bohound 281 Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 (edited) Not THIS argument again... [words, words, words...] I still would rather have a Sig 556. All the advantages of both worlds. Where you been Floyd? This particular argument is really, really old. Must have missed it the first, second, third and fourth time around... This is EXACTLY the reason my Saiga is chambered in .223/5.56... Plus with a bit of modification I'm able to run AR mags if it came to that (I run Galils, and I have a LOT of them!) At roughly 1/2 the cost of an unmodified Sig (although they are eye candy!), I have a highly modified and specialized tool. (That isn't your run of the mill "spray and pray" AK) Can you say BOOYAA? Edited December 13, 2010 by bohound 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 I'm going with a Saiga 7.62x39, w/20" barrel, Bullpupped(my own design). Simple, reliable, Can hit mansized target at 400yrds, better penatration, 75rnd drum/mag availablity and perhaps the most stashed round in the US/world. IF I find access to .223 ammo, I'll likely find matching weaponry nearby. Also, NOT so expensive as to be out a lot if needed to ditch the rifle. And, to me, Full Auto is fun but a waste of ammo. Not good in a SHTF. Just my two bits Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mayor Al 41 Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 My choice would probably be "All of the Above" for the whole family ! Plus a neighbor has a Ma Deuce that he blasts off every 4th of July...I'll put him in the Barn-Tower to cover us all. I have a very real "Ace in the Hole". I have 6 sons and 2 S-I-L's. One S-I-L is a worthless twit, but the other, and my 6 boys (between the ages of 32 and 43) are quite capable marksmen, two are currently on Active-Duty (both Army Armor, WO and 2LT). (We'll use the twit for bait!!) So, While I can't field an 'Army' I can bring to the front a Squad of guys I can trust who will do what has to be done to keep the WHOLE family safe from harm. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HBTANK 0 Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 If i only get one then its hands down a AK Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darko 42 Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 I'm mainly going to focus on AMMO. Doesn't matter what you have if you're all out of gun pills. I'll stick with one or two medium range rifles, maybe a .308 too, and the S12. If I had to pick one, it'd probably have to be a 7.69 AK-Type. Reliable, plentiful ammo supply, and can feed the family if it needs to. Although Major Al's plan seems pretty solid too Quote Link to post Share on other sites
YARP 300 Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 If SHTF what would you rather have? 5 midget pole dancers, a kiddie pool and enough Jack Daniels to last a lifetime..... What? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darko 42 Posted December 17, 2010 Report Share Posted December 17, 2010 If SHTF what would you rather have? 5 midget pole dancers, a kiddie pool and enough Jack Daniels to last a lifetime..... What? Only 5? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
diamondback 56 Posted December 18, 2010 Report Share Posted December 18, 2010 (edited) Ideally, as far as guns: 1 of each option in the Ready Racks, plus more each in all the world's common and larger-user-proprietary (did the ChiComs move to that indig round they were talking about for a while IIRC, or still on 5.45 or 7.62?) military chamberings. I'll grab whatever I deem best suited to whatever form of COMWEC I'm facing... Edited December 18, 2010 by Diamondback Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mayor Al 41 Posted December 18, 2010 Report Share Posted December 18, 2010 (edited) Hey Darko, I humbly let you know the highest rank I saw in my Army time was SP/5 (E-5). My user name here is M A Y O R AL , as in the CEO of a town in Cajon Pass CA that hasn't had a single resident since about 1950. A class I taught for several years for Cal-State was a field study of that area, and my friends decided I promoted the site so well that I desrved to be MAYOR ! Since there are no living voters left in the town, I can never be voted out Hence MAYOR AL ! Edited December 18, 2010 by Mayor Al Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darko 42 Posted December 19, 2010 Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 Hey Darko, I humbly let you know the highest rank I saw in my Army time was SP/5 (E-5). My user name here is M A Y O R AL , as in the CEO of a town in Cajon Pass CA that hasn't had a single resident since about 1950. A class I taught for several years for Cal-State was a field study of that area, and my friends decided I promoted the site so well that I desrved to be MAYOR ! Since there are no living voters left in the town, I can never be voted out Hence MAYOR AL ! LOL i swore i saw MAJOR. Well congrats on being voted Mayor. May your rule be long and just Quote Link to post Share on other sites
