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how do i polish the bolt?


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#1 oshin

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 09:00 PM

ok guys i already have my wood on order for my conversion and i already have all the other conversion parts. i have also fired 150 rounds of federal bulk pack from wally world no problem with the gunfixers plug! now until my wood set comes in i want to polish the whole bolt and all moving parts. i know i can send it out to get it polished but i need any reason to bust out my dremel!!! so can anyone tell me how they polished there bolt and if they have pics please post them up!!!
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#2 superA

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 09:24 PM

Well having wood like you do is a great start. Basically just pick a hand, apply lube and go to work, even strokes, slow yet firm. You can increase speed as you need based on how close you are to climax/completion. One important thing to consider and this is important because a lot of people tend to do this, (more than you would think) do not by any means neglect the nuts while polishing the bolt. You will be amazed at how fast this brings the task to completion. Hope this helps and good luck. Oh and uh...pics or it didn't happen.
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#3 GerryV

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 09:28 PM

This PDF shows what and where to polish. Don't know the accuracy so use at your own risk.

Attached Files


Edited by GerryV, 12 February 2010 - 09:33 PM.

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#4 oshin

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 09:46 PM

thx alot. well i want to polish the whole deal so i wanted to ask if i should use a wire wheel to strip the factory finish and use a felt pad with red rouge to polish away?

#5 S-12 Pauly

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 10:03 PM

ok guys i already have my wood on order for my conversion and i already have all the other conversion parts. i have also fired 150 rounds of federal bulk pack from wally world no problem with the gunfixers plug! now until my wood set comes in i want to polish the whole bolt and all moving parts. i know i can send it out to get it polished but i need any reason to bust out my dremel!!! so can anyone tell me how they polished there bolt and if they have pics please post them up!!!

This is a way to do the mod for DIY'res.
This is my first bolt mod.
GlassBolthas advanced greatly since, but this is a good way for those who can't afford to send their parts out, or those who simply refuse to have anybody else do work on their weapon.

First & foremost, NEVER touch this part. It keeps the hammer from striking the firing pin before the gun is in full battery.

Posted Image


Also, do not reduce the size of the feed foot.
The feed foot is the part on the bolt that pushes the shell out of the mag & also holds the rim of the hull opposite of the extractor.
I'm editing this post to include this because people keep screwing it up.



To shape, I used a fine dremmel sanding drum.
Posted Image
To smooth, I used abrasive prep pads on a drill. Dremmel also makes abrasive buffs,
Posted Image
but I have a bunch of drill mount pads that I got cheap, so I saved the dremmel buffs for tighter quarters work in the future.
To polish, I used the dremmel, with wool pads & red polishing compound.
Posted Image

I only addressed the areas that move against the shells & hammer as the bolt rotates, extracts & feeds & the carrier re-cocks the hammer.
I did not remove as much steel as some do, due to the fact that I fire a lot of 3" magnum & don't wish to compromise the integrity of my bolt or punch though it.

It now cycles even smoother than before & loading mags on a closed bolt is easier.
Posted Image


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Here is a pic of a heavier mod.
A little too deep for my tastes.
Posted Image
If I should feel like I'm having issues due to the bolt, I may go deeper, but it is working very well at the present time, so Why fix it?
I'm not having mag insertion issues & polished as it is, they insert even smoother now

I also did a bit of work on the FCG, smoothing out the sharp horns on the hammer, & just polishing contact or friction bearing surfaces on the rest.

I stopped at abrasive buffs on the carrier rails, because it was good enough.
The gun is VERY dependable.
Posted Image



Just take your time & keep the tool moving to achieve smooth results.

<insert shameless add>

However, if you'd like the best possible out of this mod for reliability, GlassBolt has really come up since my first mod.
Top industry consultants have converged to bring the mod to the pinicle of perfection & I now offer the service to the public! Posted Image

Here's a link to what could be...





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Posted Image

Posted Image


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#6 Dirt Diver

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 10:28 PM

Thanks for posting all the info. Appreciated!!
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#7 oshin

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 11:40 PM

woohooo! thx for all the help guys i cant wait until i have a perfect shine to it!!! i will post pick after im done

#8 Corbin

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 12:02 AM

Looking good Paulyski!

