My Saiga has a 145mm spread from the factory

[steinlok87 0]

I haven't taken it to the range yet, but I hope it will do better than that!

[jimdigriz 580]

I haven't taken it to the range yet, but I hope it will do better than that!

 

Those numbers are meaningless. I had a similar number on one, but it shoots very well.

[steinlok87 0]

I haven't taken it to the range yet, but I hope it will do better than that!

 

Those numbers are meaningless. I had a similar number on one, but it shoots very well.

 

I figure that the person testing these is drunk on vodka. Either that, or it is more of a function test than an accuracy test.

[ae13291 3]

mine was like 110 or 112 i think but it shoots really well.

[dussandr 76]

Mine is 99mm, and it's a laser.

[ekim 6]

145mm spread = 5.70" I'm assuming that's at 100 yards / meters isn't great shooting, but it still equals a hit on a human or deer size target with military ammo and that's what it was made for I thought. It's a shorter barreled rifle with short sight radius. With better sights and better loads you should be able to cut that down quite a bit I would think. But then again if your putting a 20 or 30 round magazine in and letting it rip, accuracy isn't what your probably looking for.

Edited April 23, 2010 by ekim

[Greenhorn21 7]

yeah when i saw that my saiga has a 96 mm group at 100 meters on the certificate i was upset since saigas should be about 1-2 moa at 100 meters

Edited April 23, 2010 by MDK

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

yeah when i saw that my saiga has a 96 mm group at 100 meters on the certificate i was upset since saigas should be about 1-2 moa at 100 meters

 

Err that is more the accuracy of a bolt rifle than an AK pattern, while Ive seen people do it with the 308 using extensive reloading experience I would feel very happy with 3MOA at 100m from the x39 perhaps a little less from a vice but still 1MOA from the x39 is unrealistic. I point this out only so guys don't think something is wrong when their groups are 3 to 5MOA. This is not a target rifle it is to put not to fine a point on it a battle rifle and wars are not fought against paper targets. I have noticed the rifle seems more accurate at 50m than 100m but that may just be me.

[Greenhorn21 7]

yeah when i saw that my saiga has a 96 mm group at 100 meters on the certificate i was upset since saigas should be about 1-2 moa at 100 meters

 

Err that is more the accuracy of a bolt rifle than an AK pattern, while Ive seen people do it with the 308 using extensive reloading experience I would feel very happy with 3MOA at 100m from the x39 perhaps a little less from a vice but still 1MOA from the x39 is unrealistic. I point this out only so guys don't think something is wrong when their groups are 3 to 5MOA. This is not a target rifle it is to put not to fine a point on it a battle rifle and wars are not fought against paper targets. I have noticed the rifle seems more accurate at 50m than 100m but that may just be me.

this guy was getting 2 moa with the x39

[ae13291 3]

saigas are much more accurate then your normal AK.

[my762buzz 141]

None of my Russian 7.62x39 rifles disperse groups larger than 2 MOA with American made brass cased ammo. Russian steel cased ammo usually seems to shoot a wider group size than domestic.

[paprotective 362]

I had 143mm on mine. Didn't shoot prior to conversion/restoration.

 

Shoots 4-5 'swath' at 100 yards for me w/restoration done.

 

 

 

(swath being 10-40 rounds stringing abit up/down, but all within 4-5" WIDE) ... works for me.

 

[Dirty 4]

Mine says 126 mm is the extreme spread of impacts when firing four bullets at 100m range.

 

126 mm = 4.9606 inches

 

I shoot at 100 yds, sitting at picnic table, iron sights, resting on a 30 rnd mag, wrapped in a hasty sling, with Wolf 124gr FMJ and HP. I can keep most of the shots in a 12" circle (my WASR will do this too). I think people have a tendency to exaggerate when making claims about their ability to shoot.

[kresk 10,063]

I haven't taken it to the range yet, but I hope it will do better than that!

