archlinux 0 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 (edited) A couple of years ago I converted my 7.62x39 rifle to a pistol grip and purchased a Sure-Grip Issy pistol grip. At the time the website stated the grip was made in the USA. However, when I received the grip I noticed it was stamped "Made in Israel." I believe i bought it from blackjackbuffers.com Are the Gun-Tech Sure-Grip Issy grips Made in the USA or Israel? Full-story included below. Edited December 15, 2010 by archlinux Quote Link to post Share on other sites
308SAIGA 55 Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 You can not remember the parts you swapped out, the grip is marked made in Israel.... The grip is irrelevant, Saigas do not come imported with a PG so by adding one you are just increasing your parts count.... Normal parts count for a Saiga Rifle is 14, by adding a PG it goes up to 15.... Once you find out what parts you swapped and who made them, re-post............ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
archlinux 0 Posted December 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 (edited) You can not remember the parts you swapped out, the grip is marked made in Israel.... The grip is irrelevant, Saigas do not come imported with a PG so by adding one you are just increasing your parts count.... Normal parts count for a Saiga Rifle is 14, by adding a PG it goes up to 15.... Once you find out what parts you swapped and who made them, re-post............ PM'd Here is a picture of my rifle. Edited December 14, 2010 by archlinux Quote Link to post Share on other sites
308SAIGA 55 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 She looks compliant, you have 5 USA parts, trigger 3 stock 1 and handguard 1.... Go get your guns back...... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
corbin 621 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 As Saiga308 mentioned, it came with 14 countable parts before it was converted. Adding a U.S. PG would not have decreased the 14 parts. Adding a foriegn PG would have actually upped your foreign count to 15 though. I'm not too familar with that particular grip, but if it says "Made in Israel", I would assume that that's where it was made. Minus one for the stock and another for the trigger. Minus another for the U.S. handguard. That has you at 12 still. Did you use a U.S. made hammer and disconnector too? If so, that would have gotten you down to where you needed to be. That would be the easiest way to go IMO. Some people just use U.S. made mags or mag parts to be in compliance. I wouldn't recommend that as a permanent solution to 922 compliance, personally. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
308SAIGA 55 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 As Saiga308 mentioned, it came with 14 countable parts before it was converted. Adding a U.S. PG would not have decreased the 14 parts. Adding a foriegn PG would have actually upped your foreign count to 15 though. I'm not too familar with that particular grip, but if it says "Made in Israel", I would assume that that's where it was made. Minus one for the stock and another for the trigger. Minus another for the U.S. handguard. That has you at 12 still. Did you use a U.S. made hammer and disconnector too? If so, that would have gotten you down to where you needed to be. That would be the easiest way to go IMO. Some people just use U.S. made mags or mag parts to be in compliance. I wouldn't recommend that as a permanent solution to 922 compliance, personally. Who??? LOL it is 308saiga, the only thing I am in doubt about is that mag which looks foreign and am wondering if it would increase the count by 3 more. Hey as far as I am concerned you bought it with that mag.... Regardless, tell these guys your story and see what they say about getting your guns back.... There are many good guys here and may be able to help with your dilemma......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fumes 84 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Who took his guns away? Was that edited out? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
archlinux 0 Posted December 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 (edited) First off, thanks to you both for helping me clear up whether or not my rifle is in compliance. I did some digging around and found some receipts from my conversion purchases. Fire control group: Tapco G2 from http://www.dinzagarm..._parts/fcg.html I bought a disconnector spring from http://www.dinzagarm..._parts/fcg.html (how would they know the spring is made in the US?) Front-grip is from Ultimak Buttstock I believe is Tapco T6 retractable stock (bought at a local Gun show) Please don't quote this. I may choose to delete it at a later date. I PM'd this to 308saiga and he encouraged me to post it in this thread. I am not in possession of my rifle anymore. The rifle was seized when a search warrant was issued on my residence. All charges that arose from the incident (no firearm charges) have been dismissed and I am in the final process of getting them expunged. The firearms were checked out by the firearms division of the arresting police department who stated in writing that they did not break any federal or state laws. However, I am under the impression that it was somewhat of a cursory check and I am not sure if they counted parts for 922r compliance. I do not really want to rock the boat if I am unsure my rifle is 922r compliant. However, if I can find out for sure that it is, I would love to have my firearms returned to me. Using this 922r compliance calculator (http://jobson.us/922r/) it looks like my rifle is in compliance. Foreign parts 14 standard + PG = 15 US replaced parts FCG = 3 Buttstock = 1 Front-grip = 1 Speaking with my lawyer he encouraged me to file a Motion for Return of Seized Property. However, I have also been told I should just go speak with the police department. Can't seem to find at the moment the original receipts for the firearms. I do have the original factory Saiga boxes with the sticker that has the serial number. In my state you are not required to register rifles/shotguns. Any advice on how I should approach this manner is very much appreciated. thanks in advance and happy holidays everyone Edited December 15, 2010 by archlinux Quote Link to post Share on other sites
308SAIGA 55 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Who took his guns away? Was that edited out? I did not edit anything he told me in a PM, I would rather him tell you....... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
308SAIGA 55 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 I am not in possession of my rifle anymore. The rifle was seized when a search warrant was issued on my residence. All charges that arose from the incident (no firearm charges) have been dismissed and I am in the final process of getting them expunged. I do not really want to rock the boat if I am unsure my rifle is 922r compliant. However, if I can find out for sure that it is, I would love to have my firearms returned to me. Speaking with my lawyer he encouraged me to file a Motion for Return of Seized Property. However, I have also been told I should just go speak with the police department. Can't seem to find at the moment the original receipts for the firearms. I do have the original factory Saiga boxes with the sticker that has the serial number. In my state you are not required to register rifles/shotguns. Any advice on how I should approach this manner is very much appreciated. thanks in advance and happy holidays everyone It is just like an attorney to tell you that you need to do something that does not exist, "expunge what?" if the charges where dismissed there is nothing to expunge! As far as 922r goes, I have posted a letter from ATF that states "the burden of proof lies on ATF to prove that you assembled the rifle, so do not take any receipts or bill of sale just ask for your weapons back. The letter can be found here http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=54843&view=findpost&p=559327 you can download and print it out for your records.... I hope it works out for you..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
archlinux 0 Posted December 15, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Currently, without an expunction, a criminal history run on myself would show the arrest, the charges, and their disposition (dismissal). An expunction order removes anything and everything related to the event from my criminal history, allows me to legally state that I have never been arrested, and requires the agencies that may have stored records pertaining to the case to destroy what they have on file. The letter can be found here http://forum.saiga-1...ndpost&p=559327 you can download and print it out for your records.... Thank you for the letter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
bohound 281 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 (edited) An expunction order removes anything and everything related to the event from my criminal history, allows me to legally state that I have never been arrested, and requires the agencies that may have stored records pertaining to the case to destroy what they have on file. Hahaha! It sounds good anyways, and that's how it's supposed to work. Good luck with that. ETA: You mean an Order of Expungement Edited December 15, 2010 by bohound Quote Link to post Share on other sites
archlinux 0 Posted December 16, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2010 It sounds good anyways, and that's how it's supposed to work. Good luck with that. ETA: You mean an Order of Expungement Yah, I don't doubt that a number of loose ends never get tied up. Luckily the state I live in has a rather strong expunction statute. Expungement/Expunction seem to be used interchangeably. Expunction seems to be used more often in my state (in the official statute/motions/etc). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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