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.17HM2 Kaboom - Everyone please read!!!


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I recently picked up a conversion barrel for my Ruger 10/22 that allowed it to shoot .17HM2 ammo. I posted a rave review here about 3 weeks ago, and today it KB'd on me. Didn't get injured, but it did ring my ears pretty good. I just wanted to post this in case anyone was thinking of getting one.

 

Haven't figured out what caused it yet, but the shell is still in the chamber and it looks similar to a case head separation. The ejector was ripped from the bolt and the magazine broke and flew out the bottom. I did shove a cleaning rod down to see if the bullet was lodged in the barrel, but it wasn't. This rules out the prior round squibbing.

 

I'm going to take it as-is to a gunsmith buddy and see if he can tell me if it was ammo, bolt, or barrel that caused it. I'm not gonna slam the manufacturer, because in a blowback rimfire, anything could have caused this.

 

I knew that this was a possibility when I converted this gun, but figured my eyes would be okay based on the closed-receiver design and relatively low power of the gun/ammo.

 

Will update when I know more.

 

Shane

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Thanks guys, from the barrel mfr:

 

Good morning

There appears to be a major issue recently with the 17 Mach II and the 17 HMR ammo by all of the manufactures. The ammo seems to be being made to a higher velocity and pressure and the heavy bolt handle kit used for the Mach II bolts does not slow down the bolt movement. What is happening is the bolt opens before the bullet leaves the muzzle. This causes the case to become unsupported by the chamber and the cases rupture in front of the rim. This seems to be happening more with the CCI/Federal/Hornady ammo more than the Remington and the Eley but I have also had reports of case failure with those as well. The issue is with the ammo and if it does not change I believe you will see an end to the .17 bore rim-fire offerings for the semi rifles

Let me know what your gunsmith comes up with

Thanks

Chris Murray

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As a semi auto the 10/22's are doomed not to work with the higher pressure .17 round as the barrel mfr has stated. It will not fire successfully, or if it does it won't cycle. I've discussed this with a master gunsmith in the past. A bolt rifle avoids the problem.

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Wrote CCI on Friday and they got back to me today. My reply is first, scroll down to see what the expert said:

 

"CCI Expert",

 

Wow, did this response really take four days to compose? I asked ONE question in my email to you, would it have been so hard to answer that?

 

Are you serious? I'm not going to write down what it says on the package because I'm pretty sure you know.

 

Here's your warning on your website: WARNING: To avoid serious injury from a ruptured cartridge, 17 Mach 2 ammunition should only be used in firearms with components specifically designed to safely fire 17 Mach 2 ammunition, including the firearm's action components (bolt/firing mechanism). Do not use this ammunition in firearms that have been modified unless ALL the action components have been specifically designed or verified by the firearm manufacturer as useable for 17 Mach 2.

 

These components are designed "as usable" for the 17 Mach 2. Why don't you take accountability for your mistakes?

 

I would imagine Ruger also recommends that you don't use Volquartsen .22LR barrels. Toyota recommends that you don't put a cold-air intake on the Tacoma, but I did it anyway. Know why? Because I'm competent enough to pull it off, and the company that made the intake didn't say that it was unsafe to put in a Toyota Tacoma.

 

Maybe it's me, I don't know. Maybe you should correct your warning to say that your ammunition is too inconsistent to fire safely in a blowback operated semi-auto. Naming a Ruger 10-22 w/ conversion barrel would be a great step toward showing that you care about your customers.

 

And lucky for you, I'm a gun-forum-fag, so they'll all hear about this one.

 

Theeeeeeaaaaaankkkkksss!!

 

Shane

 

> Subject: RE: CCI Ammo - Ask the Expert Form

> Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 15:54:56 -0700

> From: cciexpert@ATK.com

> To: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

>

> Shane: please read the Warning on the box of ammunition and the Warning

> on website regarding the modification of firearms to use 17 M-2. Should

> you have a problem with the product, we would be pleased to test

> conformity of the product to Industry Standards and inform you.

>

> Any problem that you encounter with the a modified firearm should be

> directed to the maker of any/all modified parts. The Warnings are quite

> self-explanatory on our concerns for the proper modification of these

> firearms. At a minimum, Ruger does not authorize/approve of the

> addition or replacement of any part not made by Ruger.

>

> Shoot Straight!

> Coy Getman

> 2299 Snake River Ave.

