What red dot will the saiga 12 not kill?

[prosecond 1]

I want a red dot sight for my saiga 12 that will work without an added rail. I have a kobra but I think I read not to use it on this shotgun as it can't take the recoil. I also want to make sure it mounts low enough that I don't need a cheek rest. What red dot do I want? I intend to use this for shooting slugs at deer.

[mscottrogers 56]

buy a side mount low rail and get a decent red dot. it will mount like a cobra but you can use a h1 micro or get a big truglo if your using it for hunting

[mikegraffam 11]

I want a red dot sight for my saiga 12 that will work without an added rail. I have a kobra but I think I read not to use it on this shotgun as it can't take the recoil. I also want to make sure it mounts low enough that I don't need a cheek rest. What red dot do I want? I intend to use this for shooting slugs at deer.

 

I use a Burris Fastfire II. It has held up great - no problems at all.. I have somewhere around 200 rds of buck and slugs through the gun since I mounted it.

 

I use it on a side mount because I like back towards my eye more, since it is tiny; but you can get a mount for it that fits into the dovetail for the S12 rear sight.

[TX-Zen 287]

How much do you want to spend, thats a good starting question

 

I'm a big fan of Russian optics, but stay away from the PK-AS. While it's my favorite combloc red dot and it runs like a scalded ass monkey on my AKS74, it really cannot handle the abuse from an S12 unfortunately. I went with the Rakurz specifically for slugs and it's worked out great at close to 1000 rounds of mixed low and high brass, slugs, 3" mags and whatever else I've run through it. A side rail mount with a Primary Arms microdot or Konus Atomic Pro would be fine too.

 

And welcome to the forum

 

 

 

 

Z

Edited November 15, 2010 by TX-Zen

[prosecond 1]

Thanks for the replies and the welcome. I have been reading everything I can and think I want a PK-A sight. East Wave has them for under $200. That is about what I am ok spending. I really like the one piece sights but I guess I could go with a mount/sight combo but would rather not. I like the kobra on my 5.45 but I think I have read that the 12 will cause it problems.

 

By the way my saiga 12 worked fine right out of the box. It shoots point of aim with slugs. It had trouble with winchester light loads but after around 12 shells it now will cycle them.

Edited November 16, 2010 by prosecond

[TX-Zen 287]

If you get the PK-A get the hammer grey version, not the black civilian version. Hammer grey is 'milspec' for the Russian military and MVD, while it's not as tough as an Aimpoint the grey version is definitely military grade. The black civilian model isn't nearly as durable and could give you problems.

 

The grey model might also but I think it's less likely. So if given the choice spend a couple extra bucks and get the original military PK-A. One thing to remember is that the sight picture is very tubular with the PK-A, makes it hard to shoot clays (for me anyway). Fine for slugs though

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Z

[Patria Povo 31]

Great pics Z - very helpful! Do you have something similar for the Rakurz, by any chance?

[TX-Zen 287]

Sure do

 

 

 

 

 

The Rakurz does block the irons due to the tritium container

 

 

 

 

The PK-A grey model is offset enough to use irons while mounted

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Z

[Patria Povo 31]

^

Thanks! That is a very nice looking S-12 too!!

[skiboatsp 111]

Aimpoint

 

I really wanted to go with combloc optics but a good warranty goes a long way

 

Great sight window also. When on target the tube goes away.

 

Edited November 16, 2010 by saigatechusa

[skiboatsp 111]

Opps....hit the wrong button

 

 

Aimpoint

 

I really wanted to go with combloc optics but a good warranty goes a long way

 

Great sight window also. When on target the tube goes away.

 

Edited November 16, 2010 by saigatechusa

[prosecond 1]

How is that PK-A so far as the cheek weld? Do you need a riser?

[stoplossed 2]

I used an Eotech on mine. It was tough and held something of a zero. Just a bit pricey though.

 

 

[Zambidis 90]

Aimpoint

 

Tavis Haley uses a Trijicon RMR on his.

 

Fast fires have mixed reports I have one on one of mine that has held up fine so for through several hundred rounds including 3" slugs and Buck/

[skiboatsp 111]

I used an Eotech on mine. It was tough and held something of a zero. Just a bit pricey though.

 

 

 

Me too

 

[RobRez 1,895]

I have a side mount and a Millet red dot that only cost me $85. Been shooting it for 2 years now. Great battery life, always right on the money, has stayed true after at least 1000 slugs, 500 buckshot and uncountable bird shot. I shoot my S-12 2x per week and have Never had any issues with my Millet!

[Patria Povo 31]

Has anyone tried the Obzor 1P63?

 

It looks good on paper/laptop screen, but I have not read an objective review yet.

[BitBasher 11]

I've had two models of Primary Arms microdots both on mine with no issues at all, each was used with several hundred rounds of slugs and 3 inch magnum buckshot.

