case dents be somewhat related to over gassing?


I suspect a big part of the problem is the profile of the ejector itself. I saw a video where a guy re-profiled his. It's something about how close to the center of the spent cartridge the ejector hits. The farther out it hits, the more violent the ejection event. If you do decide to try it, go slow. You wouldn't want to overdo it and have spent shells barely fall out of the gun.
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#25 PAPATRIOT

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:52 PM

so can you use the dented casings for reloading .223/556 ?  



#26 TacticoolTim

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 12:06 AM

so can you use the dented casings for reloading .223/556 ?  

 

Yes you can. From everything I've heard there is no problem using them at all.


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Tacticool Tim, the Elite couch commando. Founder and CEO of SOLEMN. (Society Of Lethal Elite Mall Ninjas)

Saiga 12/Saiga 223/Saiga 308/AKA 7.62x39 and several off brand weapons as well.

#27 PAPATRIOT

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 12:09 AM

thank you Sir !



#28 roly223

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 03:48 PM

valmetbuffer1.jpgValmet ejection port buffer,work fine on Seigas


Edited by roly223, 25 February 2013 - 01:56 PM.


#29 Billybobf

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 11:21 PM

 awesome video, not a .223, but STILL awesome, I was totally thinking about doing it and I found this video and now I am totally going to do it!

I was thinking about an external adjustment screw, but I like the fixed yet adjustable port that looks SO clean from the outside and so functional, adjustable and replaceable from the inside. 






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