diamondback 56 Posted December 19, 2010 Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 1950, huh? I know a bunch of wannabe throwbacks who wish they could turn the clock back to that era that might be interested in movin' in... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mayor Al 41 Posted December 19, 2010 Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 Diamondback, I left the area 10 years ago when I retired from teaching. I really like it here in the Ohio Valley with lots of family around etc etc, but there is something about that part of SoCal that really grows on you. Cajon Pass is where the San Andreas Fault crosses thru the mountains North and East of L A. At times I miss that historic area a lot. Mayor AL Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted December 19, 2010 Report Share Posted December 19, 2010 I can understand that AL, I used to live in the East Central Arizona area. Lots of OLD abandoned mining towns, etc. I miss that "Old West" feel. But Ohio has it's perks. Like a decent job, lol. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darko 42 Posted December 20, 2010 Report Share Posted December 20, 2010 well, if S really does HTF, us midwest boys need to hook up. i'm gonna wear a S12 patch on my jacket just so yall can recognize me Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CPE1704TKS 24 Posted December 21, 2010 Report Share Posted December 21, 2010 If SHTF trully happens, another CIC? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
YARP 300 Posted January 24, 2011 Report Share Posted January 24, 2011 If SHTF what would you rather have? 5 midget pole dancers, a kiddie pool and enough Jack Daniels to last a lifetime..... What? Only 5? Maybe 20...........So I can crowd surf! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sidewinderl 43 Posted January 25, 2011 Report Share Posted January 25, 2011 My SPAS 12. WTF you say? Well first of all it's a 12 gauge, so ammo is easy to come by. It also makes a very effective club or hammer, and the hook is obviously useful for hooking things. The heatshield also slices or grates cheese depending on which direction you rub the cheese against it. What more could you possibly ask for? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Acer2428 4 Posted January 27, 2011 Report Share Posted January 27, 2011 This thread is too funny. Just read through all 6 pages of it. Asking on the Saiga/AK forum is pretty humorous too. I have a few AK's (all crap WASR's), and now a Saiga, and several AR's along with a slew of other things. My LO would be: - 12.5" AR-15 w/ AP (Obv. carry several mags, some w/ 75GR HP's, other 62 gr. penetrators) on 2-point sling - 20" AR-10 in 7.62x51 w/ Bushnell elite 6500 2.5-16x optic and micro red dot on offset mount - CZ SP-01 Both primary arms could be pressed into dual service if I run out of ammo for one or the other simply by a few latches on the QD optics mounts. CZ is a battle-Tested BA pistol that I trust my life to. 19rd. mags don't hurt either. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted January 30, 2011 Report Share Posted January 30, 2011 Gotta be the Tromix S-12. Reliable as hell. Ammo's easy to get. 20 shots without reloading. Accurate enough with slugs out to 100yds. Anything else I can pick up from those who don't need it anymore. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bvamp 604 Posted January 31, 2011 Report Share Posted January 31, 2011 well, im gonna just have to comment. this shtf crap cracks me up. first of all, shit hits the fan and a firefight happening, ill run you the fuck over with my truck, for starters. now, in the NEXT scenario, the one thats gonna happen by the time i am in the ground, and the world goes to shit slowly.... Ill take my .22 an axe and a big fucking knife and 20,000 rounds of .22LR. and id still put one through their eye like a good citizen, if i have to. now if you are talking your neighborhood suddenly erupts into war? Ill take a 12 gauge AK any day of the week for a "lets play pretend and not know what its even like to spill blood" gun. the SHTF weapon is a fucking large knife and a goddamn .22 folks. if you find an engagement when this place goes to shit, im sure there will be more guns than fighters. this isnt a 3rd world country. Ill be up on the hill watching with my binoculars and laughing. have at it, and bring them the good fight. Ill be there waiting out in the woods when you want to eat. 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
docwade 3 Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Like Deniro says, it's a tool for a toolbox, you put the tools in the box for the job you have. 22lr is THE goto gun for high mobility, low impact. Out of the choices listed though, I'd go with 7.62x39. It is sort of like a Swiss army knife. It doesn't do any particular job excellently, but can do most jobs satisfactorily. I had 46 variants, but sadly am down to twenty now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rockopr 8 Posted March 4, 2011 Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 if it happens i would love to see some people here who talk about using the saiga 12 hauling the ammo..... I mean what's the weight of 250 shots of shotshell compared to the weight of ar or ak ammo? Totally understand the many scenarios we will find but given the premise of the shtf situation i will leave the shotguns in the house