G O B 3,516 Posted February 23, 2012 Report Share Posted February 23, 2012 Remove as much heat as soon as possible! Heat = warp. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted February 24, 2012 Report Share Posted February 24, 2012 No, just try to give respect where due when disagreeing. People who have time and talent invested in developing real expertise tend to become sensitive and testy when their opinion is questioned repeatedly by ignorant amateurs. Therefore, I choose to acknowledge the skill of people I question if they have it, before questioning. Bob Ash has built cool stuff, works with people who innovate, and still takes time to answer idiot newbie questions, and even some impertinant things said by enthusiastic amateurs like me. I respect that. It isn't sucking up to acknowledge real achievement. It also doesn't pay to P/O the guy who freely shares information that cost him years of trial and error and overhead to gather. I am not saying Bob Ash is thin skinned.He's actually pretty calm, but quite a lot of the innovators who are on this forum sensitive. It takes a fair amount of ego to drive you to seek perfection and then get people to pay you for it. Do that for a few years and you begin to think you are the best and right about everything. It's true for machinists and every military unit ever. You never see a group with a motto like 3.14th airborne submariners-- Pretty much the same as any other military unit. In the same light you will never see someone with the drive to start a brand be very humble or take criticism lightly. They won't have a slogan like "UltraTac-- Bolting on accesories made by other companies, and having a couple of parts machined to look like 1950's tech, like all the other guys" Guess why most of them don't give many useful answers anymore. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted March 4, 2012 Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 (edited) So... I needed to paint my .223 after doing Bulgy GB/FSB swap. I decided to try this "redneck" technique to fill in the rivet holes. Put the tape on the inside of the receiver, plopped in the JB weld, and leveled it out with a razor blade. Came back in a couple days and sanded of the excess. While I was at it, I also filed down and filled the obliterated RAAC importer marking - you know, the "velcro patch" on the newer Saigas. It doesn't take much filing - you're only taking down the areas that are raised above the receiver surface - less than a millimeter. I just put on my first base coat of paint tonight, and so far it looks great. While the RAAC importer marking is still slightly visible on close inspection, everything else appears to be blending in extremely well. Paint combo is taken from Tantal's old builds page: two base coats of Duplicolor DE1634, and two/three topcoats of Duplicolor DE1635. Final coat will be baked on. I'll post pics when the final product is wrapped up, probably by the end of this week. Edited March 4, 2012 by mancat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted March 4, 2012 Report Share Posted March 4, 2012 Should be fine on the 'match striker', but it WILL come out of the holes. There is nothing there to make a solid bond to. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted March 5, 2012 Report Share Posted March 5, 2012 I agree there's a chance of that, but if they do it's no big deal. I'll just pop the JB out and put plugs back in. We'll see how long it holds up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted March 6, 2012 Report Share Posted March 6, 2012 ...i think filling with JB weld is better than nothing... Yeah, that's where you and I disagree. I think "nothing" is the better option. After all, the JB weld is just filler; it's cosmetic. You're doing it just for looks and it could fall into the action. Bob, Is it best to MIG one, quench, let cool and then rinse repeat for the other holes. Or OK to jump right into the one next to it while the first is still hot? I wouldn't worry too much about it. Once you rag-quench the hole, go on to the next one. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BobAsh 582 Posted March 6, 2012 Report Share Posted March 6, 2012 No, just try to give respect where due when disagreeing. People who have time and talent invested in developing real expertise tend to become sensitive and testy when their opinion is questioned repeatedly by ignorant amateurs. Therefore, I choose to acknowledge the skill of people I question if they have it, before questioning. Bob Ash has built cool stuff, works with people who innovate, and still takes time to answer idiot newbie questions, and even some impertinant things said by enthusiastic amateurs like me. I respect that. It isn't sucking up to acknowledge real achievement. It also doesn't pay to P/O the guy who freely shares information that cost him years of trial and error and overhead to gather. I am not saying Bob Ash is thin skinned.He's actually pretty calm, but quite a lot of the innovators who are on this forum sensitive. It takes a fair amount of ego to drive you to seek perfection and then