I need to take pics of mine. LOL


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#9 PUNISHER15

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 09:21 AM

ive gotta do that too just ordered a bunch of new parts for the punisher!!!!

#10 DrtyHarry

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 01:11 PM

About how much would a gunsmith (board sponsor) charge for a job like this? Thanks!!

DH

#11 Corbin

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 01:55 PM

About how much would a gunsmith (board sponsor) charge for a job like this? Thanks!!

DH



Cobras used to do them, I think for $75.00, but I don't know if he still does.

Check out the Business members section and see who offers what.

Corbin
My Glock was stolen. Link:

http://forum.saiga-1...s-stolen-today/

#12 S-12 Pauly

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 02:20 PM

He still does them.
Just a touch differently than I.


Nice job Paul. Well done!


Thanks!
I appreciate your support. :up:
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#13 rugerglocker

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 05:35 PM

I used some cratex tips that came with my dremel kit, as suggested by Mike D, and they worked great

Edited by rugerglocker, 25 February 2010 - 05:47 PM.


#14 post-apocalyptic

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 05:49 PM

Well having wood like you do is a great start. Basically just pick a hand, apply lube and go to work, even strokes, slow yet firm. You can increase speed as you need based on how close you are to climax/completion. One important thing to consider and this is important because a lot of people tend to do this, (more than you would think) do not by any means neglect the nuts while polishing the bolt. You will be amazed at how fast this brings the task to completion. Hope this helps and good luck. Oh and uh...pics or it didn't happen.


:lolol:

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#15 deletemyaccountplease

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Posted 25 February 2010 - 10:52 PM

http://forum.saiga-1...=0
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#16 Gibbles

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 04:16 PM

I went one step further on mine and took the bolt apart and did a light polish on the two halves where they rub together.
I did not take much off, I just smoothed out lightly with 600grit paper and then took the large felt wheel with the red compound to make it nice and slick.
mine was pretty rough and had some areas it seemed to catch on.

I went much lighter on the metal removal on the bolt, and I did not touch the feed ramp.

On the carrier I used 600 grit paper and cleaned up the channels that ride on the reciver, it made it nice and slick. :super:

#17 S-12 Pauly

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Posted 27 February 2010 - 05:02 PM

I was thinking of polishing my bolt. Should I? What are the pro's and con's?
Thanks for any helpful advice.

Reduces friction for mag insertion, & reduces friction for light loads as the bolt rotates.
Mike Davidson of MD Arms recommends it for running low brass through the drum more reliably without changing spring settings.
In short, it smoothens up the action greatly .
I can't think of any cons.

If one were to remove too much metal from the hammer face & the bottom of the carrier, there would be a possibility of the hammer not making it into the disconnecter, thus not resetting.
Therefore, don't go crazy with metal removal.

Don't try to go to the same dimensions as GlassBolt either without being able to measure the wall thickness where the bolt head inserts.
If you go too far, you'll have issues that are costly to repair.

Glassbolt is constantly measured & engineered to ensure optimal strength by KEEPING steel in key areas.
Don't trust any pictures other than the first that I posted.
My polish on GlassBolt reflects everything so pictures of GlassBolt are quite deceptive.

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#18 Hobbyist

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Posted 06 March 2010 - 09:10 AM

Guys, What is this "Red Compound"? I was just at Walmart and then went to a automotive store, but couldn't find anything except the Mcguire stuff made for removing scratch and polishing rims.

#19 dbuzz

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Posted 06 March 2010 - 03:05 PM

Guys, What is this "Red Compound"? I was just at Walmart and then went to a automotive store, but couldn't find anything except the Mcguire stuff made for removing scratch and polishing rims.


I think they might be referring to the small pack of red polishing compound that comes with most Dremel kits. My local Home Depot sells it stand-alone on the end cap with all the other Dremel accesories. I used it on mine and the results were very good. Not the caliber of Paul or Cobra's work, but pretty darned smooth and it cycles everything I've tried so far, including Wally World bulk.

