camaro0991 3 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 Hey all, I need a suggestion for a decent red dot sight thats cheap and will hold zero on a saiga 12. I saw the utg leapers one listed on carolina shooters supply and was leaning towards that. Any other suggestions? Has anyone had any luck with the leapers sight they list? Thanks all! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vitamink 90 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 i have had nothing but problems with anything utg or leepers. I've only purchased 3 things with that brand name and all have sucked. I do support you ordering anything from css though. If you haven't done it yet, youll be amazed at how fast your stuff gets to your house (molecular transporter). I personally like the burris fastfireII it's cheap, made for shotgun recoil, holds zero, and is the lightest thing on my shotgun including shells. Another good fit is the aimpoint micro but it'll cost more than your shotgun. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
camaro0991 3 Posted February 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 thanks, Ive heard good things aobut CSS so I'll definitly be ordering from them. The leapers appealed to me due to the price, but if it completly sucks then ill pass on it for now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vitamink 90 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 2 of my favorite lines from here are...buy crap buy twice and cheap strong accurate but you can only have two so either cheap and strong, but not accurate accurate and strong, but not cheap. accurate and cheap but not strong. im guessing the leapers will be either not strong and break, or not accurate and suck. I guarantee it'll be heavy as most of their stuff is. I bought a flashlight for my 12 from them as at the time it had the highest lumen output... it weighed 7...thousand pounds and broke after a few shots. sure it was only 50$...but for 30 bucks more i could have purchased a quality light...so in total money out for a light for my gun i paid 130, when i could have just paid 80...buy crap buy twice. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
davidsuffolk 96 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 Hey all, I need a suggestion for a decent red dot sight thats cheap and will hold zero on a saiga 12. I saw the utg leapers one listed on carolina shooters supply and was leaning towards that. Any other suggestions? Has anyone had any luck with the leapers sight they list? Thanks all! I have a Russian PK-AV which, as the poster above say, isn't cheap but it is strong, it is accurate and is made for the Saiga. Plus it just looks so cool!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tsm002 5 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 (edited) I ran a primary arms micro dot for a long time on my saiga with no issues whatsoever. They've also got amazing customer service and are fairly well regarded on a number of other gun boards that normally can't stand cheap optics. I'd give them a try honestly. Barfcom had an interesting thread awhile back where someone disassembled a variety of cheap optics and found LED's held in by electrical tape and lenses shimmed in with whatever rubber could be found. Primary arms had their stuff much more secured than that in those tests. Still cheap optics (under 100 bucks) but it seems like they've figured out how to do business over there: they give you whatever they can cobble together if your specs are matched to a price point alone. Gotta specify more than that. Edited February 16, 2010 by Tsm002 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Javelinadave 1 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 I ran a primary arms micro dot for a long time on my saiga with no issues whatsoever. They've also got amazing customer service and are fairly well regarded on a number of other gun boards that normally can't stand cheap optics. I'd give them a try honestly. I am the king of "You get what you pay for" but I have to agree with Tsm002. I have a Primary Arms Micro Dot mounted on my full sized Uzi. It takes a hell of a beating, that Uzi bolt is the heaviest gun bolt I have ever see. Coming up on 500 rounds and holds and still holds a perfect zero. They are clearing out Gen 2 blems fo $58 + shipping. How can you go wrong with that? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cellsworth 21 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 I guess a lot depends upon what you will use the set up for. If personal defense is part of it, get the best you can afford. The Aimpoint Micros are great, but as was mentioned, very expensive. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 (edited) Primary Arms Rocks! Great customer service and both Marshall and Nick know what they are talking about. I run an EoTech on my AR but got the Primary Gen2 on the saiga and I really like it. Those guys would rather you make the choice that is right for you over them making a profit! That said, I have had nothing but great service from Greg at Carolina Shooters Supply At $58.00 with a 1 year guarantee how can you go wrong? Edited February 16, 2010 by NinerRider Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobRez 1,895 Posted February 16, 2010 Report Share Posted February 16, 2010 I have recommended to folks here to try the Millet tube style red dot. I have had mine for 2 years now, shooting at least 100 rounds a week in the S12, I can hit the 6" target with slugs at 100 yards. Only cost me $85!! It stays zeroed for me just fine. I think it is the best blend of the seemingly impossible combo of durability, affordability and accuracy. It hasn't seen combat or anything, but I don't baby my S12 by any means. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
