rkmojo 0 Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Which one do you prefer the "AGP" or the "Surefire" magazine adaptor. I am about to convert my Saiga-12 and would like your input. Also your opines on the extended mag release and bolt open options. Thanks in advance! rk Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmax4x4 68 Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 Well do you have more AGP or Surefire mags? I like the extended mag release. I just but one on my beater gun but have not shoot it yet, but from what I can tell from playing with it in the house it is a good add on. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zambidis 90 Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 I made a similar thread a while ago. There did not seem to be any indication that one was vastly better than the others. Mr. Travers uses the surefire on his gun if that is worth anything. I found AGP mags at a much better price than what I found Surefire mags for and so I bought a bunch of AGP mags. If you search or just look through the next couple pages you should find the thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
corbin 621 Posted November 22, 2009 Report Share Posted November 22, 2009 Let me start by saying I don't own either magwell, so I can't really say this one is better than that one.... The thing I DID notice though was that if you had an AGP magwell, you could fit modified Surefire mags in it (as well as modified AGPs, since you didn't have to modify the well). If you have a Surefire magwell, you can fit AGP mags IF YOU MODIFIED THE MAGWELL. I may be thinking wrong here, but it if you modified a Surefire well to work with AGP mags, the Surefires probably wouldn't fit as nicely. But modding Surefire mags to work with an AGP mag, while still being able to use the AGP mags, would be a plus. I'm still holding out for something that'll work with my MD-20 drums though, so I can't comment much more on the matter. Corbin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lframke 1 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Call or write Greg at Carolina Shooters Supply or contact Jack Travers at J/T Engineering. Either person will steer you in the RIGHT direction. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slug-O 6 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 I own a surefire mag well and im glad i got it. I only own surefire mags so the choise was easy for me. I cant tell you how fast my reloads are not. its like night and day to me. Modding themags is easy and only take a few minuets to do. You have to get the extended mag release because without it dropping the mags cant be done easyly with the magwel on your gun... Slug-O Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rocinante 100 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel This is a sarcastic joke? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
corbin 621 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel This is a sarcastic joke? I don't think it is. Check out his other post here Corbin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slug-O 6 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 the mag well comes off with the removal of 3 screws and then you can use a drum. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cscharlie 107 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 the mag well comes off with the removal of 3 screws and then you can use a drum. How loose does that drum fit after enlarging the magwell in the gun to add the straight insert magwell? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Slug-O 6 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 I did not have to enlarge the mag well on my shotgun when I installed my surefire magwell. Slug-O Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 I like my surefire magwell, but I only have surefires. I have no problems with them and Travers thinks they are more reliable. I found them cheaper, and they have more choices about size. If you are using it for competition you can get the clear surefire 12 rounders, and I am not sure if you can still get clear AGP's anywhere. I am guessing either would be fine if all you want is 10 shots at a time. Or you have a bunch of one or the other. Re: the drum, I think this is really better than a drum at this point anyway. a magwell +3 12 shot surefires is comparable money to a drum, and has more firepower. or maybe an 8 shot for normal use and a bunch of 10 or 12 shot mags when you want to play around. When Mike Davidson releases his magwell and doublestack mags, that would be a cut and dry choice to me. I think that the traver's magwell will be a nicer part being made from billet and all that, but it sounds like Mike's will have a much lower price point and will work with more types of magazines, so that might push the JTE magwell out of a market. I feel kind of bad about that because it is a very well made part and he obviously did a lot of good innovation and so far his customer service is great. If MD wants to make a part that everyone can afford that is more versatile, how can I complain. (I can complain that the double stacks won't fit in the magwell I have, and that It is too nice to consider changing out for a piece of plastic.) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 Oh, and I would say that the magwell would be a lot better with an extended release. The flared lip of the magwell gets in the way of quickly hitting the release with your new mag in an AK drill. I just don't see buying one when it would be so very easy to weld, screw or rivet any scrap of metal onto the existing one. If you can't weld you must have at least one friend who can spare 2 minutes. just cut out a little piece of steel, and if you want fold a tab on it like some do, and mask the gun from stray splatter, and it should be ready in about 10 seconds of welding and a couple of minutes of careful grinding. I kind of feel the same way about spending $65 for a little piece of 1/4" square keystock with some knurling (the tromix galil handle) any one who can weld the thing on already has the scraps laying around to do one as nice. Those don't appeal anyway, but the price is absurd. