grendelz 61 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 I am new here and to saigas in general. In all my research about conversions your name always came up as one, if not the best at conversions. I know you are not taking new orders for awhile so I hit up gunbroker.com and find people selling TROMIX STYLE converted saigas. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=127365436 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=127365436 In the second post he even goes as far to insult the HK sights and charging handle that I have seen on some of your conversions. In the first post he dropped the TROMIX STYLE bullshit. As a business man I would seriously be pissed off at people trying to sell substandard product as one of my own. I just wanted your take on this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR Young 175 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 I couldn't get past your avatar.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmax4x4 68 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 I have seen that up for weeks. I asked the seller a question (This is a BONA-FIDE Saiga 12 Tromix conversion) (Auction is for one Tromix STYLE Saiga 12 conversion) What's that? Is the gun converted BY Tromix or is that what the STYLE part is about? I hope you all do the same. That is like the paneosonic TV they sell down town. Genuine imitation leather. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
joelrod47 373 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Heh, heh, heh............. .............and he couldn't even pass it off to you (new guy) as a TROMIX gun !!!! Pretty weak......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
reoiv 1 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 The shark breaks don't look right to me unless they coated them in something. They also seem like they've been beveled at the back. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 It's a fuzzy pic, but it looks like one of ours. The new ones are bigger. The problem is this guy is calling the gun a "Tromix Conversion", when actually it's a gun converted by someone else using Tromix parts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Juggernaut 11,054 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 Tricky wording..... The waiting list at Tromix is 3 years - GET YOURS NOW! BUY NOW ATTENTION: This is a BONA-FIDE Saiga 12 Tromix conversion, actual tromix parts used for the remanufacturing of this shotgun Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 It's intentionally misleading and ambigulous. "Auction is for one Tromix STYLE Saiga 12 conversion." Tsk, tsk. Shameful. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 LMAO I just read this part! "This gun does NOT come with the useless HK type sites or the ridiculously large charging handle! DON'T WAIT 3 YEARS. BUY THIS SHOTGUN." Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 I LOVE this part - "Shipping will be my FFL dealer to yours. All ATF rules, federal, and state laws apply. Know your laws." HIS FFL DEALER - WOW - Know your laws? WOWOH OH OH somebody dare me to do it. now if that aint profiteering as well as gunsmithing without a license, I dunno what is. And the best part? they are 40 minutes away from me. Thats all on Tony, though, not my business. I know you all would have my head if I went to the sheriff with the laws printed out in bold type for them along with this auction. I will just say this, though, Tony dont deserve this type of people using his name and sweat while breaking two laws (gotta buy it first for it to be broken, and why stop at one, buy both guns, double the fun), and dont come screaming bloody hell when the gun grabbers pass more stupid laws because of people like this guy not being punished even when they claim full knowledge of the law. Its not like they wont know who BVamp is, but let me ask them if its been fired or not, at least. Oh, and nice weld and polish job. Even I can do better than that, and I am shit at welding. The finish looks flawed across the whole reciever, as well. I mean, look at the safety stop as well. I REALLY hope that this isnt one of the guys here, because this is a fucking DISGRACE. And Im even saying this, even working with Tony's direct competition! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
clifton 354 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 On top of that they look pretty shitty too.. maybe welded up in the back and painted over original finish.. not looking good. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 ...And Im even saying this, even working with Tony's direct competition! Thanks Ben. There's certainly plenty of room in the market for quality builders like Tony and Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
protected static 19 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 LMAO I just read this part! "This gun does NOT come with the useless HK type sites or the ridiculously large charging handle! DON'T WAIT 3 YEARS. BUY THIS SHOTGUN." Dunno if it's a board member or not (I'd suspect that it is) but it's definitely someone who reads the board - the line now reads: "This gun does NOT come with the HK type sites or the large charging handle!" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 yeh well, shame on you, whoever you are. If you know what a saiga is, and know there are parts for it, you come here. OF COURSE this person has seen this thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