why2kmax 0 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 Looked at the primary arms gen2 microdot. Gen 3 aint bad either. Nice for the price. Question for those that have them, any idea if their AK side plate mount fits the S12? AND, would that allow me to use either the red dot or the iron sights (Krebs front and ghost ring rear) if the red dot failed. Or would the red dot just interfere no matter what. I dont have my s12 here so I cant really look at it to determine. I like the Krebs sights, cant miss at 50 yards but having a red dot would help a good bit more if I have the option without having to remove the rear ghost ring. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 (edited) Looked at the primary arms gen2 microdot. Gen 3 aint bad either. Nice for the price. Question for those that have them, any idea if their AK side plate mount fits the S12? AND, would that allow me to use either the red dot or the iron sights (Krebs front and ghost ring rear) if the red dot failed. Or would the red dot just interfere no matter what. I dont have my s12 here so I cant really look at it to determine. I like the Krebs sights, cant miss at 50 yards but having a red dot would help a good bit more if I have the option without having to remove the rear ghost ring. +1 I'd like to get a Gen2. Does it fit on PA's AK side mount rail, http://www.primaryar...&categoryId=103 And, does the rail allow use of Krebs sights as back up? ............................................................................. EDIT: Messaged PA, figure might as well go to the source. Greetings PA,I'm interested in the PA MicroDot Gen2, and have a couple questions pertaining to mounting on a Saiga12. Will the MD-Gen2 mount on your AK side mount rail? Does the rail have enough clearance to allow use of the iron sights? Regards, John Edited February 17, 2010 by ChileRelleno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 I have primary's side rail mount on my S-12 and it works fine. You can't use the stock iron sights but the HK or Krebs might look over the rail without a red-dot mounted. I have attached a pic of my setup. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 Also Primary sells the quick release mounts like Bobro or their house brand that will hold zero and detach quickly. Only difference on the Gen3 over Gen2 is the kill flash and overall length. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IronRonin 19 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 I really want a Kobra red dot, but I can't find ANY place that stocks them at realistic price...some are only 80 bucks and on an airsoft site (I assume a cheap knock-off) and others are wretchedly overpriced at 300+ bucks. Does anyone know a good place to score a legit Kobra red dot?!? Oh, and Tantal is out and wont be getting them for some time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
why2kmax 0 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 I have primary's side rail mount on my S-12 and it works fine. You can't use the stock iron sights but the HK or Krebs might look over the rail without a red-dot mounted. I have attached a pic of my setup. Great pic. exactly what I needed to see. does yours have the $29 optional riser on that as well or just the sight and the ak sidemount? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 (edited) I have primary's side rail mount on my S-12 and it works fine. You can't use the stock iron sights but the HK or Krebs might look over the rail without a red-dot mounted. I have attached a pic of my setup. Great pic. exactly what I needed to see. does yours have the $29 optional riser on that as well or just the sight and the ak sidemount? That is the regular integral mount, no riser. And that pic also answers the question of using irons, i.e. nope. Edited February 17, 2010 by ChileRelleno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 Just the sight on the rail, the riser puts it up to high in my opinion for good cheek weld engagement. Only thing you need to keep in mind is that the dust cover cannot be removed with the rail in place. The fit between the bottom of the rail and the dust cover is about 3/32 of an inch. I wish the rail had a quick release but all of the ones I have seen look flimsy, I am looking for some thumb screws or the like so I don't need to carry an allen wrench at the range. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 I have primary's side rail mount on my S-12 and it works fine. You can't use the stock iron sights but the HK or Krebs might look over the rail without a red-dot mounted. I have attached a pic of my setup. Great pic. exactly what I needed to see. does yours have the $29 optional riser on that as well or just the sight and the ak sidemount? That is the regular integral mount, no riser. And that pic also answers the question of using irons, i.e. nope. Well not so fast, nailbomb has his HK or Krebs I am not sure which on the same rear rail. You may need to raise the front sight a bit but you could co-witness using a side rail with a little work. Probably not the easiest solution but anything is possible. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 Ain't gonna be Krebs nor factory, not using a standard Krebs/factory rear sight. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gemmons 23 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 This may be a stupid question but can the primary sight and rail in question be used by a left handed shooter? I can shoot with either hand but prefer left and I'm left eye dominant. If not could I just mount their sight on my Chaos quad rail? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CoV 0 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 (edited) This may be a stupid question but can the primary sight and rail in question be used by a left handed shooter? I can shoot with either hand but prefer left and I'm left eye dominant. If not could I just mount their sight on my Chaos quad rail? I've never heard of hand dependent sight system, but with the ejection system in a Saiga wouldn't u get ejected shells hitting your arm holding it left handed? so i;d assume that they're ambidextrous. to respond to the Original post I've had pretty good luck with my Simmons shot dot and tapco ak sight rail had it for more than a year now (and several thousand rounds) and it's still zeroed in. the red dot was $80ish. Edited February 17, 2010 by CoV Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wade Pruetz 103 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 This may be a stupid question but can the primary sight and rail in question be used by a left handed shooter? I can shoot with either hand but prefer left and I'm left eye dominant. If not could I just mount their sight on my Chaos quad rail? Well you could but why not mount the sight directly to the Chaos Quad rail? My friend has his Gen2 mounted directly to the Chaos Extended Quad Rail and it works great. After seeing his I had to get a similar setup but didn't want to fork out the money for the Chaos Rail just yet. