JWysenski762 0 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 i know this may be the wrong fourm, but ive been posting here a while and know that there is a lot of trust worthy information here. if i go to anothr web site, i dont know any of the posters ect... anyway, im moving out of my dorm (wwhere we cant keep firearms) into my first house this summer, and i need some form of home defence. im only 19, so pistols are out of the question. im much beter with long guns than pistols anyway. so im looking for a 12 guage pump action. i want a pump for reliability, and the sound of a pump is probibly the most menacing sound there is to an intruder in a dark house. it needs to have atleast a 3 inch chamber. and im looking to spend around 200 bucks at most. my friend has a mosberg 500 which i have been impresed with. so ive been looking at the mossberg 590 and the rem. 870. any sugjestions? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 I own a mossberg 500 a remington 870 and the saiga12. I wouldnt rule out a saiga12 because it doesnt pump, as the action coming to battery is pretty darn loud and you know what it is in the dark. if its about the money, go for the mossberg. get one with a stock on it, as well. you cant hit anything with those pistol grip only shotguns at close range half the time. if you ever do have to fire on someone in a house, you want to fire the fewest rounds, meaning you want to know EXACTLY where its going to go when you pull the trigger. if you have a little more money, get the saiga12 or 20. I have yet to find a shell my s12 didnt like, and I get a better follow-up shot with it due to the semiauto and lessened recoil from the gas system. the 870 is nice and all, but I just cant put it above the moss500 or saiga12. the longer barreled 870's like the one I have are great bird guns though. further, both the moss 500 and rem 870 you can buy many stock and barrel options for, and changing the barrels out is pretty easy to do without tools, so you could have a short barrel for HD on it, then later on if you want to shoot skeet, get a long barrel with a sight rib for it. they also make rifled barrels for both guns that shoot slugs a lot more accurately. if it werent about money, I would recommend the saiga12 or 20 to you outright. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyJ 0 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 Saiga 12, Mossberg 500/590, Rem 870, or Maverick 88 (M500 clone, a bit cheaper, better safety location if you're right-handed). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JWysenski762 0 Posted February 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 (edited) well, i kind of ruled out the saiga 12 for a couple reasons. 1 i cant aford it. 2 you cant change out the barels. and 3 from what ive heard you cant beat the reliablility of a pump, especialy if your using hoome defence/ riot rounds, which ive heard can cause short stroking on semis. but im still up in the air on it i guess. Edited February 2, 2005 by JWysenski762 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doerdie 0 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 (edited) Mossberg gets my vote. But you will want the Saiga later, so start saving now. Edited February 2, 2005 by Doerdie Quote Link to post Share on other sites
hoop762 0 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 i recomend the mossberg. ive got one with the 18.5" barrel and a pistol grip shoulder stock. its a sweet home def gun. thats what i have mine for HOOP Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tokageko 8 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 (edited) I must add my two cents here. Take a look at the Chinese-made Ithaca 37 copy. You should be able to find one online at Classic Arms, or locally at Dunhams. Mine cost $129.00 from Dunhams. It's got great sights, a good magazine capacity (3 inch chamber, 5 shot magazine), easy to strip/maintain, accurate, reliable and you can't beat the price. Edited February 2, 2005 by Tokageko Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ricardomagana 0 Posted February 2, 2005 Report Share Posted February 2, 2005 You should try getting a Mossberg 500 Bullpup 12 gauge shotgun I bought it from dodge last saturday and it's an awesome little gun!! Ricky Quote Link to post Share on other sites
expeditionx 1 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 http://www.marstar.ca/Norinco/YL-12-IJ4.htm Ithaca 37 clone exported by Norinco of China. I bought one of these new last year. Extractors wouldn't work reliably. Jammed 3 out of 15 shells. Tried different shells and all had problems extracting. Finally, one got so jammed in the chamber it wouldnt come out. Slide went back shell refused to leave the chamber. Took it back to the shop where I bought it. They said several people had problems with it. Bought a remington 870 home defence model with factory extended magazine instead. Very happy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IndyArms 10,186 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 I have a mossberg, and I have had it for going on 18 years now... its NEVER let me down... a great bird gun, and has killed quite a few deer too ( with the smoothbore barrel no less!) If money is the biggest factor... check into that ithaca copy mentioned a post or two ago there, that sounds like a quite a good deal, to me... ( if the quality is there!) Other than that... stick with the mossberg... inexpensive, time proven reliability, upgradeable, customizeable.... you just cant really go wrong... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gaddis 1,689 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 well, i kind of ruled out the saiga 12 for a couple reasons. 