get people to pay you for it. Do that for a few years and you begin to think you are the best and right about everything. It's true for machinists and every military unit ever. You never see a group with a motto like 3.14th airborne submariners-- Pretty much the same as any other military unit. In the same light you will never see someone with the drive to start a brand be very humble or take criticism lightly. They won't have a slogan like "UltraTac-- Bolting on accesories made by other companies, and having a couple of parts machined to look like 1950's tech, like all the other guys" Guess why most of them don't give many useful answers anymore. It's really not that complicated, imo...someone asks a question, I give my opinion just like every other person on the thread. I don't care if anyone agrees, or disagrees, or indeed what the OP does with his gun...it's my opinion, based on my experience and knowledge. Although you are right about one thing. It does get old sometimes, having people constantly question your judgement/motives/etc. I've made tons of "insider" information about Saiga 12 design available here. I'm always straightforward about design questions; it's my passion. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dad2142Dad 6,559 Posted March 6, 2012 Report Share Posted March 6, 2012 No, just try to give respect where due when disagreeing. People who have time and talent invested in developing real expertise tend to become sensitive and testy when their opinion is questioned repeatedly by ignorant amateurs. Therefore, I choose to acknowledge the skill of people I question if they have it, before questioning. Bob Ash has built cool stuff, works with people who innovate, and still takes time to answer idiot newbie questions, and even some impertinant things said by enthusiastic amateurs like me. I respect that. It isn't sucking up to acknowledge real achievement. It also doesn't pay to P/O the guy who freely shares information that cost him years of trial and error and overhead to gather. I am not saying Bob Ash is thin skinned.He's actually pretty calm, but quite a lot of the innovators who are on this forum sensitive. It takes a fair amount of ego to drive you to seek perfection and then get people to pay you for it. Do that for a few years and you begin to think you are the best and right about everything. It's true for machinists and every military unit ever. You never see a group with a motto like 3.14th airborne submariners-- Pretty much the same as any other military unit. In the same light you will never see someone with the drive to start a brand be very humble or take criticism lightly. They won't have a slogan like "UltraTac-- Bolting on accesories made by other companies, and having a couple of parts machined to look like 1950's tech, like all the other guys" Guess why most of them don't give many useful answers anymore. It's really not that complicated, imo...someone asks a question, I give my opinion just like every other person on the thread. I don't care if anyone agrees, or disagrees, or indeed what the OP does with his gun...it's my opinion, based on my experience and knowledge. Although you are right about one thing. It does get old sometimes, having people constantly question your judgement/motives/etc. I've made tons of "insider" information about Saiga 12 design available here. I'm always straightforward about design questions; it's my passion. And that is truly appreciated Quote Link to post Share on other sites
gunfun 3,931 Posted March 6, 2012 Report Share Posted March 6, 2012 +1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted March 8, 2012 Report Share Posted March 8, 2012 Well, it turns out that baking on the coats of Duplicolor were too much for the JB Weld. After removing from the oven, the JB Weld had noticably contracted, and no longer appeared to be flush with the receiver. Several of the JB Welded spots popped out of the receiver while installing the buttstock. Oh well, lesson learned. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TwentyNizzo 66 Posted March 8, 2012 Report Share Posted March 8, 2012 I filled the holes on my iz109 a couple years ago with quicksteel. I have shot many rounds through the gun without any issues whatsoever. That stuff wasn't going anywhere. I had to drill it out so I could install my rear block plate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Talmadge 2 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I know this is an ooold topic but I consider my contribution worthwhile. I picked up on JB Welding the holes in this thread, so this is me giving back, in a sense. [video=youtube;] Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Stansplace 414 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Talmadge 2 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 I'm sorry? What exactly is wrong about my tutorial? I know I'm resurrecting an old topic, but that's better than starting a new thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TheDarkHorse 216 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 Someone needs to start a Fred Sanford build page. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