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lelandeod 179 Posted November 25, 2009 Report Share Posted November 25, 2009 My question is why does JT Engineering make a Surefire magwell if the AGP magwell works with both AGP and Surefire mags??? Why have two types? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted November 25, 2009 Report Share Posted November 25, 2009 I think that with the AGP you have to add material to the surefires. He tuned it for smoothest reliability and speed with one brand or the other rather than so-so fit all around. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lelandeod 179 Posted November 25, 2009 Report Share Posted November 25, 2009 (edited) Are there instructions out there that explain what you have to do to get the surefires to work in an AGP magwell? I just recently bought a surefire mag and am much more impressed with it than the stack of AGP's I've got. But, I've already fitted an AGP magwell to my gun. Edited November 25, 2009 by lelandEOD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lelandeod 179 Posted November 25, 2009 Report Share Posted November 25, 2009 And a gratuitus shot of my girl. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Share Posted November 26, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel This is a sarcastic joke? No joke, I'll be cutting out/bending the steel tomorrow and doing the mods to my own S12. If all goes well, I'll know by the end of the weekend if my idea is workable and/or what I'll need to do to make it better. PS - thanks Corbin, appreciated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gpqueen 545 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Share Posted November 26, 2009 My question is why does JT Engineering make a Surefire magwell if the AGP magwell works with both AGP and Surefire mags??? Why have two types? The magazine dimensions are different and will not easily work with both. There is no one size fits all and most likely never be. Another issue is the Drum. The Drum sits so close to the receiver that there is not enough room for a magwell. If the Drums feed tower was longer then it would work. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gpqueen 545 Posted November 26, 2009 Report Share Posted November 26, 2009 And a gratuitus shot of my girl. That is a great looking Shotgun. ETAC do the build? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lelandeod 179 Posted November 27, 2009 Report Share Posted November 27, 2009 Thanks Greg. The compliment means a lot coming from you. Esteban did the conversion and I've been tweeking it ever since. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
trichrome 1 Posted December 1, 2009 Report Share Posted December 1, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel This is a sarcastic joke? No joke, I'll be cutting out/bending the steel tomorrow and doing the mods to my own S12. If all goes well, I'll know by the end of the weekend if my idea is workable and/or what I'll need to do to make it better. PS - thanks Corbin, appreciated. so how did it go? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel This is a sarcastic joke? No joke, I'll be cutting out/bending the steel tomorrow and doing the mods to my own S12. If all goes well, I'll know by the end of the weekend if my idea is workable and/or what I'll need to do to make it better. PS - thanks Corbin, appreciated. UPDATE, I didn't have the steel I thought I did, so I tried aluminum. My concept worked great. And should work with drums as well as any mag. I tried Russian and Tai 5rndrs, Surefire 8s and an AGP 10 loaded with 3" mag slugs. No issues fireing, and drops staight out with simple pressure to the existing mag release. Is easiest to load on an open bolt but can be done closed. Does require rather permanent alteration to the reciever, but can be fixed if not to one's likeing. Have done one in steel, but not fired yet, maybe this weekend. Also need to find more appropriate steel stock to work from to cut down my fabrication time/effort. LRoDV, Mikel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Crusader 64 Posted December 11, 2009 Report Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hold off the Magwell if you can, I'm working on a DIYS option that should work with everything, including drums. Mikel This is a sarcastic joke? No joke, I'll be cutting out/bending the steel tomorrow and doing the mods to my own S12. If all goes well, I'll know by the end of the weekend if my idea is workable and/or what I'll need to do to make it better. PS - thanks Corbin, appreciated. UPDATE, I didn't have the steel I thought I did, so I tried aluminum. My concept worked great. And should work with drums as well as any mag. I tried Russian and Tai 5rndrs, Surefire 8s and an AGP 10 loaded with 3" mag slugs. No issues fireing, and drops staight out with simple pressure to the existing mag release. Is easiest to load on an open bolt but can be done closed. Does require rather permanent alteration to the reciever, but can be fixed if not to one's likeing. Have done one in steel, but not fired yet, maybe this weekend. Also need to find more appropriate steel stock to work from to cut down my fabrication time/effort. LRoDV, Mikel We need pictures of this!! You might be on to something. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BpS12 512 Posted December 13, 2009 Report Share Posted December 13, 2009 Thanks Crusader and I'd love to post pics, but since this may be AK varient universal, I'm trying to decide if it's worth patenting, etc. I didn't get out to try the steel version this weekend. My woman just bought a new truck and I've been busy messing with it all weekend. I did find some better steel to work from though and will make a better rendition this week and try to get out to shoot it soon. I'll let you know, Mikel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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