> Lewiston, ID 83501

> CCI/Speer Sr. Technical Coordinator

> (866) 286-7436 ext 5351

>

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

> Sent: Friday, May 21, 2010 12:28 PM

> To: cciexpert

> Subject: CCI Ammo - Ask the Expert Form

>

>

> Shane XXXXXXXXXXX

> XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

> XXXXXXXXXXX

> XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

>

>

> I was writing to let you guys know that I recently picked up an ER Shaw

> 18" .17hm2 conversion barrel for my Ruger 10/22. I installed it and the

> modified bolt handle (I'm qualified, I've done much more intense work

> on firearms) I've had it for about a month now, and have been using it

> at work as my ranch/truck gun.

>

> I have tried three different types of ammo for it; CCI, Hornady, and

> Eley. CCI seemed to be the most accurate and had the lowest standard

> deviation.

>

> Yesterday, on the second round fired out of the magazine, it blew up in

> the receiver.

>

> I don't know what caused it. Upon looking at the chamber, it looks like

> it would if I had a case head separation. The extractor was ripped from

> the bolt, and the magazine was destroyed and flew out the magwell. The

> receiver/barrel don't look damaged. There is no bullet lodged in the

> barrel, so to me that rules out the prior round squibbing.

>

> I'm going to take it to a gunsmith to find out if the problem was ammo,

> bolt, or barrel related, and I will let you guys know what he thinks of

> it.

>

> The ammo used was CCI "fast and furious" 17gr vmax, and it was about the

> 50th round on that cleaning, 250 rounds total down the barrel.

>

> I emailed the barrel manufacturer, and they said they have been getting

> reports about this, and it's an overpressure situation causing the bolt

> to start ejection before the bullet is out of the tube. He specifically

> said that this is a problem with all of the manufacturers of .17HM2

> ammo, but mainly Hornady and CCI.

>

> Have you had this problem before? I know that with a blowback rimfire a

> lot of stuff can go wrong, but maybe if this is a trend you should put

> out a safety message.

>

> Shane

>

 

So maybe I'm wrong, maybe they are, whatever. Just thought I would put out the info.

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Thanks guys, from the barrel mfr:

 

Good morning

There appears to be a major issue recently with the 17 Mach II and the 17 HMR ammo by all of the manufactures. The ammo seems to be being made to a higher velocity and pressure and the heavy bolt handle kit used for the Mach II bolts does not slow down the bolt movement. What is happening is the bolt opens before the bullet leaves the muzzle. This causes the case to become unsupported by the chamber and the cases rupture in front of the rim. This seems to be happening more with the CCI/Federal/Hornady ammo more than the Remington and the Eley but I have also had reports of case failure with those as well. The issue is with the ammo and if it does not change I believe you will see an end to the .17 bore rim-fire offerings for the semi rifles

Let me know what your gunsmith comes up with

Thanks

Chris Murray

 

you beat me to it.i was going to tell you about the ammo recall.glad your not hurt dude!

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Thanks for keeping us informed about this situation Shane.

Since your initial post i've been considering this mod on my 10/22.

 

Might just go with a bolt action rifle if I want to play with 17 now.

 

Making fellow enthusiast aware of potentially hazardous situations is one of the best things about a sight like this.

 

My hats off to you and I'm glad you were not injured.

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Thanks man. I have a Marlin 917V in .17HMR that is a tack-driver. Another "old timer" here that I used to shoot with has one of those little H&R (or NEF, not sure) break barrel .17HM2s. Both will shoot extremely well and do so safely.

 

Shane

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Man, That could have been bad. I'm so glad you weren't injured. Check out this link, some of us were discussing the 17 caliber as a dying breed last year, and the recall of all semi auto rifles made for 17 caliber. http://forum.saiga-1...=1entry446793. None of the bolt rifles in 17 are having this issue, so it's not a dead cartridge, but don't use it in semi auto's. Good luck!!

Edited by Razorback
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  • 2 weeks later...

Sorry to necro this thread, but just had to give an update - Decided I wanted to get rid of this barrel and get a nice Shaw 22lr bbl (no brainer). I figured I would start by asking Sportsman's Guide if they would take it back, knowing that it wasn't their fault and they would probably say to take it up with the mfr.

 

Wrong!

 

Hello Shane,

Thank you for your email.

Thank you for providing this information. You may return the item for a refund or exchange the information is listed below for your convenience.

 

I see a helical-fluted stainless 22bbl in my near future! I love these guys! :super:

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I was just purchasing ammo at the local Farm & Fleet and there were a few notices regarding the .17HMR ammo in the use of semi auto rifles. It strongly urged against the combination. It went more indepth then that but it might be good to keep an eye out for the notice at your local stores.

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