7.62 x 39 quality

[vegasdom 0]

Where does the siaga rank? What better if any?

[SOPMOD 254]

Where does the siaga rank? What better if any?

 

 

The Saiga is an AK100 series rifle modified by Izhmash to be importable under US restrictions.I own FEG,Arsenal Las Vegas(boat anchor),Arsenal Bulgaria(nice),Maadi(boat anchor),Cugir Romania(rough but functional),Zastava Yugoslavia(primitive but nice looking),Norinco(obsolete rough),Polytech (nice but rough)and the converted Saigas are my favorite,

 

Mandrel/Hammer Forged Barrels,Modern manufacturing techniques,hardened rivets(all other AKs have soft rivets) and it has RUSSIAN markings and proof marks just like the latest Russian Kalashnikovs.

 

Other than a Vepr or a late production Valmet or Galil I wouldn't say my Saigas take a backseat to any AK ever made.

 

In fact I have thought about trading off all of the other brands AKs I have purchased and buying all Saigas and the only thing that stops me are the narrow stem bolts/carriers in 7.62x39 are not common enough for me to have a good selection of spares.

 

As far as actual AKs go I would say the VEPR is "Better" but it is only produced in limited numbers and it's an acquired taste since they are all blued steel and heavy barreled they aren't quite as handy or field tough as the Saiga.

Edited May 22, 2009 by SOPMOD

[nalioth 405]

As far as actual AKs go I would say the VEPR is "Better" but it is only produced in limited numbers and it's an acquired taste since they are all blued steel and heavy barreled they aren't quite as handy or field tough as the Saiga.

The VEPR is no longer produced at all.

 

The Molot Arsenal (where VEPRs were made) ceased to exist several years ago, when it was lost in a lawsuit to Izhmash.

 

Izhmash offers the "Saiga-M" today, which is similar to the VEPR.

[imarangemaster 315]

Saiga is number one! Accuracy from Saiga surpasses all other AKs (I owned Yugo, polytech. and several romanians, and they weren't close!)

[xbox360 1]

also Saigas are waaay cheaper than yugos, wasr10 and others

[jswledhed 57]

There was an article posted in this forum that described and rated all the various AKs on the market. If I remember correctly, the VEPR and converted Saiga topped the list in regards to quality.

[Kymasabe 1]

I've owned a bunch of AK's and Saiga's. The only gun that had a better fit and finish, better machining, and overall better quality was my Armory USA Bulgarian SSR-85C2 with the thicker-than-usual 1.6mm receiver. That rifle was awesome and the new ones aren't even close in quality. So, it's Saiga's for me now.

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

^ Personally I don't particularly like the 1.6mm receiver models. They're too damn heavy in comparison to models with 1mm receivers. Sure they're a bit more durable in theory.. but it's just not necessary. Standard stamped receiver AK's are more than tough enough.

 

To each his own, though, and I will admit that the only AK type rifle I own with the heavy receiver, (and heavy RPK-type trunnion), is a Yugo M70A2 underfolder. She is a nice rifle and I like the underfolding stock, but she's one heavy bitch in comparison to my Russian. I haven't handled or fired the Bulgarian model you've got.

Edited May 24, 2009 by post-apocalyptic

[Kymasabe 1]

Post, I've handled some of the new Bulgarian stuff and it's downright sloppy in comparison to the gun I used to own. It never really felt heavy to me, just solid and smooooth. But, since then, it's only the Saiga's that I like and the Saiga's have been more accurate than most of the other AK-style rifles I've fired.

[SOPMOD 254]

As far as actual AKs go I would say the VEPR is "Better" but it is only produced in limited numbers and it's an acquired taste since they are all blued steel and heavy barreled they aren't quite as handy or field tough as the Saiga.

The VEPR is no longer produced at all.

 

The Molot Arsenal (where VEPRs were made) ceased to exist several years ago, when it was lost in a lawsuit to Izhmash.

 

Izhmash offers the "Saiga-M" today, which is similar to the VEPR.

 

Hmmm,I didn't know that.They seem to have a glut of them still in Europe but we get none of them here.

 

Oh well,remove the VEPR from my list since it will no doubt become the rifle of dusty safe queen vintage in the hands of pathetic gun yuppies as a "Collector's Item".

 

Sad,it really was the best one..

[Agias 0]

The Molot Arsenal (where VEPRs were made) ceased to exist several years ago, when it was lost in a lawsuit to Izhmash.

 

Hmmm,I didn't know that.They seem to have a glut of them still in Europe but we get none of them here.

That rumor has been around for a while. At first i believed it, but then Molot showed up at IWA2008 so for now i'm calling BS on that. Next month i'll find out if they were there this year, because the gun mag i read does a full report on the event every year.

 

They might have lost a lawsuit, but they most likely didn't cease production since they're supplying the russian army with all the RPKs and 9x39 rifles among others. Even if they're owned by Izmash now they must still be putting out all that sweet stuff.

 

EDIT: I'm stupid, they don't make the 9x39 stuff, that's Tula.

Edited May 24, 2009 by Agias

[unclejake 428]

The Saiga is the first AK that I have "owned", but I have handled about all of them except the VEPR, and the Arsonal, and the Saiga is hands down the best handling, most accurate AK of the lot. I simply love ma Saigas! I still like to play with my other rifles, but the Saigas get way more rounds put through them.

[oxyehho 8]

The Molot Arsenal (where VEPRs were made) ceased to exist several years ago, when it was lost in a lawsuit to Izhmash.

 

Hmmm,I didn't know that.They seem to have a glut of them still in Europe but we get none of them here.

That rumor has been around for a while. At first i believed it, but then Molot showed up at IWA2008 so for now i'm calling BS on that. Next month i'll find out if they were there this year, because the gun mag i read does a full report on the event every year.

 

They might have lost a lawsuit, but they most likely didn't cease production since they're supplying the russian army with all the RPKs and 9x39 rifles among others. Even if they're owned by Izmash now they must still be putting out all that sweet stuff.

Nalioth, you are not entirely correct.

Indeed Molot lost their lawsuit to Izhmash on patent payments on AK design weapons (as well as SVD's) in 2002. That was really worth less than $16MM, although a large sum for Molot, not really a death warrant. Here is a link to details go to page 17 Izhmash did purchase a huge ownership stake in 2005 and appointed a chairman from one of their own people, but Russian government still owns controlling stake - 51% of voting stock. If you are able to read Russian - here is a description of current pitiful state of the company: from local newspaper

What I got from that article is that the plant is in terrible shape from mismanagement and also that Russian government is promising to help, but nothing materialized from that promise yet. Their government is also trying to reorg their weapons industry and it seems Izhmash is the core for the new "holding" weapons company, which makes Molot people not comfortable at all.

One more thing - their official web site went down a few weeks ago.

But the bottom line is the Molot plant is still alive and producing VEPRs, although the quality must've come down dramatically, since according to the above cited article almost all of the highly qualified workers left the plant to work elsewhere.