hallboss 1 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Maybe there is something that I am missing, but it seems the top round deforming in the mag is a concern to a lot of people. So what would be wrong with leaving the bolt locked back while the gun is stored with a mag in place? Or does this create an entirely new issue, other than the internals being more subjected to dust and dirt? Thanks Quote Link to post Share on other sites
emt1581 0 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Maybe there is something that I am missing, but it seems the top round deforming in the mag is a concern to a lot of people. So what would be wrong with leaving the bolt locked back while the gun is stored with a mag in place? Or does this create an entirely new issue, other than the internals being more subjected to dust and dirt? Thanks I plan on keeping it loaded with the bolt closed. I've fed deformed rounds into the chamber and they loaded/cycled without issue. I've done it several times. I also did a live fire test of the deformed rounds at the range. They cycled and fired again without issue. Something I'm curious about is if you leave the mags loaded and stored, do they start to deform anyways with summer heat or just over time? -Emt1581 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hallboss 1 Posted January 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Nah otherwise they would deform in their boxes. The reason they deform when loaded against a closed bolt is because their being pushed (by the mag spring) against a hard object (the bolt) for a LONG period of time. Since the shell is soft, it deforms. I was just offering an on suggestion, and making it availible to scrutiny. I store mine with the bolt open. If there is a long/short term problem with this, I hope smeone will tell me otherwise. EMT1581-glad your back, hadn't seen any posts from you in a while... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
emt1581 0 Posted January 3, 2009 Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Nah otherwise they would deform in their boxes. The reason they deform when loaded against a closed bolt is because their being pushed (by the mag spring) against a hard object (the bolt) for a LONG period of time. Since the shell is soft, it deforms. I was just offering an on suggestion, and making it availible to scrutiny. I store mine with the bolt open. If there is a long/short term problem with this, I hope smeone will tell me otherwise. EMT1581-glad your back, hadn't seen any posts from you in a while... Thanks, glad to be back. You mentioned about deforming in the box, but really that's just like stacking 4 or 5 rounds one on top of the other isn't it? The spring of a magazine puts more pressure on the rounds than that. I think I can answer this question by looking at the rounds in my 5rd. mag. It's upstairs but when I go up I'll take a look. They've been loaded in there and not loaded into the gun for a few days now, ever since I got my beautiful 12 (I mean 13) round mags in the mail. If they are deformed, then it'll prove that the mag spring alone can do it. If not, it's like you're saying and it's the pressure up against the bolt. Either way, again, they feed VERY reliably for me since the chamber/barrel is sooo huge anyway. I think, given that it's feeding a shotgun shell, the opening is almost like a funnel. That's sort of how my Mossy Mariner 590's barrel is. -Emt1581 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hallboss 1 Posted January 3, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2009 Yeah with them sitting in the mag it looks to me like the pressure is on the rim and none on the plastic. But when it's loaded that pressure is transfered to the plastic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
emt1581 0 Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Yeah with them sitting in the mag it looks to me like the pressure is on the rim and none on the plastic. But when it's loaded that pressure is transfered to the plastic. Oh now that's something I never thought of. Sounds like you're right on the money with that one though. Don't you find it interesting that you and I are the ONLY ones commenting in this thread? Not sure what it means...just interesting. -Emt1581 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hobbyshooter 59 Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 I always leave the bolt open in both my S12 and my pump 12. Some people don't like that solution because if you fumble and drop the S12 on the end of the butt stock it can rack the bolt shut chambering a round potentially pointed right at your face. If you're using 2-3/4" ammo & cycle through your ammo every 3 months I don't think you're going to have any issues with round deformation. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hallboss 1 Posted January 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 EMT1581-I noticed that we were the only ones talking, just assumed that no one had any input. Hobbyshooter-That is a good point from a safety standpoint. For me, my Saiga's stay in the safe. I don't want to take a chance on actually using the S12 and when the police show up, them taking it from me and tying it up in five years of preceedings. My Mossberg on the other hand, ah they can have it...lol Quote Link to post Share on other sites