1 i cant aford it. 2 you cant change out the barels. and 3 from what ive heard you cant beat the reliablility of a pump, especialy if your using hoome defence/ riot rounds, which ive heard can cause short stroking on semis. but im still up in the air on it i guess. Hmm, that was one of the same disadvantages I heard of pump shotguns (short stroking the action) while under duress... Of course you *DO* know you're supposed to take out your main home defense firearm for a complete reliability test (plus practice with it regularly) before employing it for a home defense role, right?... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 Mossberg maveric is $199 with screw chokes at the local sports authority. Wally world should be simularly priced. However for HD I have just converted a Saiga .410 for the wife. This one is not cheap, but only because I am using some very nice parts (ergo grip, underfolder, K-var gas piston ,streamlight scorpion) if you were to do a basic conversion the price complete should be around $200 or less. A .410 makes a good replacement for a pistol for HD. Use shot between #4 and #1 to prevent overpenetration with either the 12ga. or a .410. G O B Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tokageko 8 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 expeditionx: I had never heard of that happening. Mine has been great from day one, and this the first complaint I've heard about them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jon elia 0 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 i have a mossberg 500 20 ga with the pistol grip and its a great gun doesn't mess up and is very reliable and easy to break down.....i just wish i had a real stock for it its the 18.5 inch barel i keep #3 buck in it(not 000 but #3) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LeadMonkey 0 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 I have a Maverick 88 works fantastic. Does anyone know where to get a shorter barrel for it? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
expeditionx 1 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 expeditionx: I had never heard of that happening. Mine has been great from day one, and this the first complaint I've heard about them. Mine just had bad extractor springs. Do a search on shotgunworld.com for unc 1201/ norinco clones/ ithaca 37 clone. You might run into a few threads about them. 'ive seen other posts that stated the same issue. Some people have had no problems with them. Ithaca 37 is one of the best designs ever in a pump shotgun. Norinco usually makes very reliable weapons. Weak springs can cause that shotgun to not extract reliably. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tokageko 8 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 ExpeditionX: Thanks. I can easily believe that a run (or 2..) of them was made with bad (improperly tempered, not strong enough, etc.) extractor springs. I agree that the M37 is the best pump gun design ever; nice to meet another fan. Briefly on that topic: what would you think of a semi-auto version of the M37? Anyway, thanks for the reply and the info. Just an after thought, I believe Norinco is also making an 870 clone. I don't remember the price off hand, but it shouldn't be very high. Either way, it might be something to consider. Anyone have experience with those? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyJ 0 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 Leadmonkey, have you gone to the website and e-mailed to ask? A standard M500 barrel should fit, too... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vjor 2 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
expeditionx 1 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 Tokageko, A semi-auto version of the ithaca 37 would be interesting. I think the only change id like to see in a semi-auto version is the bolt lock up onto a barrel lug instead of the bare receiver. This would take stress off of the receiver. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrGrey 0 Posted February 3, 2005 Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 (edited) im only 19, so pistols are out of the question. Not true (at least not in MI). In MI you can buy USED handguns (kinda) at the age of 18. So, have your parent buy the gun you want, and then transfer ownership to you. I had a few friends do this. As far as the Mossberg and 870 are concerned it more or less personal preference. It just depends on who you talk to. I personally own a 870 20ga with synthetic stocks that set me back around $200 used. My Tuarus 605 .357 sits on the nightstand next to my bed and my Jack Russell Terrier sleeps at my feet... That covers defense and alarm systems... Edited February 3, 2005 by MrGrey Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JWysenski762 0 Posted February 3, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2005 in north carolina/ virginia (i knd oflive in both at the moment) its just about imposible for an adult citizen with a clean legal record who votes, pays taxes, and stands ready to be drafted if need be to own a hand gun, or have a beer for that mater (well, legaly on that second one anyway ) *cracks open a PBR* Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ProgCoder 0 Posted February 4, 2005 Report Share Posted February 4, 2005 I have a Maverick 88 works fantastic. Does anyone know where to get a shorter barrel for it? LeadMonkey, The Maverick 88 is made by Mossberg and the barrels are interchangeable with the Mossberg 500. The 18½" barrel is the most inexpensive barrel for the Mossberg 500. I picked one up at Gander Mountain for $79, Cabela's (Cabela's Web Site) sells the 18½" barrel for $69. FYI... Walmart sells the Maverick 88 for $159.00 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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