BrutalGardener 205 Posted January 25, 2010 Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) I was adjusting the front sight on my SGL21 for 100 yards at the range yesterday and shot a surprisingly nice group. I was shooting cheap ass Brown Bear HPs from a bench rest and took 6 consecutive shots, with 10-15 second barrel cooling time between each. Man, the AKM iron sights sure are designed for 18 year old soldiers' eyes, aren't they? It took me a lot of effort and concentration to properly focus my eye for these shots. The front post was as wide as the target too. Not bad for irons and the cheapest (non-surplus) rounds on the market, eh? Makes me wonder what grouping this baby can achieve when I use my PK-AS and some Winchester metric FMJs. These IzhMash Legion barrels appear to be the shit. Edit: For those of you who are not logged in and can't see the pic, the widest distance between the centers of two bullet holes is 2.375". Edited January 25, 2010 by SpetsnazGRU Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted January 25, 2010 Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) I was adjusting the front sight on my SGL21 for 100 yards at the range yesterday and shot a surprisingly nice group. I was shooting cheap ass Brown Bear HPs from a bench rest and took 6 consecutive shots, with 10-15 second barrel cooling time between each. Man, the AKM iron sights sure are designed for 18 year old soldiers' eyes, aren't they? It took me a lot of effort and concentration to properly focus my eye for these shots. The front post was as wide as the target too. Not bad for irons and the cheapest (non-surplus) rounds on the market, eh? Makes me wonder what grouping this baby can achieve when I use my PK-AS and some Winchester metric FMJs. These IzhMash Legion barrels appear to be the shit. Edit: For those of you who are not logged in and can't see the pic, the widest distance between the centers of two bullet holes is 2.375". The barrel won't cool down very much in 15 seconds. If you space out 5 minutes between shots it might make a larger difference. You got the right idea about Saiga barrels being well made. They are new factory barrels unlike some other guns that have old and possibly near worn out bores (Wasr cough cough) which is only going to hurt accuracy. Nice range report. Edited January 25, 2010 by my762buzz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) I remember a while ago, I met this guy at the range. We became friendly and he let me shoot his stuff and I let him shoot mine. He grabbed my old non-converted Saiga 7.62 and shot a 10 round mag at 100 yard cylindrical metal gongs and was consistently hitting them. His reaction was priceless. He acted totally blown away by the fact that an "AK" could consistently hit a big ass metal gong from 100 yards. He was like: "Wow! It's pretty accurate, huh?" Edited January 25, 2010 by SpetsnazGRU Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted February 28, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Did the two higher holes on top appear as shots 4 and 5? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 Nice grouping. I'll be doing to 2 Saigas and a 91/30 with report this week with scopes and red dots. Hoping my 5.45 can get under 2 myself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted February 28, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 (edited) Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Did the two higher holes on top appear as shots 4 and 5? Since I didn't look through my spotting scope after each shot, there's no way of knowing which hole corresponds to which shot. Any way, I plan on trying some American brass rounds next. I wonder how far I can tighten the grouping with this weapon. Edited February 28, 2010 by SpetsnazGRU Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted February 28, 2010 Report Share Posted February 28, 2010 (edited) today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. I seen a professional gunsmith and 6PPC tournament champ show me how quick heat distorts the barrel bore and vertical stringing. He took a big ass 2 inch wide barreled bench bolt action and shot .30-06 through it 10 times. The group stayed inside of an inch perfectly thats with shots fired 10 seconds apart at 100 yards. Then he picked up a .30-06 sporter barreled bolt gun with a typical narrow contour. He shot 10 shots spaced 10 seconds apart each. The first two shots were fairly close together then the 3rd shot started to deviate away then the rest started stringing vertically into a wide group. He ended up with a 3 to 4 inch group with that narrow contour bolt gun. He said as long as the barrel remained cool enough it would group closer to 1 inch with his best factory load. The difference with the fat barrel target gun was it had far more steel to soak up the heat and not distort the group. All other things remaining equal,if you want relatively rapid fire and superior accuracy, it calls for a thicker barrel. The RPK design emphasizes the barrel thickness part. Your groups are likely to tighten up far more provided your barrel cools more between shots. Edited February 28, 2010 by my762buzz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
akwatercraft 0 Posted March 1, 2010 Report Share Posted March 1, 2010 cool good to see some groups posted,,, i haven't been on in a while. i am loading .308 diameter frangible 125 grain into a 7.62x39 with 23.7 gr of imr 4198. took me a year to work up this load because of the newbie factor and the learning curve but i am finally getting the desired results, this is my best 100 yard group so far with that round. 3x9 bushnell with a full conversion saiga Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Killshot44 0 Posted March 2, 2010 Report Share Posted March 2, 2010 I can eek out 2" 3-shot groups at 100 using Wolf black and a 4X scope. 16" barrel. Better ammo and 3 minutes between shots would close it up some but let's not kid ourselves.....these aren't MOA guns by design. Don't hate on me for the scope, I'm old! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted March 2, 2010 Report Share Posted March 2, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Are you using the PK-AS-S or the PK-AS-V? (Great work by the way on the tight group)! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted March 2, 2010 Report Share Posted March 2, 2010 I can eek out 2" 3-shot groups at 100 using Wolf black and a 4X scope. 