emt1581 0 Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 EMT1581-I noticed that we were the only ones talking, just assumed that no one had any input. Hobbyshooter-That is a good point from a safety standpoint. For me, my Saiga's stay in the safe. I don't want to take a chance on actually using the S12 and when the police show up, them taking it from me and tying it up in five years of preceedings. My Mossberg on the other hand, ah they can have it...lol I'm more concerned with blowing an intruder straight to hell than worrying about the cops "borrowing" my gun. I'll be in the right, I'll get my gun back. Only gun I will NEVER take a chance with is my grandfather's WWII Ithaca 1911a1 (currently asleep in my lap). Just my .02 -Emt1581 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hallboss 1 Posted January 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 EMT1581-I noticed that we were the only ones talking, just assumed that no one had any input. Hobbyshooter-That is a good point from a safety standpoint. For me, my Saiga's stay in the safe. I don't want to take a chance on actually using the S12 and when the police show up, them taking it from me and tying it up in five years of preceedings. My Mossberg on the other hand, ah they can have it...lol I'm more concerned with blowing an intruder straight to hell than worrying about the cops "borrowing" my gun. I'll be in the right, I'll get my gun back. Only gun I will NEVER take a chance with is my grandfather's WWII Ithaca 1911a1 (currently asleep in my lap). Just my .02 -Emt1581 Yeah but thats what my Mossy is for. As far as the Cops "borrowing guns," there has been one case that I know of for sure where I collected a firearm that was used justifiably as "evidence." THE JUDGE ordered the gun be destroyed even though the shooting was justified. From that moment on, I vowed never to use a firearm as a HD gun that I cannot go down to the "Big 5" and get another. In California Saiga's and AR's are getting hard to come by. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
emt1581 0 Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 EMT1581-I noticed that we were the only ones talking, just assumed that no one had any input. Hobbyshooter-That is a good point from a safety standpoint. For me, my Saiga's stay in the safe. I don't want to take a chance on actually using the S12 and when the police show up, them taking it from me and tying it up in five years of preceedings. My Mossberg on the other hand, ah they can have it...lol I'm more concerned with blowing an intruder straight to hell than worrying about the cops "borrowing" my gun. I'll be in the right, I'll get my gun back. Only gun I will NEVER take a chance with is my grandfather's WWII Ithaca 1911a1 (currently asleep in my lap). Just my .02 -Emt1581 Yeah but thats what my Mossy is for. As far as the Cops "borrowing guns," there has been one case that I know of for sure where I collected a firearm that was used justifiably as "evidence." THE JUDGE ordered the gun be destroyed even though the shooting was justified. From that moment on, I vowed never to use a firearm as a HD gun that I cannot go down to the "Big 5" and get another. In California Saiga's and AR's are getting hard to come by. And you didn't appeal? I don't know how things are where you live but no one can order you penalized in any way...except for maybe giving your bullets back, if you are found innocent. Now if you're from Kalifornia...you've got more problems than just losing a gun. I think behind the scenes Pee-Wee Herman and Mickey Mouse are making all of the important decisions. -Emt1581 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ernestmayhand 10 Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Don't you find it interesting that you and I are the ONLY ones commenting in this thread? Not sure what it means...just interesting. -Emt1581 Probably cause this "issue" has been discussed before at great length with a couple different solutions suitable for a couple different needs. Easily found using the search feature on the board. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
emt1581 0 Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Don't you find it interesting that you and I are the ONLY ones commenting in this thread? Not sure what it means...just interesting. -Emt1581 Probably cause this "issue" has been discussed before at great length with a couple different solutions suitable for a couple different needs. Easily found using the search feature on the board. No matter how many times I see it, that joke never fails to make me smile! -Emt1581 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sonnydazegunsmithing 42 Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 EMT1581-I noticed that we were the only ones talking, just assumed that no one had any input. Hobbyshooter-That is a good point from a safety standpoint. For me, my Saiga's stay in the safe. I don't want to take a chance on actually using the S12 and when the police show up, them taking it from me and tying it up in five years of preceedings. My Mossberg on the other hand, ah they can have it...lol I'm more concerned with blowing an intruder straight to hell than worrying about the cops "borrowing" my gun. I'll be in the right, I'll get my gun back. Only gun I will NEVER take a chance with is my grandfather's WWII Ithaca 1911a1 (currently asleep in my lap). Just my .02 -Emt1581 Yeah but thats what my Mossy is for. As far as the Cops "borrowing guns," there has been one case that I know of for sure where I collected a firearm that was used justifiably as "evidence." THE JUDGE ordered the gun be destroyed even though the shooting was justified. From that moment on, I vowed never to use a firearm as a HD gun that I cannot go down to the "Big 5" and get another. In California Saiga's and AR's are getting hard to come by. And you didn't appeal? I don't know how things are where you live but no one can order you penalized in any way...except for maybe giving your bullets back, if you are found innocent. Now if you're from Kalifornia...you've got more problems than just losing a gun. I think behind the scenes Pee-Wee Herman and Mickey Mouse are making all of the important decisions. -Emt1581 in dallas they give your bullets back in an envelope and tell you not to load your gun till your outside Quote Link to post Share on other sites