Edited November 18, 2010 by Bitbasher

[ViperRy 7]

My Burris FFII has held zero well. Its a great little red dot and it's 150 less than a Trijicon RMR.

[rentprop1 0]

seems like most of you guys are using the side mount then ??

[TX-Zen 287]

Has anyone tried the Obzor 1P63?

 

It looks good on paper/laptop screen, but I have not read an objective review yet.

 

 

LiquidMetal on AR15.com is the only person I know that has the 1P63. I tried to find his review last night but no luck, though I will send him a PM and see if he has the link.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Z

[mikegraffam 11]

seems like most of you guys are using the side mount then ??

 

Yeah, you know - I tried a Chaos rail. But it just wasn't worth all that weight up front.. the rail system weighed far more than the optic and open sights I wanted to put on it, most of the rails went unused, and the sight radius on the opens is poor - albeit better than the stock sights.

 

The quad rail stuff looks cool and all, but I find it way too cumbersome. Instead, I added a wood foregrip to match the wood thumbhole I have on my S12. Looks nice (I like wood, at any rate), and is much lighter and handier.

[crlovel 4]

Where's the best place to order combloc optics?

[Patria Povo 31]

 

LiquidMetal on AR15.com is the only person I know that has the 1P63. I tried to find his review last night but no luck, though I will send him a PM and see if he has the link.

 

Z

 

 

Much appreciated neighbor!

 

I'm still trying to decide which red dot to put on my AKS12 that will work well and look right.

[AJ Dual 43]

Where's the best place to order combloc optics?

 

http://www.eastwave.ca/ Is probably the best.

 

http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/ Is much better than it used to be in the past, but there's still anecdotal reports of orders becoming a nightmare if you need a return, or something does not work etc.

[TX-Zen 287]

LM was kind enough to send me the details of his review:

 

 

 

 

- The glass has a purple-ish tint to it. The lever activated internal filter has a dark purple-ish tint to it. Glass clarity is very good nonetheless.

- The 1P63 is very close to being centered over the bore of the rifle, it is offset 1/8" to the left.

- By design, it sits pretty high. Think chinweld, not cheekweld.

- Build quality is very good. NPZ did a very nice job putting this optic together. Looks and feels like a quality piece.

- True to Kalinka's description, the 1P63 selects one of three reticles based on available light. Very cool feature.

- I was surprised at how light and compact the 1P63 is. Looking at Kalinka's pics (I had nothing else to go on), I got the impression it would be somewhat heavy and bulky. Thankfully, it is neither. It's weight is comparable to my PK-23, although the 1P63 is considerably more slender.

- The performance of this optic outdoors was great. Bright daylight, overcast, dusk, black of night, it performed very well and always selected the appropriate reticle based on the amount of light available. The lever activated filter provides a higher level of reticle contrast when needed on really bright days, a nice feature.

- The performance of this optic indoors was mixed. The variable lighting going from room to room in my house really confounded the 1P63 and it had a hard time reacting to the changing lighting conditions. The reticle would frequently wash out or be too dim to easily pick up. The light sensor picks up the available light through two "portholes" in the front of the sight and I don't think they always deliver a true measure of the available lighting to the sensor while indoors. This problem was not always present indoors but it was frequent enough to bear mentioning. The reticle is not etched into the glass on the 1P63, so you are completely dependent on whatever it gives you. Never had a problem outdoors or when the house was all dark. This is a non-issue for me and probably the majority of people who might buy this optic, but it is something to consider for possible home defense applications if that is your intent.

 

[TX-Zen 287]

Where's the best place to order combloc optics?

 

http://www.eastwave.ca/ Is probably the best.

 

http://www.kalinkaoptics.com/ Is much better than it used to be in the past, but there's still anecdotal reports of orders becoming a nightmare if you need a return, or something does not work etc.

 

 

I've spent literally thousands of dollars with both companies over the years and have had 100% service from both. Kalinka had a bad reputation from 5-6 years ago but during that time I never had any issues. Recently they screwed up on a 1P78 that someone on AR15.com had ordered and they apparently got jerked around. During the same period when the 1P78 problem happened I ordered my Rakurz and a few other separate orders, all of them came through without incident.

 

I definitely feel for the gentlemen that got hosed by Kalinka but for whatever reason myself and a few other combloc optic buffs have not had any problems. I still continue to recommend both companies but there is no doubt the 1P78 incident was handled poorly by Kalinka.

 

 

Z

[ufo 20]

Tested:

- Eotech 552, XPS

- C-more and STS

- Meopta ZD-RD (M-RAD)

 

Eotech is too bigg and heavy, right now i'm testing smaller red-dot in rearsight position.

[taseal 12]

How about the PK-23? anyone use one of those?

 

Trying to decide between a PK-23 and a Burris Fastfire II. (what woudl be a good rail to put the FFII on?)

[Patria Povo 31]

Thanks again Z!!

 

That one really sits high. Looks like Kobra for me, then. Would that work well on an S12?