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gemmons 23 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 This may be a stupid question but can the primary sight and rail in question be used by a left handed shooter? I can shoot with either hand but prefer left and I'm left eye dominant. If not could I just mount their sight on my Chaos quad rail? I've never heard of hand dependent sight system, but with the ejection system in a Saiga wouldn't u get ejected shells hitting your arm holding it left handed? so i;d assume that they're ambidextrous. to respond to the Original post I've had pretty good luck with my Simmons shot dot and tapco ak sight rail had it for more than a year now (and several thousand rounds) and it's still zeroed in. the red dot was $80ish. I have read some post where guys have stated that some side mount scopes didn't work so well for left handed shooting as the rail didn't come over the dust cap far enough to make for a good eye scope alignment . As far as my S-12 ejecting into my left arm it's not even close they eject out about 5-6 ft. on #1 and about 10ft. on #2 setting. Thanks for the info guys. I think I'll just get the sight and mount it to my Chaos rail. The Gen3 states that it's waterproof and I don't see that for the Gen2 but do any of you know if it is. For $20.00 more I might just go with the Gen3 blem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cholly_horse 3 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 try looking up Sightmark Ultra Shot Reflex Sight. has good reviews and is made for high recoil. Just has low battery life Quote Link to post Share on other sites
why2kmax 0 Posted February 17, 2010 Report Share Posted February 17, 2010 Im guessing that since I have the ghost ring rear sight the chaos extended top rail is out for me. using the standard top rail would prob put the red dot in front of the ghost ring and it would be in the way. I dont mind not using the irons if I have the red dot but didnt want them to interfere with each other and I dont want to remove the Ghost ring, which is why I thought maybe that side mount would be ok. Im a left handed shooter too so appreciate Duke asking about the left handedness of the side mount. sigh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
eof2012 0 Posted February 18, 2010 Report Share Posted February 18, 2010 I just ordered a Vortex StrikeFire Red Dot. I have read mostly good things about this sight. It is about $150, has a lifetime warranty, and has a high recoil rating, is waterproof, fog proof, and can be used with both eyes open. When it gets here I will let you know how it works for me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cholly_horse 3 Posted February 18, 2010 Report Share Posted February 18, 2010 I just ordered a Vortex StrikeFire Red Dot. I have read mostly good things about this sight. It is about $150, has a lifetime warranty, and has a high recoil rating, is waterproof, fog proof, and can be used with both eyes open. When it gets here I will let you know how it works for me. looks cool. How much zoom? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted February 18, 2010 Report Share Posted February 18, 2010 (edited) EDIT: Messaged PA, figure might as well go to the source. Greetings PA,I'm interested in the PA MicroDot Gen2, and have a couple questions pertaining to mounting on a Saiga12. Will the MD-Gen2 mount on your AK side mount rail? Does the rail have enough clearance to allow use of the iron sights? Regards, John I will be checking this on a Saiga tomorrow and I will let you know. Thanks Nick Barron Primary Arms, LLC. info@primaryarms.com www.primaryarms.com We are having to take the ak side mount off of the site because we have found out that the rail is out of spec and will not allow the micro to be secured on to the rail. No matter how tight you make the micro mount it will not stop wiggling. We will be sending them back to the factory t get it fixed. I am sorry for the inconvience, just keep checking for the newer version that will work properly. By the way it is not high enough to use irons. The new one will be the same as this one but the rail will be in spec. Thanks Nick Barron Primary Arms, LLC. info@primaryarms.com www.primaryarms.com Edited February 18, 2010 by ChileRelleno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted February 19, 2010 Report Share Posted February 19, 2010 I just ordered a Vortex StrikeFire Red Dot. I have read mostly good things about this sight. It is about $150, has a lifetime warranty, and has a high recoil rating, is waterproof, fog proof, and can be used with both eyes open. When it gets here I will let you know how it works for me. looks cool. How much zoom? Strikefires comes with a screw-in X2 Doubler, the sight itself has no magnification. I have one on my AR. PROS: It is built rock solid, has held zero on the weapon and been pretty close to zero when removed and reinstalled. Parallax free beyond 50 yards, at 100 yards I can hit Minute of Man damned near every time. Adjustments to dot color brightness are easy, reticule adjustments are easy with distinct clicks. Doubler works great, even if it reduces the FoV a bit. CONS: There is a slight tint to the glass, but otherwise great. The lenses caps are very tight, I'm looking for good replacements and on a the brightest days some people *might* ( I haven't) have trouble with the dot not being bright enough, even on highest setting. When mounted normally, the power button is easily activated accidentally. Rotating the sight left 90' solves this, placing the power button on the underside and it is still readily accessible if using the high mount. The X2 Doubler is a screw-in, so it isn't great for quick changes. Overall, I like it and would recommend it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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