Poor Man's Armour piercing Slugs

[Patriot12 11]

Is it possible to make a hollow point slug into an armour piercing slug by screwing a small steel screw through the center of the slug? Or is this just urban legend?

[kresk 10,063]

Have heard of epoxying carbide steel to a hollow point but I haven't tried it.

[zakmatthews 14]

Bad idea, I don't think it would work.

 

More importantly, it is illegal:

 

According to the ATF, it is:

ok to OWN AP ammo

ok to SELL AP ammo

ok to BUY AP ammo

ok to SHOOT AP ammo

NOT ok to MAKE AP ammo (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7))

NOT ok to IMPORT AP ammo (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7))

[brickfield mfg 86]

And unless you turned the slug on a lathe to bore a hole dead center for what ever you inserted in there, it would be off balance, and throw off accuracy.

[Bayoupiper 738]

I would just like to point out to our BATF&E visitors that these forums did NOT encourage them and in fact pointed out the illegality of it!

[satellitedr3ams 0]

ive got some "real" ap 2 3/4 slug i got a pic of it on photobucket, my user name is satelltiedr3ams.

[evildog 20]

I would just like to point out to our BATF&E visitors that these forums did NOT encourage them and in fact pointed out the illegality of it!

 

uh..........+1 on what Will said, no use in starting a ship storm besides a 12ga slug will punch some bullet proof glass clear through..........

[Twinsen 86]

It's super easy to make armor piercing slugs. I'll give you a recipe after I post a couple images.

 

 

Recipe for armor piercing slugs:

Step 1: Buy box of 3" Remington 1oz sluggers

Step 2: Shoot them

Step 3: Holes magically appear in stuff

 

'Bullet Proof' Glass Testing

[vbrtrmn 167]

Poor man's armor piercing slugs... if you are a poor man, you probably shouldn't me manufacturing AP slugs, since you probably won't be able to afford a lawyer.

Edited March 6, 2009 by vbrtrmn

[Patriot12 11]

It's super easy to make armor piercing slugs. I'll give you a recipe after I post a couple images.

 

 

Recipe for armor piercing slugs:

Step 1: Buy box of 3" Remington 1oz sluggers

Step 2: Shoot them

Step 3: Holes magically appear in stuff

 

'Bullet Proof' Glass Testing

How many shots did it take to make the first complete hole?

[Patriot12 11]

It's super easy to make armor piercing slugs. I'll give you a recipe after I post a couple images.

 

 

Recipe for armor piercing slugs:

Step 1: Buy box of 3" Remington 1oz sluggers

Step 2: Shoot them

Step 3: Holes magically appear in stuff

 

'Bullet Proof' Glass Testing

How many shots did it take to make the first complete hole?

I had some of this answered when I clicked on the link. Was the glass compromised before the slug was used? I saw that you hit it with a 7.62mm NATO close to where the slug impacted.

[hallboss 1]

I will attest to the hole in bullet proof glass. First round or last round, 12ga slug will go through. But why the necc. for AP, are you going on some type of ramage or something?

[Patriot12 11]

Bad idea, I don't think it would work.

 

More importantly, it is illegal:

 

According to the ATF, it is:

ok to OWN AP ammo

ok to SELL AP ammo

ok to BUY AP ammo

ok to SHOOT AP ammo

NOT ok to MAKE AP ammo (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7))

NOT ok to IMPORT AP ammo (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7))

I have no real intention on making AP rounds, but 18 USC ces 922 reads as if they are refering to pistol ammo, see below. Is this addressed in a different spot including long gun ammo?

 

 

(17)(A) The term "ammunition" means ammunition or cartridge

cases, primers, bullets, or propellent powder designed for use in

any firearm.

( The term "armor piercing ammunition" means -

(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a

handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence

of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of

tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or

depleted uranium; or

(ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber

designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a

weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the

projectile.

 

© The term "armor piercing ammunition" does not include shotgun

shot required by Federal or State environmental or game regulations

for hunting purposes, a frangible projectile designed for target

shooting, a projectile which the Attorney General finds is

primarily intended to be used for sporting purposes, or any other

projectile or projectile core which the Attorney General finds is

intended to be used for industrial purposes, including a charge

used in an oil and gas well perforating device.

(18) The term "Attorney General" means the Attorney General of

the United States (!1)

[Patriot12 11]

I will attest to the hole in bullet proof glass. First round or last round, 12ga slug will go through. But why the necc. for AP, are you going on some type of ramage or something?

Not at all. For one just wondering if it would work, but now that I see how powerful a slug is by its very nature there is definatly no need for AP slugs. Plus, getting the core to be in the exact center would be more trouble than its worth. Bringing up this topic did teach me that 3in slugs will go through bullet proof glass!!

[Patriot12 11]

Poor man's armor piercing slugs... if you are a poor man, you probably shouldn't me manufacturing AP slugs, since you probably won't be able to afford a lawyer.

I was making a loose referance to the book,"Poor Man's James Bond," by Kirk Saxton. This book had similiar projects like this, none of which have I tried. I don't believe he had this idea in his book however.

[Twinsen 86]

FYI that is not my website. A slug is just a LOT of energy all hitting one spot. Stuff can't handle it. Unarmored vehicles don't even stand up to 9mm, slugs are going to kill anyone in a truck or whatever. And this shows that humvee glass won't either.

