Jump to content

afraid to even go here but got to ask


Recommended Posts

Making the assumption that you won't get jammed up committing a federal gun crime because the cops probably don't know the law is not a very good plan. You might be right, but it would really really suck if you are wrong.

 

Compliance is easy and fairly cheap.

Edited by dftc
Link to post
Share on other sites

A 922r violation would probably be used as a 'pile on' charge along with others incurred committing a crime. Don't know of anyone who's actually ever been charged, but wouldn't you feel really stupid if you were the first one?

Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree, most local LEOs aren't going to know what 922r is, the only thing they're generally worried about is if your gun is full-auto or not. It is going to be unlikely that you're going to run into one who is familiar with ATF federal laws. If you do happen to have issues, they're not going to just confiscate just the gun, they're going to arrest you; don't try to explain anything, just say only two things, "Please contact the local ATF Field Office" and "I want a lawyer."

 

Overall I agree with tritium, 922r is probably never going to come up, unless the firearm is being used for a nefarious purpose. Someone using their firearm in such manner isn't really going to care about 922r anyway.

Link to post
Share on other sites

How could something like this happen? Say Obama decides he wants to start confiscating guns, so he orders the ATF to patrol ranges looking for any violations they can. The ATF can get a blanket search warrant (similar to an alcohol checkpoint by the highway patrol) and inspect anyone's firearms on the premises. Guess what? They look at your gun, see foreign furniture and a foreign trigger, and immediately raise a red flag. Then they take it apart for a detailed inspection, and you're toast. You're going to jail and you'll never see your gun again. You'll never be able to own guns again, either. Remember: the ATF makes up their own laws and operates largely outside the law. Even if they have to lie, bend the truth, or tamper with evidence, they will find a way to convict you. Very few people have ever won a case against the ATF.

Edited by Mike the Wolf
Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd like to bring a little reality check for all the people who are betting that the only reason this would ever come up is if a local LEO randomly comes across them and also happens to know federal guns laws.

 

1) The law you are talking about violating on the chance that no one will know or care is not a small one. It's not like rolling through a stop sign because no other cars are at the intersection. The penalties if you are caught and convicted could be severe. Frankly it's a really stupid chance to take when it's so easy to avoid the issue altogether by replacing a few parts.

Based on the wording of the law I personally don't even believe 922r applies to individual owners, but until the issue gets cleared up I make sure my rifles are 922r compliant. I don't want to be the ATF's test case.

 

2) It is correct that most local LEOs will not know the details of 922r off the top of their head, and I sincerely doubt any would care unless you give them a reason to. I'm not sure most locals could enforce 922r even if they did know about it.

 

3) If your firearm ever becomes an issue for the local cops (say you shoot a bad guy in your house) it's very likely that this sort of thing may be checked. There are a whole lot of laws out there and no way for a cop to know all of them, so they become good at looking them up and using other resources.

Some detective who's been off the streets for 20 years and hasn't ever handled any firearm but his service revolver and maybe a shotgun will call up the local ATF office and say something like, "This guy has an AK-47, isn't that illegal?", to which their local ATF guy will say, "Maybe. Why don't you let us take a peek at it."

Edited by dftc
Link to post
Share on other sites

cino, It's not beat to death. You see used weapons sold all the time that the seller didn't have a clue was not compliant. And the buyer, if not up on the law thinks it's totally legal, since it's sold above board. This is so true with kit wepons or pre/post/sunset confusion. Just the average shooter, especially now, with ant-gun government, alot of people are getting to just get one and have no clue. As a favor to a couple bait/firearm stores, I often am asked if compliant on weapons taken on trade. Amazed at what you find, and these sellers are not meaning to break the law. Sort of like the tax code, confuse enuff people, including the enforcement officers, make everyone quilty. :smoke:

Link to post
Share on other sites

Another way to think about it - Actually, bringing your weapon into 922r compliance with quality American aftermarket parts can make the weapon even better than it was in it's original form. So the ATF is actually doing us a favor with this 922r crap. Lol.

Edited by gothchick
Link to post
Share on other sites

I was LEO for 20 years. I was a rangemaster, armorer, and firearms instructor much of that time. I would rountinely check the seized guns (and play with them of course....) All we worried about was full auto or not.

 

But, with that said, a Tapco G2 set (3 parts) is $30, a US pistol grip (1 part) $10-20, US made magazine $20 (3 parts), US made followers $2-3 (1 part), US piston $20, or a butt stock ($30 to $50). 922r compliance is way too cheap not to do.

Edited by imarangemaster
Link to post
Share on other sites

Speaking as a police officer....Some LEO's know about 922 and how this law works, however unless there are other issues involved, generally its nothing to loose sleep over. Mot police have little interest in whether a flash hider is stamped "made in the USA" or not. This normally only becomes an issue if other charges are being brought and we want to introduce 922 compliance into the mix.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Remember the pistol grip doesn't count as a 922r part if the rifle didn't have one to begin with. If there are any questions about the parts just slap a new trigger group and find 1 or 2 more things to swap. It sure is better than going to prison because the dude who built the thing in the first place didn't give a shit about any laws.

Link to post
Share on other sites

+1 KVAR mag folowers are only $2 each, or $10 for 12. They are one part. Floor plates are $6. US handguards like Tapco or KVAR add a part. US pistol grip ($12) adds a part, US buttstock ($30-$42) adds a part, a gas piston ($18) adds a part. The Tapco G2 fire control group is only $29 for a trigger hammer and disconnector, count as 3 parts, and have the best trigger pull. My 7.62x39 Saiga has a 2 lb pull, as did the G2 in the WASR that I traded in for it.

 

Compliance isd so simple and inexpensive, it would be absolutely stupid to take a chance! :haha:

Edited by imarangemaster
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Most ATF agents dont even agree on how to interpret this law. Just write to the ATF yourself twice with the same question and there is a good change you will get two different answers back. just make your rig legal and dont worry about all this.

Link to post
Share on other sites

hello thanks for all the info, I just bought my first saiga 12 IZ-109 , 19 " barrel, stock no upgrades and 1 AGP 10 round mag , Im a little confused with the 922r , if I keep my gun stock keep it the way it is , and use the US made mag with it will it be 922r compliant ? or do I have to use the 5 round mag only that came with it . thanks in advance. oh I have yet to shoot it

Edited by csl
Link to post
Share on other sites

It's not that you need to add one additional US made part, but rather you need to eliminate one additional foriegn made part that is on their list of parts they count to determin if the gun is foriegn made or US made.

 

If your barrel is threaded, then it probably has atleast a thread protector screwed on it. I believe the thread protector is considered a foriegn made muzzle device, therefore an additional foriegn made part that the rifles do not come with.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Most ATF agents dont even agree on how to interpret this law. Just write to the ATF yourself twice with the same question and there is a good change you will get two different answers back. just make your rig legal and dont worry about all this.
I thought the ATF just made shit up as they go. If they want to bust you, it doesn't matter if you're in compliance or not. They will monkey-rig your weapon, and off to prison you go. 922r is a big heaping pile of BS that is selectively and unethically enforced. Edited by gothchick
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Chatbox

    Load More
    You don't have permission to chat.
×
×
  • Create New...