#20 Cobra's Custom LLC

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Posted 06 March 2010 - 10:37 PM


About how much would a gunsmith (board sponsor) charge for a job like this? Thanks!!

DH



Cobras used to do them, I think for $75.00, but I don't know if he still does.

Check out the Business members section and see who offers what.

Corbin


Yep, still doing them for very satisfied customers....$85 shipped....you won't be disappointed.

Posted Image

- Bolt & Carrier Mods and Polishing > http://www.Cobras-Custom.com <
Details on Cobra's Custom ReliabilitySystem >> http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/90388-new-ak-saiga-vepr-bolt-and-trigger-service-no-extra-waiting/
Our Sub Forum - COBRA'S CUSTOM LLC
IMPROVISE! ADAPT! OVERCOME!

#21 india2/3

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Posted 07 March 2010 - 02:43 PM

NEW PROJECT! nicely done sir, nicely done
.

#22 Nailbomb

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Posted 07 March 2010 - 02:53 PM


Guys, What is this "Red Compound"? I was just at Walmart and then went to a automotive store, but couldn't find anything except the Mcguire stuff made for removing scratch and polishing rims.


Unless I miss my guess they are referring to red jewelers rouge. It is a polishing compound used to finish polish jewelry, especially gold. It has just enough abrasive to take the finish from say a 600 grit to more like a 2400/3200 finish.

It is used on gold because the red residue will make the yellow color of gold look a bit more orange and therefore "richer". No such effect with steel, but it will assist in polishing the metal.

I use the red on most steel i polish, and white for aluminum. what grit is the white effectivly?
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#23 Hobbyist

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Posted 07 March 2010 - 04:30 PM



Guys, What is this "Red Compound"? I was just at Walmart and then went to a automotive store, but couldn't find anything except the Mcguire stuff made for removing scratch and polishing rims.


I think they might be referring to the small pack of red polishing compound that comes with most Dremel kits. My local Home Depot sells it stand-alone on the end cap with all the other Dremel accesories. I used it on mine and the results were very good. Not the caliber of Paul or Cobra's work, but pretty darned smooth and it cycles everything I've tried so far, including Wally World bulk.


It's jewelers polishing compound. Red rouge. Get it at a hobby store, or order it from a jewelers supply (for a fraction of the cost), but the OP is correct, it will work as long as you have taken the finish down to at least 600. The finer the grit used (in steps 200/400/600/800/1200) the less rouge and buffing will be necessary to achieve a high polish.

Polishing contact surfaces is not a cure all, but it does lower friction and drag and will help your gun cycle more efficiently.


What do you use to take it to 600+ grit? Sandpaper seems to be a pain in the Arsss. The dremel bit kit that I bought came with only two grades of wheels, I think one is 100 and the other 200-300. Are there different grit wheels up to 600+ for the dremel? I am sure the answer is yes, is that what you guys use?

#24 S-12 Pauly

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Posted 07 March 2010 - 05:11 PM

What do you use to take it to 600+ grit? Sandpaper seems to be a pain in the Arsss. The dremel bit kit that I bought came with only two grades of wheels, I think one is 100 and the other 200-300. Are there different grit wheels up to 600+ for the dremel? I am sure the answer is yes, is that what you guys use?

I used the dremmel abrasives or prep pads for that, my first one.

They're fun little tools. They bring it to a smooth matte finish.
Posted Image

ETA:
They are also great for paint removal on the carriers to make them look bead blasted. 6 months out & the bare carrier hasn't gotten any rust yet.

The steel is nearly a stainless steel alloy, so its not too prone to corrosion.

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#25 Hobbyist

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Posted 07 March 2010 - 05:14 PM





Guys, What is this "Red Compound"? I was just at Walmart and then went to a automotive store, but couldn't find anything except the Mcguire stuff made for removing scratch and polishing rims.