 

Those numbers are meaningless. I had a similar number on one, but it shoots very well.

It's been posted multiple times on the forum those numbers from the factory don't mean shit! Don't know how many excessive repeats of this topic has surfaced. A realistic 2-3 MOA should be acceptable, although ideally better.

[my762buzz 141]

I think people have a tendency to exaggerate when making claims about their ability to shoot.

When its benched with a 30 power scope, its not necessarily the shooter ability.

[Dirty 4]

When its benched with a 30 power scope, its not necessarily the shooter ability.

 

Have you ever shot an AK in the situation that I described in my post? If so what were your results?

[my762buzz 141]

When its benched with a 30 power scope, its not necessarily the shooter ability.

 

Have you ever shot an AK in the situation that I described in my post? If so what were your results?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes AR15, FAL, and AK rifles in that same situation. Unrested shooting the worst inconsistent inaccurate ammo on the planet (Wolf) is going to produce

not so optimal results. The original post was about inherent accuracy which forces out shooter error, using garbage ammo to define the gun's potential,

improperly resting the gun, improper trigger technique, and rapid fire. The joke is when some yahoo loads up some wolf ammo into a saiga shooting it unbenched and yanks the trigger

on each trigger pull and declares his open sights unsupported AK does not shoot as well as his friend's match grade AR15 shooting off a bench with a scope using custom hand loaded

ammo. That becomes an all to common apple to kiwi comparison that generates the minute of man accuracy myth. Putting all other factors aside the ammo quality is probably the biggest

factor. Shooting .3095 to .310 ammo russian ammo in a .311 bore is not going to help make things fairly compared to a given accuracy standard.

[paprotective 362]

Dirty..

 

IRC. 'Have you ever shot an AK in the situation that I described in my post? If so what were your results?'

 

 

I was able to use the irons and just stand and shoot 100 yard 8-9" groups with no problems (no sling).

 

I was shooting from ages 8-12 and then 25-39. So thats about 18 years or so. I think I still suck IMHO..

 

I am always trying to get better. The eyes for me went at 14 so contacts are my friend..

 

I use a 6x32 scope on my 5.45x39 and do VERY well out to 200 yards IMHO with that on a bench with a BAG type rest, but the 7.62x39 with 4x30 scope was still 4-6" groups (as pic/post above shows) at 100 yards so I'm not pushing it. Got a red dot on the 7.62x39 at the moment so i can just "point and shoot"..

 

It takes practice and lots of AMMO..

 

I use the 5.45x39 for 100-225 yards and 7.62x39 out to 150 yards if I had a PURPOSE for each per se.

 

Albert

[Dirty 4]

762, the original post was about factory 4 shot impact results. I made a statement about MY impact results and MY accuracy using iron sights at 100 yds with ammo that is very common. I still stand by my statement about people exaggerating their results. The military has trained me well in proper mechanics of shooting. I'm no "yahoo" yanking on the trigger and I don't know anybody that owns a match grade AR. I'm a guy adding his 2 cents to the forum.

 

Accessory Arms your photo proves my point about exaggerating, the group in your photo shows a 6" inch group and verticaly it looks like 7", but you say 4-5"

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

Mine is a SGL21. Legion Saiga. ~1-1.5 moa.

 

Edited April 25, 2010 by post-apocalyptic

[my762buzz 141]

I'm no "yahoo" yanking on the trigger and I don't know anybody that owns a match grade AR. I'm a guy adding his 2 cents to the forum.

I wasn't refering to you as some yahoo, but rather that its all to often that bad apple to mango comparisons arise. Wolf black box might be commonly available ammo

but its no less the worst. It patterns 3 times wider than the most accurate domestic commercial load I have shot in the same guns. It's bad ammo from an accuracy perspective.

[paprotective 362]

My error 6-7" SWATH would be a better description. MOST are within 4-5" L-R however. then I jerk it or push it..