luckypunk 0 Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Wouldn't slugs be less likely to deform? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hallboss 1 Posted January 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 (edited) Don't you find it interesting that you and I are the ONLY ones commenting in this thread? Not sure what it means...just interesting. -Emt1581 Probably cause this "issue" has been discussed before at great length with a couple different solutions suitable for a couple different needs. Easily found using the search feature on the board. Search, search and more search. Pretty soon this forum is going to be a search engine and not a forum. I wonder why there are certain topics that get beat to death and no one says anything. But when certain people open a topic that had been discussed, all of the sudden they need to search more. I don't understand the problem, if a topic has been discussed and a person asks about it again and people still respond to the question, who cares? If it is a topic that irritates everyone, then no one will respond. So on this one, and I repeat ONE time I did not search, I happened to hit a subject that had been discussed before (In all truthfulness I thought this was a variation that had not been discussed) and no one answered except for EMT1581. He and I then discussed it. I guess one day I will be perfect and never screw up......lol Edited January 7, 2009 by hallboss Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hallboss 1 Posted January 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 (edited) Wouldn't slugs be less likely to deform? I think Slugs would be less likely, but the likihood of distortion over the course of days is unlikely. This comes with months of storage. There are several options and I thought I was pointing out a new one, but I was informed I was not. Options Use a pin in a fireextinguisher fashion Store without the mag in Store with bolt open Use brass or steel shells in the top position Move the ammo around in the mag during storage every couple of weeks or so. Hope this helps Darin EMT1581 I couldn't appeal, I was the officer. This is why I don't use 'rare' for HD. I know it is stupid and CA has some shitty laws, but I love CA. I was an officer here for years. Aside from some stupid libs, this state is great-Ocean, Mountains, Beautiful women, desert, great farm land, fresh produce, huge beef industry. I love it here. I do know the laws are dumb, but what can you do?.....It is just better to not try to ice skate uphill..... Cheers Edited January 7, 2009 by hallboss Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hobbyshooter 59 Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Wouldn't slugs be less likely to deform? Slugs have a lot of penetration for HD use IMO. You don't want missed shots going through exterior walls (in my neighborhood anyhow). For HD I have the old pump gun loaded up with Nobel LE #4 buck. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ernestmayhand 10 Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Don't you find it interesting that you and I are the ONLY ones commenting in this thread? Not sure what it means...just interesting. -Emt1581 Probably cause this "issue" has been discussed before at great length with a couple different solutions suitable for a couple different needs. Easily found using the search feature on the board. Search, search and more search. Pretty soon this forum is going to be a search engine and not a forum. I wonder why there are certain topics that get beat to death and no one says anything. But when certain people open a topic that had been discussed, all of the sudden they need to search more. I don't understand the problem, if a topic has been discussed and a person asks about it again and people still respond to the question, who cares? If it is a topic that irritates everyone, then no one will respond. So on this one, and I repeat ONE time I did not search, I happened to hit a subject that had been discussed before (In all truthfulness I thought this was a variation that had not been discussed) and no one answered except for EMT1581. He and I then discussed it. I guess one day I will be perfect and never screw up......lol Nothing wrong with all that, I just say because when I have a question for the forum I don't like waiting around for an answer if I can find it by searching. Of course not everyone is search savvy, some things I can't find that you'd think would be so easy. I compare this whole thing to being in class and raising your hand to ask the teacher a question when the answer is right in front of you in the text book. I've got a friend that can't seem to find anything out on his own and I always give him a hard time on his lack of resourcefullness (that's definitely not a word but you get the idea). Anyways, back to class, Tromix 101 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ironhead7544 35 Posted January 11, 2009 Report Share Posted January 11, 2009 Slugs will not deform. Buckshot will deform in about a week. The buckshot with a seperate over shot card can come loose. If you have to store the S12 loaded then put two slugs on top. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.