16" barrel. Better ammo and 3 minutes between shots would close it up some but let's not kid ourselves.....these aren't MOA guns by design. Don't hate on me for the scope, I'm old! Sometimes a few changes can really surprise common perception. http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=49270&st=0&p=458190&fromsearch=1entry458190 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted March 2, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 2, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Are you using the PK-AS-S or the PK-AS-V? (Great work by the way on the tight group)! Thanks. I am not sure which it is. It doesn't say on the thing, its manual or the site I ordered it from (Eastwave). It sits offset to the left, letting you use the irons... whichever model that is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bigsal 757 Posted March 4, 2010 Report Share Posted March 4, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Are you using the PK-AS-S or the PK-AS-V? (Great work by the way on the tight group)! Thanks. I am not sure which it is. It doesn't say on the thing, its manual or the site I ordered it from (Eastwave). It sits offset to the left, letting you use the irons... whichever model that is. Ahh cool, the offset one is the (S) model the above the bore model is the (V). The Weaver mount unit is the PK-AS-W. Keep the updates coming man, again, nice shooting! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted March 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Are you using the PK-AS-S or the PK-AS-V? (Great work by the way on the tight group)! Thanks. I am not sure which it is. It doesn't say on the thing, its manual or the site I ordered it from (Eastwave). It sits offset to the left, letting you use the irons... whichever model that is. Ahh cool, the offset one is the (S) model the above the bore model is the (V). The Weaver mount unit is the PK-AS-W. Keep the updates coming man, again, nice shooting! Cool. Thanks. By the way, I was confused as to what a "benchrest" is. I don't have any type of mechanical contraption that locks and holds the rifle in really tight. The only thing I use to shoot is that green "sand bag" thing you see in the pic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Better iron sights will also improve your accuracy. I been working on trying to mod a mojo peep sight. I got a front sight post narrowed to 0.020 compared to the factory one 0.080. Now I am trying to work on glueing some fine width wire in the peep tube to make a convergence of 3 lines. The tip of the post would line up at the intersection and this would provide a good mark to always return to for better sight alignment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimdigriz 580 Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Better iron sights will also improve your accuracy. I been working on trying to mod a mojo peep sight. I got a front sight post narrowed to 0.020 compared to the factory one 0.080. Accuracy might be improved somewhat, but probably not the ability to quickly reacquire and track a moving target at close range. Also, the notch and post sight is better under low light. My recent experiences have convinced me that I can nurse a good bit of accuracy out of the OEM sights; it just takes a bit more practice than with aperture sights. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimdigriz 580 Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Nice shooting. What number are you supposed to select on the elevation dial when you sight in? That is, what is base/starting number? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Different tools for different tasks. An aimpoint is about perfect for close range fast target aquisition in regular light or low low light. In low light, most any post sight is going to blurr badly without some contrasting feature like a tritium source. At night, regular iron sights become pretty much useless. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted March 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Nice shooting. What number are you supposed to select on the elevation dial when you sight in? That is, what is base/starting number? I set it on 1, for 100 meters. The lowest setting is the "battle setting". From what I've read, that setting is supposed to let you hit someone in the torso when you aim for center-mass, be it from 30 or 300 meters. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jimdigriz 580 Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 (edited) Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Nice shooting. What number are you supposed to select on the elevation dial when you sight in? That is, what is base/starting number? I set it on 1, for 100 meters. The lowest setting is the "battle setting". From what I've read, that setting is supposed to let you hit someone in the torso when you aim for center-mass, be it from 30 or 300 meters. Thanks, but I meant on the PK-AS. I assume you are talking about the elevation ramp on the iron sights. Edited March 5, 2010 by Jim Digriz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrutalGardener 205 Posted March 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Sighted in the PK-AS and broke the 2" "barrier" today! 5 round group with about 5 seconds between shots. Nice shooting. What number are you supposed to select on the elevation dial when you sight in? That is, what is base/starting number? I set it on 1, for 100 meters. The lowest setting is the "battle setting". From what I've read, that setting is supposed to let you hit someone in the torso when you aim for center-mass, be it from 30 or 300 meters. Thanks, but I meant on the PK-AS. I assume you are talking about the elevation ramp on the iron sights. Zero. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted March 7, 2010 Report Share Posted March 7, 2010 Managed a 1 1/2" 4 shot group around the 'red dot' today at 100 yards with my 5.45x39 with a 4x30 NCStar scope (non-illuminated). Then it opened up to about 2 1/2" with a few more shots. I did 3 groups total of about 2 1/2" today. Thinking of springing another $20 out for another scope for my 7.62x39 and see if I can duplicate maybe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobRez 1,895 Posted March 8, 2010 Report Share Posted March 8, 2010 Took my 7.62x39 to the range today. First 3 shot group at 100 yards measured 41mm or 1 5/8" wtih iron sights using a sandbag as a front rest. I was pretty happy with that. My best 100 yd group with my Saiga .308 today was 2 1/4 " also with iron sghts. My eyes are starting to feel their age. I seems to take me a bit to get used to farther distances. Forgot my spotting scope so I kept it to 100 yds. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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