 

This pic was 25 yards with irons.. about 3 1/2" SWATH..(aka vertical stringing)

 

You can see by the BIG hole that I finally got comfy..

 

 

I'll try to 'bag it' next weekend (at 100) and do another RANGE REPORT when I get back.. (be running the red dot).

 

So as before the CONSENSUS is the factory sheet is SHIT..

 

Take the rifle out and see what YOU can get out of it/her.

 

 

Albert

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[kid_couteau 0]

 

100 yards

benched

3-9 power Simmons scope

Leapers side mounted rail

Golden Tiger ammo

 

I'm impressed with my rifle

Kid Couteau

[my762buzz 141]

 

100 yards

benched

3-9 power Simmons scope

Leapers side mounted rail

Golden Tiger ammo

 

I'm impressed with my rifle

Kid Couteau

I shot 5 shots of Double Tap Vmax into 1.5 inches center to center out of a 7.62x39 saiga At 100 yards. My Vepr of the same caliber was closer to 1 inch.

When I see many individual results like yours, I tend to think that the inaccuracy myths result from inaccurate ammo rather than the platform itself.

I seen bolt action and single shot rifles disperse Wolf .223 ammo at 100 yards into 3 to 5 inch groups. The same rifles will shoot sub-MOA with better ammo.

Not all ammo is equal quality but most probably will not believe this until they come to that revelation.

[my762buzz 141]

My error 6-7" SWATH would be a better description. MOST are within 4-5" L-R however. then I jerk it or push it..

 

This pic was 25 yards with irons.. about 3 1/2" SWATH..(aka vertical stringing)

 

You can see by the BIG hole that I finally got comfy..

 

 

I'll try to 'bag it' next weekend (at 100) and do another RANGE REPORT when I get back.. (be running the red dot).

 

So as before the CONSENSUS is the factory sheet is SHIT..

 

Take the rifle out and see what YOU can get out of it/her.

 

 

Albert

 

Vertical stringing happens as a result of heat build up. The easy fix is space your shots more or use a thicker barrel that acts as a better heat sink.

Unfortunately, saigas are not offered with a 1 inch bull barrel, at least not yet anyways.

Edited April 26, 2010 by my762buzz

[kid_couteau 0]

I did wait a minute or so between shots and felt the barrel to make sure it was cool.

 

Kid

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

I'm no "yahoo" yanking on the trigger and I don't know anybody that owns a match grade AR. I'm a guy adding his 2 cents to the forum.

I wasn't refering to you as some yahoo, but rather that its all to often that bad apple to mango comparisons arise. Wolf black box might be commonly available ammo

but its no less the worst. It patterns 3 times wider than the most accurate domestic commercial load I have shot in the same guns. It's bad ammo from an accuracy perspective.

 

Wolf ammo is great to break in a new rifle though it has a abrasive quality to the case that just seems to take some edges off things you miss polishing with a dremel. A couple hundred rounds should do it. Beyond that Brown Bear or Golden Tiger or yugo milsurp for normal target or plinking. Of course the American Brass is going to be the best of the best with a price that shows it too.

[my762buzz 141]

I did wait a minute or so between shots and felt the barrel to make sure it was cool.

 

Kid

 

I meant you have a good group there. That was good steady aim and decent enough ammo. Just curious, was the top hole your third shot?

Consistent barrel temperature is a factor and checking it like you did was good. A 50 degree F difference might string out each consecutive shot

a bit higher with a wider bullet spiral revolution through the air and considering that the gas behind a rifle bullet is easily over 2000 F flash point several rapid shots heat the bore pretty quickly on any rifle.

Edited April 26, 2010 by my762buzz

[n102788 6]

Mine said 103mm (give or take a few mm) and last time shooting I shot sub 2moa at 100yds 3 shots with an eotech no magnification.

[kid_couteau 0]

Yup the flyer was my third shot

 

I think I got a tad excited

 

Kid