billdeserthills 0 Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 I recently received my Saiga 12 Ga SBS, first thing I noticed is out of all the different Hi-Cap (10rds & over) straight mags I have, none can handle being loaded to anywhere near capacity for any amount of time. Isn't there a manufacturer who can afford to put a real spring in one of these mags, so if I decide to keep it loaded and ready to use I can have some expectation that it will work?? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
presto_z 125 Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 So are you saying that your mags are victims of spring fatigue and wont function properly when loaded to capacity for long periods of time? What mags are you using? I keep my surefire 12rd mags loaded up 24/7 and have not had any problems yet. read up on spring fatigue, i highly doubt that your mag springs are getting worn out from being loaded.. Are you using Promag Mags by any chance? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bridis 319 Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 (edited) Sounds to me like someone is blaming all of their FTF issues on the mag... Edited November 2, 2009 by Bridis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
presto_z 125 Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 agreed Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DyLonX5 3 Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 Need more back story to get a proper diagnose of your issue. Brand, age, abused much, Used? I have one AGP now and I am having the failure to load issue, but I've already read and diagnosed this as needing the inner guides sanded. The spring supplied in the AGP is quite the tough bugger as it shot out as soon as I removed the bottom plate and is at least twice the length of the magazine. Give some more info please. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rich 3 Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 Generally speaking, a spring must be defective, very low quality, or damaged to fail. Keeping them loaded will not weaken a good spring. There have been cases of magazines being found that were loaded for 80 years, and they worked fine. If they rust, get stretched, or crushed out of there operating range, or overheated, then you may have a dead spring. But otherwise, I think you have a different problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
big lumber 9 Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 i too have that problem but its only when the agp is loaded in the gun for more than a night....the first round hangs up into the bottom of the ramp and this continues with each round but if i unload the mag completely the load it up again its fine very strange...? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saiga12fury 0 Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 ive got many agp gen 2 mags and i keep them loaded havent had a problem taking them out shooting. Although i havent had them loaded for more then a week at a time as i just bought my saiga 12 a month ago and cant seem to go a week without shooting it!! I love it!! Will be leaving them loaded over the winter and most likely wont be shooting till spring.I'm not worried about it at all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
billdeserthills 0 Posted November 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 So are you saying that your mags are victims of spring fatigue and wont function properly when loaded to capacity for long periods of time? What mags are you using? I keep my surefire 12rd mags loaded up 24/7 and have not had any problems yet. read up on spring fatigue, i highly doubt that your mag springs are getting worn out from being loaded.. Are you using Promag Mags by any chance? I received my SBS three weeks ago, took it out and put 100 rounds through it. It worked fine with Sure Fire S-12 and AGP mags-not one failure. Next I loaded the SureFire mag and took the gun out after 1 week. Mag spring would not push hard enough to load the first two rounds, I unloaded & re-loaded the mag & it then functioned perfectly. I am now keeping an AGP mag loaded, I'll see how it works, but I really think these springs could use some more Spring. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
billdeserthills 0 Posted November 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 i too have that problem but its only when the agp is loaded in the gun for more than a night....the first round hangs up into the bottom of the ramp and this continues with each round but if i unload the mag completely the load it up again its fine very strange...? And that doesn't concern you? It bugs the hell outta me, how am I gonna grab this Saiga and attempt to stop a... a No-Knock Warrant? Or how about a burglary. I spent a bunch of money on this gun and I can't believe No-One besides maybe mother Russia can make a mag I can load for the next month & think it Might work! What the Hell. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
unusedusername 3 Posted November 5, 2009 Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 (edited) i too have that problem but its only when the agp is loaded in the gun for more than a night....the first round hangs up into the bottom of the ramp and this continues with each round but if i unload the mag completely the load it up again its fine very strange...? Store your saiga with the bolt open and you should not see that issue. The bottom of the bolt deforms the plastic on the shells causing them to not feed. That one is not a mag issue. Edited November 5, 2009 by unusedusername 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thehopping1 105 Posted November 5, 2009 Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 Store your saiga with the bolt open and you should not see that issue. The bottom of the bolt deforms the plastic on the shells causing them to not feed. That one is not a mag issue. +1 And what kind of ammo are you using? Slugs usually can handle being loaded on a closed bolt for some time, but buck and especially Winchester bulk can not. I have a Gen2 AGP and have 200+ rounds through it and haven't had a single FTF, and the mag has been loaded since I got it a few weeks ago(accept when I'm shooting it). And I got that mag used from some one who doesn't particularly like the AGP's. Lucifer, a buddy of mine(who you might know Bill), has 4 or 5 AGP's and I think he keeps them loaded as well(at least some of them) with no problems. I like the AGP's because they are a little cheaper and the company is local so I can take the mags in if I need to. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavePAL84 1 Posted November 5, 2009 Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 I shot a 3-gun match last week using AGP mags that had been fully loaded since July (left them in the range bag). Not a single FTE or FTF. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Eric Pate 478 Posted November 5, 2009 Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 As Unusedusername stated, the issue is caused by the pressure of the bolt against the top round when left with the mag inserted on a closed bolt. The mags themselves can be left loaded indefinately BUT I've noticed that the really cheap birdshot can deform in the magazine because the plastic is so weak. This should not be an issue with higher-quality home-defense buckshot shells. There are several ways to address this issue. These include: storing the gun with the mag inserted and bolt locked to the rear, storing the gun with the magazine separate, using a slug as the top round, using a brass-cased shell as the top round, or (my favorite) drilling a hole in the appropriate location on the mag body for use of a "pull-pin" type device. This topic has been discussed in detail so I'm sure you could find plenty of info by searching this forum for "top round deformation". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
big lumber 9 Posted November 5, 2009 Report Share Posted November 5, 2009 i leave all my agp's fully loaded too but when i leave a loaded agp on a closed bolt over night the shells dont deform they just sit lower its wierd the angle changes ill send pictures in a day or two but like i said its only when i leave the mag in on a closed bolt Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DyLonX5 3 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 i too have that problem but its only when the agp is loaded in the gun for more than a night....the first round hangs up into the bottom of the ramp and this continues with each round but if i unload the mag completely the load it up again its fine very strange...? And that doesn't concern you? It bugs the hell outta me, how am I gonna grab this Saiga and attempt to stop a... a No-Knock Warrant? Or how about a burglary. I spent a bunch of money on this gun and I can't believe No-One besides maybe mother Russia can make a mag I can load for the next month & think it Might work! What the Hell. This concerns me. Chances are if you're worried about a no-knock warrant being held against you, you don't need a firearm. Burglary is one thing, shooting a peace officer is another. I hope you have your magazine issues fixed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
robiejuan 1 Posted November 6, 2009 Report Share Posted November 6, 2009 i too have that problem but its only when the agp is loaded in the gun for more than a night....the first round hangs up into the bottom of the ramp and this continues with each round but if i unload the mag completely the load it up again its fine very strange...? And that doesn't concern you? It bugs the hell outta me, how am I gonna grab this Saiga and attempt to stop a... a No-Knock Warrant? Or how about a burglary. I spent a bunch of money on this gun and I can't believe No-One besides maybe mother Russia can make a mag I can load for the next month & think it Might work! What the Hell. now thats funny! go with md arms drum it stays ready Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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