I think they might be referring to the small pack of red polishing compound that comes with most Dremel kits. My local Home Depot sells it stand-alone on the end cap with all the other Dremel accesories. I used it on mine and the results were very good. Not the caliber of Paul or Cobra's work, but pretty darned smooth and it cycles everything I've tried so far, including Wally World bulk.


It's jewelers polishing compound. Red rouge. Get it at a hobby store, or order it from a jewelers supply (for a fraction of the cost), but the OP is correct, it will work as long as you have taken the finish down to at least 600. The finer the grit used (in steps 200/400/600/800/1200) the less rouge and buffing will be necessary to achieve a high polish.

Polishing contact surfaces is not a cure all, but it does lower friction and drag and will help your gun cycle more efficiently.


What do you use to take it to 600+ grit? Sandpaper seems to be a pain in the Arsss. The dremel bit kit that I bought came with only two grades of wheels, I think one is 100 and the other 200-300. Are there different grit wheels up to 600+ for the dremel? I am sure the answer is yes, is that what you guys use?


Personally, I have a professional shop full of all kinds of specialized grinding, finishing, and lapidary equipment. If I didn't, it would be down to the harware store to pick up the required grits and on the internet for the compounds.

Or you could just pony up $85, send it to Cobra and let him worry about it :angel:


I have 3 SAIGA12's that I have converted to different configurations. All three have been duracoated, 2 have folding stocks and all have different furniture and colors. The internal on all three have been polished and are smooth, but it is not as polished as some on yours that have used the rouge. I am thinking of taking them up another notch, and that requires the higher grit wheels. at least I think that's the way I would go based on what I have heard so far.

Thanks for your help WaffenSchmied.

#26 Rusty truck

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 02:23 PM

I just used what came with my dremal tool. I found just rounding of the edges of the hammer and bolt carriers smoothed out the action a lot. I haven't gone crazy with polishing but I can see the pro's already

Edited by Rusty truck, 12 March 2010 - 02:23 PM.

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#27 Cobra's Custom LLC

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 03:14 PM

You know all you gotta do is drive that rusty truck on up here to my house dude.....

Posted Image

- Bolt & Carrier Mods and Polishing > http://www.Cobras-Custom.com <
Details on Cobra's Custom ReliabilitySystem >> http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/90388-new-ak-saiga-vepr-bolt-and-trigger-service-no-extra-waiting/
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#28 S-12 Pauly

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Posted 12 March 2010 - 10:53 PM

I'm not familiar with Dremel abrasive wheels. However, if you can get them in increasingly fine grits, that would be the way to go. The finer the finish, the faster your work will be when you go to rouge.

Good luck!

Abrasives do come in incremental "grits" they are likely around 1000-1200 grit if you need an idea.
The fine sanding drum that came in your dremel kit will shape it well. (if you keep the tool moving & in the right places)
Posted Image

The abrasive will remove the small sanding marks to make it quite smooth. (It takes a while to remove metal with them, but you want to go slow anyhow) They will make it look professional.
Posted Image

Then the wool with rouge will finish it up.

Posted Image

The key is keeping the tool moving. If you stop (when sanding with the drum) you will make an uneven transition.

It does take practice to get steel finishing right so maybe try a piece of test steel.....

Edited by Paulyski, 17 January 2011 - 02:38 PM.

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#29 Idontblogwellwithothers

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Posted 18 March 2010 - 08:01 PM


What do you use to take it to 600+ grit? Sandpaper seems to be a pain in the Arsss. The dremel bit kit that I bought came with only two grades of wheels, I think one is 100 and the other 200-300. Are there different grit wheels up to 600+ for the dremel? I am sure the answer is yes, is that what you guys use?

I use the dremmel abrasives or prep pads. They're fun little tools. They bring it to a smooth matte finish.
Posted Image

ETA:
They are also great for paint removal on the carriers to make them look bead blasted. 6 months out & the bare carrier hasn't gotten any rust yet... Strange. :unsure:



#30 Idontblogwellwithothers

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Posted 18 March 2010 - 08:04 PM

If you look under knife making supplies you can find kits with many different Cratex wheels for Dremels. Brownells also as some but they cost more.




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