misterT 174 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 Sorry I have used JB weld before in a pinch repairing machinery but I was never proud of it. I really think Bob Ash made a VERY good point if a piece of that comes loose while you are shooting and gets into the action, It could be very bad. I think the risk of it coming loose is very good too. It needs a lot of support aound it to stay attached and 1.5 mm thick side of the receiver is just not enough. I am considereing using flat head screws and screwing them into the stock. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Talmadge 2 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 (edited) Did you watch my video all the way through? I refuse to believe anything other than a remarkable fluke or deliberate force could dislodge the epoxy. I test it's strength in the video. It's near the end. ETA: Additionally: if it does come loose in the action, what's the big deal? The AK action is robust and would likely shred the epoxy. If it caused a jam, I would open it up, clean it out, and continue shooting. I'm not going to war with the rifle. If such an incident was to occur, I'll be sure to mention it here and express my most sincere apologies for misleading the public. Edited November 24, 2012 by Talmadge Quote Link to post Share on other sites
misterT 174 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 If it got caught in the FCG it could cause a slam fire, i had this happen with an SKS I bought at a gunshow years ago. Several of us bought them went straight to the range cleaned them up and shot them. When I loaded mine and released the bolt it let loose with a 5-6 round burst of auto fire! Fortunetly I had it pointed in a safe direction so no one was killed. Another guy there thought it was cool as hell so we swapped FGCs, then he had a dangerous weapon and mine functioned properly. I dont mean to dis your idea I seriously thought about it, it is an easy way to eliminate the extra holes. If you read on here there have been problems with other things coming loose like Tapco stocks that vibrate the screws right out. A piece of epoxy in the FCG could be deadly! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Talmadge 2 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 That can be attributed to free floated firing pins and soft primers. I appreciate the warning. I'll pay close attention to the welds for the first 2000 rounds or so. I'm not sure if my firing pin is free floating... Maybe I should install a spring. Worst comes to worst, I shoot on private land, very rarely with anyone but myself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jbanzai 113 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 The slam fire in the SKS was caused by the primer piece getting stuck in the bolt cause the FP to be stuck in the forward position. It would be very difficult for that piece to make it to the trigger group of an SKS or to cause it to go FA. I can't really imagine worrying about a piece of JB weld in the action. I thought AK's would fire if they were filled with sand, rocks, mud, ashes, dog poop, lawn clippings, or anything else under the sun. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mancat 2,368 Posted November 24, 2012 Report Share Posted November 24, 2012 (edited) Alright guys, since this topic is active again.. It's been almost ten months since I put JB Weld on the sides of the receiver. Although one of the fillings fell out on assembly of the rear stock (see post above from March), the others are all still there. I have pressed on them, dropped the rifle numerous times, carried it uncased in a vehicle over forest service roads, carried it slung a few miles, and fired hundreds of rounds through it. In other words I've treated it like an AK. The other fillings have not moved at all. I thought they would come out, but they're all still there and don't seem to be letting go. I suspect the rearmost one fell out because the inner edge of that hole was very slightly tapered inwards from knocking out the trigger plate rivet. I believe the stock pressed up against it and pushed the JB Weld out. The stock was a very tight fit, installed with rubber mallet. Edited November 24, 2012 by mancat Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Entropy 0 Posted December 3, 2012 Report Share Posted December 3, 2012 I didn't want anything that plugged those holes to have even a remote chance to fall out much less fall in to bounce around inside - wanted a comfortably permanent solution so I followed in the footsteps of Mr. K and went with rivets. Cut some down that came from Sebring short enough to make a mushroom head inside but without causing a lot of side-drama for fitting the stock. 99% of the people on this website would know what the deal is as to why those rivet heads are there, but 99% of the public won't know the difference. They'd think they hold the pistol grip on or something. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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