 

Also, slugs aren't shaped like you think they are. They're hollow. There isn't a lot of purchase there for a rod, like any pistol or rifle ammo has.

 

ETA PIC

Edited March 6, 2009 by Twinsen

[lipadj46 2]

I would also add that a shotgun slug is not really a "penetrating" round. Its a knockdown round that is slow but large in mass with a big diameter and good expansion. You use a shotgun for knockdown and stopping power. Will it go through armored stuff? Yes to a point but if you want true AP ability like actually shooting through steel armor get a rifle with a proper tungsten penetrator round, the higher velocity the better. Yes there are sabot shotgun rounds that would be more suited to AP but then you need to go to a rifled barrel and the velocities still are not near that of a rifle.

[Ronswin 26]

Is it possible to make a hollow point slug into an armour piercing slug by screwing a small steel screw through the center of the slug? Or is this just urban legend?

 

A version of this is already out in the market:

 

12 Gauge Armor Piercing Ammo

 

It's effectiveness is probably questionable though. Europeans had a solid bronze sabot-type slug years ago that had no problem going through small compact cars. The Russians had experimented with a solid steel rod-type slug for limited armor-piercing and defeating door locks. These sabot and solid metal slugs can only be used in a cylinder bore barrel. Sabot slugs work the best in rifled barrels.

[Patriot12 11]

Is it possible to make a hollow point slug into an armour piercing slug by screwing a small steel screw through the center of the slug? Or is this just urban legend?

 

A version of this is already out in the market:

 

12 Gauge Armor Piercing Ammo

 

It's effectiveness is probably questionable though. Europeans had a solid bronze sabot-type slug years ago that had no problem going through small compact cars. The Russians had experimented with a solid steel rod-type slug for limited armor-piercing and defeating door locks. These sabot and solid metal slugs can only be used in a cylinder bore barrel. Sabot slugs work the best in rifled barrels.

I question the quality of these rounds. I am beginning to think that slugs are fine left alone. If a slug is not going to do the job, then you are in real trouble!!

[THE_HUNTER 2]

Old school BRI Sabot Slugs are very penetrative. Stay away from the old school BRI slugs in 3" mag, they are too long and will not fit or function well in 3"mag guns. I was stuck once with a bunch I bought before.

Remember the movie "Alien Nation"? They starred in there!

Edited March 6, 2009 by THE_HUNTER

[IndyArms 10,186]

Dont forget folks, that the "bulletproof glass" shown in the pictures above is not "TRUE" Bulletproof glass. It is a Lexan plastic polymer that is bullet resistant... OBVIOUSLY it is NOT bulletproof.

 

Real bulletproof glass is made of layers of glass and polymer that are heated and laminated together. It is a MUCH different thing than the stuff they showed pictures of here and shot at.

 

I still want to see the official testing of the standard ball or AP .50 BMG round against TRUE Bulletproof glass!!!

 

[Bvamp 604]

last year at the florida shoot, we did some penetration tests on a material that I will not mention, nor mention its use. The 12 gauge slugs I shot it with went through it like it wasnt there. We all had a talk about a few issues, and I think what was come up with was a viable solution to the problem.

 

 

as for something a little more effective than a deer slug, well, Dixie slugs of course, but I dont think you want to fire them down your saiga.

[DavidQ 170]

Has anyone ever seen this ammo before? http://www.deltaforce.com/catalog/12gaugeammo.html. Might open your possibilities for home defense.

[Mitch'SS 2]

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/AMM005-1.html

[Patriot12 11]

Has anyone ever seen this ammo before? http://www.deltaforce.com/catalog/12gaugeammo.html. Might open your possibilities for home defense.

I am suspicious of gimick ammo. Quality, safety, and true effectiveness come into question.

 

Has anyone tried any of these rounds and can testify that they work as advertiesed?

[vbrtrmn 167]

I was making a loose referance to the book,"Poor Man's James Bond," by Kirk Saxton. This book had similiar projects like this, none of which have I tried. I don't believe he had this idea in his book however.

 

I've heard of it, I was just f*ing with you

[Eric Pate 478]

Don't forget about the Sauvestre.

http://www.sauvestre.com/index_us.htm

Be sure to click on the "stopping power" link on the left to check out the size of that wound cavity!

[vbrtrmn 167]

I've got another question... What are you shooting at which is wearing armor?

 

And a comment...

If you are shooting at a lightly armored human target with a slug, you're likely to do some serious shock damage to his organs, even if the slug doesn't penetrate the armor.

Edited March 6, 2009 by vbrtrmn

[Patriot12 11]

I've got another question... What are you shooting at which is wearing armor?

 

And a comment...

If you are shooting at a lightly armored human target with a slug, you're likely to do some serious shock damage to his organs, even if the slug doesn't penetrate the armor.

This thread has definatly generated interesting discussions. I have no intention on making, buy, or firing armour piercing slugs of any kind. I was just woundering how easily one could be made. I have defininatly learned alot from this thread and have learned new respect for 12ga slugs.

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

Box O Truth is a great source of info on stuff like this. If you see what kind of a crater it leaves through Class IIIa armor , you will see that it is still effective.

 

From what I have read, even though a slug doesn't penetrate, it usually has enough force to cause a fatal cardiac arrhythmia by knocking off the central nervous system with the impact. At that point penetration isn't what you need.

Edited March 6, 2009 by BuffetDestroyer