satellitedr3ams 0 Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 they know they are phony Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vbrtrmn 167 Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 (edited) So, just for fun, I questioned the guy on the validity of his "Bonafide Tromix" claim, here's his response... removed per request Edited April 24, 2009 by vbrtrmn Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 23, 2009 Report Share Posted April 23, 2009 yeh, where is it STAMPED with Diavolo's stamp? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gunfixr 76 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I bet Tony will just laugh this off. Anybody who knows anything about Saigas and their conversions, not to mention quality work, will see this for what it is. He just makes the rest of us look that much better. Anybody who would buy that wouldn't come to any of us anyway. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nailbomb 10,221 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 (edited) imitators ARE recognition. I think tony knows this. +1 to gunfixr. Edited April 24, 2009 by Nailbomb Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TonyRumore 1,332 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I don't sweat the small shit................ Tony Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 I knew Tony wouldn't care, this stuff is regular. "The work is still superior that is why I do offer a 3 day money back guarentee as long as it does not leave the FFL dealer it gos to." - Oh yeah, that's quite a guarantee all right. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
joelrod47 373 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 TROMIX guns are the benchmark for conversions !! ............and rightfully so............. These guys tagging their ads, etc..., with the TROMIX name are like the guys downtown selling "Relox watches" to unsuspecting, uninformed tourists.............. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bounce12 407 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 The world is full of knock-offs. I fully expect see knock-offs of Juggernaut's shirts by this afternoon. If you've ever been to any kind of seminar, you will see knock-offs of every other seminar out there as well. It's shameful, but the good news is that those who come up with the original ideas to begin with will soon have a new and profitable idea to launch on. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 this guy is breaking the law, and nobody gives a shit. thats lovely. Dont whine when more laws are put in place, when people get away with this shit left and right and the gun grabbers SEE it happening. Why bother getting an FFL retailer license and attach a gunsmithing FFL to it? I HIGHLY doubt Mr Diavolo did the work on this gun, unless it was him doing a couple of quick welds for the guy to do the finish work on, but I honestly dont see that happening. Either way, to hell with it. I hope they make lots and lots of money doing this. Making good money off someone else's name is not cool, either, regardless of all other legalities and such. I hope someone tries it with CGW, because even the TINIEST fucking over isnt responded to very well by either Mr Cole, or myself. I really am honestly surprised at the responses here. Oh well, I guess. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 this guy is breaking the law, and nobody gives a shit. thats lovely. Dont whine when more laws are put in place, when people get away with this shit left and right and the gun grabbers SEE it happening. Why bother getting an FFL retailer license and attach a gunsmithing FFL to it? I HIGHLY doubt Mr Diavolo did the work on this gun, unless it was him doing a couple of quick welds for the guy to do the finish work on, but I honestly dont see that happening. Either way, to hell with it. I hope they make lots and lots of money doing this. Making good money off someone else's name is not cool, either, regardless of all other legalities and such. I hope someone tries it with CGW, because even the TINIEST fucking over isnt responded to very well by either Mr Cole, or myself. I really am honestly surprised at the responses here. Oh well, I guess. Ben some people try and spend most of their energy working and doing positive things. Others get themselves all worked up over nothing. You live close enough to Diavolo....if you are so concerned about this then why not go pay him a visit like you tried to do before when he first came here? You can ask him yourself....or better yet, maybe try sending the guy a PM? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
protected static 19 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 this guy is breaking the law, and nobody gives a shit. thats lovely. Dont whine when more laws are put in place, when people get away with this shit left and right and the gun grabbers SEE it happening. Why bother getting an FFL retailer license and attach a gunsmithing FFL to it? How is he breaking the law? How does what he's doing differ from people selling their converted Saigas in the WTS/WTB forums here? (I'm not trying to yank your chain or anything - I really don't get it...) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 cobra - actually I have some business to discuss with Mr Lapella this afternoon, I was going to mention it to him while I had him on the phone. Thank you so much for your guidance and concern(s). I would never have thought to ask Chris if hes aware someone attached his name to those weapons. protected static - ill start tracking down the two laws on account that you have actually asked somewhat politely, and I do appreciate the manner in which you asked, so Ill dig the regulations up and PM them to you when I get a chance. I got an email from the seller stating the gun is unfired and brand new. anyhow - toodles!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 How is he breaking the law? How does what he's doing differ from people selling their converted Saigas in the WTS/WTB forums here? (I'm not trying to yank your chain or anything - I really don't get it...) He refers to the gun as a "Tromix Conversion", intentionally misleading the buyer into believing that it was converted by Tromix. It was not. It was made by someone else using readily available Tromix parts. It's a tricky wording, so there is some question as to whether or not you could make a case, but IMO it's theft of trademark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
protected static 19 Posted April 24, 2009 Report Share Posted April 24, 2009 (edited) 18 USC chapter 44 <snip> Interesting. This is the first time I've seen these referenced, so thanks for that. There's a lot to think about there. And @BobAsh - yeah, the trademark issue occurred to me (along with possible fraud/consumer protection issues), but Bvamp's initial post suggested possible ATF violations that I'd never heard of before. Edited April 24, 2009 by protected static Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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