for my family to protect it.i will go out with both my Ar and my AK and trust me,i will never leave my house without a 9MM.AR for the ones that come from far,Ak for the one's near and when i run out of ammo i know that i will find 9mm in every waste basket i look into..... I'm a big guy and i think that for me to carry a Saiga with 5 or 6 mags or drums and have to really move fast on a real situation it would be very cumbersome if not impossible,90% of the guys who say they will do it will end up dead,everyone knows that. If i can kill someone from far away i will do it ,i won't let you get close to me if i have the means even more in a situation in wich everyone will be trying to survive.... I don't know if anyone thinks the same way i do ,but i think that like in the wild ,the ones who moves the fastestand stealthiest are the ones who outlive the others Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tktm 13 Posted March 4, 2011 Report Share Posted March 4, 2011 anything with the Talaban seal of approval Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mephis 82 Posted March 8, 2011 Report Share Posted March 8, 2011 (edited) I'll take the AK action, in general, either in a PSL (with non-corrosive ammo) / Saiga .308, or a Saiga .223. Why? Because cleaning supplies are bulky and emit noxious fumes. They can be hard to transport and store in bulk, and the odds you depleting your cleaning supplies or being separated from them are very high. The ultimate question I ask is, "How long will this rifle work if separated from its cleaning kit?" (1) AR-15: Not very long. (2) AK action (corrosive ammo): A long time, but it won't shoot well for very long because it'll wreck the barrel. (3) AK action (non-corrosive ammo): Nearly forever. Ultimately, the AK is the superior platform from a long-term performance standpoint. Ideally, though, you want one in a caliber that you can readily get non-corrosive ammo for. Surplus 5.56 and 7.62x51 will work out of the appropriate Saigas, and is non-corrosive. Surplus in the Soviet calibers, on the other hand, is all corrosive. I've got a PSL that I spend about 3 hours every time I put a round through the barrel, in cleaning and re-lubing. Yes I'm obsessed with the rifle. Corrosive ammo is severely over-rated from the standpoint of actually causing harm. Here's what you need for a cleaning kit: Bottle of windex or some water. In the event you have neither, well you have a chrome lined bore to help you out, pretty sure it has a better chance of surviving SHTF than the person behind it. That said, regardless of the shortcomings of the shotgun platform, there will always be ammo for it everywhere. No matter what happens 12 gauge will always survive. It makes sense to base your primary weapons on a common source of ammo. As for lacking range, how about you stand about 400-500 yards away and I'll shoot at you with 000? Any takers? Not to mention, if you're a crappy shot anyway, at that range you'll have a big enough pattern to at least give someone the hint. Edited March 8, 2011 by Tombs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
REDDOG 0 Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 As it was stated many times, depends on where you happen to be when shtf, so have one of each, and enough ammo to survive.....period! But it also helps to have friends with guns as well! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bpipe95 8 Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 (edited) I would take any one of these three... (after the saiga is done of course) All three are piston guns and are all built by me. though the Top two are a good bit lighter than the bottom. All three are the came cal. and all three will use the same mags. Edited April 14, 2011 by bpipe95 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saiganovich 1 Posted April 20, 2011 Report Share Posted April 20, 2011 AR and a 9mm Glock for me. I love my AK & Saiga, but feel a lot more comfortable shooting an AR platform. Can't go wrong with either one... both AK and the AR are incredibly reliable, just go with what you feel more comforatble with. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
pony_express1973 183 Posted April 22, 2011 Report Share Posted April 22, 2011 (edited) I'm picking the AR but I just ordered my Saiga 12 and have never shot one so my opinion my change in the next week or so . My Ar can take 223 or 5.56 ammo so it would be easier to find and I have never had a problem with it being unreliable at all I know the Ak can take a beating but the AR sems to do pretty well on that front also..... To be honest I'd take any of the above with no problems in a SHTF senario just give me a gun ANY gun and at least I'll have a fighting chance. Edited April 22, 2011 by pony_express1973 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Arthur 3 Posted May 2, 2011 Report Share Posted May 2, 2011 Man, that's a tough one. I love my Saiga 12 and my AK... Can the AR be a .308? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CPE1704TKS 24 Posted May 4, 2011 Report Share Posted May 4, 2011 I say again, another CIC. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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