Accurate range ammo

[pjj342 632]

If you are taking your new 16"saiga to the range and getting the sights dialed in at 50 or 100 yards, what kind of ammo would you use that wouldnt break the bank? Im new to AK and theres so many kinds of ammo, russian and american to choose from(not to mention the foriegn military surplus out there). Also, any wisdom for a noob whos going to be trying out longer range Iron sight shooting?

 

 

[Spikester 93]

Anything's OK for the initial sight in, just take a sight tool to adjust the front sight. First time I took mine out it was shooting 2 feet high at 100 yards and I had no tool to adjust the front sight.

[pjj342 632]

Anything's OK for the initial sight in, just take a sight tool to adjust the front sight. First time I took mine out it was shooting 2 feet high at 100 yards and I had no tool to adjust the front sight.

 

I got lucky. After a hundred rounds at pop bottles and cinder blocks and one target I found it already sighted in for the most part. I need to get to the range, on some sand bags and fine tune if necessary. For accuracy sake, should I always shoot the same type and bullet weight of ammo? Will switching up make a difference?

Oh yea, I have a sight tool, wow that must have sucked. Did you get it sighted in that day?

Edited March 8, 2011 by Boomsick42

[DrThunder88 912]

Like most guns, your gun will probably have a favorite bullet weight, shape, and powder charge. Finding it in commercial loadings, especially when it comes to the 7.62x39mm, can be a time- and cash-consuming chore. Most AKs do okay with commercial steel case ammo or surplus ammo. I've not found there too much of a difference between any variety of this caliber typically bought in bulk. There have been some changes in POI when going from, say, Wolf 122gr FMJ to Wolf 124gr HP, but the difference is typically a significantly smaller than the group size itself.

 

You won't go wrong buying one box of as many cheap varieties as you care to, seeing if there's an appreciable difference between them in terms of accuracy, and either stocking up on the best or the cheapest.

[Spikester 93]

I didn't get it sighted in that day, had to order a SKS sight tool online and screw the front sight out to make it shoot lower. I only shoot steel cased cheap ammo, the most accurate I have fired is Silver Bear soft point, in both my Saiga and SKS. Everything else is about the same, Monarch, Bear, Wolf & Uly.

[imarangemaster 315]

With Russian steel cased ammo all running about $200/1,000 or even less, any of it is good. The white and black box Uly that Walmart sells for $.50/20 or CTD sell for $3.75/20 is great ammo. As far as lethal ammo, Wolf Military Classic 124 grain HP (NOT BLACK BOX 122 grn) has the devastating Sapsan 8M3 bullet. It is called the "fragtastic" bullet. The nice thing is that it is only $200/1,000. If you can find some old Chinese Norinco copper washed steel case ammo, it has steel core and make great barrier penetrating rounds. When I was a cop, I had a drive by shooting where the Chinese ammo went through both sides of a car (through the doors) and through the house behind it.

[Revolver Ocelot 3]

Iam very new to this. But is it a given that the sights on a new saiga are going to be off?

[Marc 147]

AK sight in procedure

[pjj342 632]

Iam very new to this. But is it a given that the sights on a new saiga are going to be off?

 

Mine was used and someone else had sighted mine in. But from all ive read , yes. Its not absolutely for sure, but you will want to get an AK/sks sight tool. In my opinion, you may aslo want to get a BlackJack brand recoil buffer, I got both at www.dpharms.com . The buffer does not cut down on kick, of which there is barely any. What it does do is eliminate the steel on steel contact when your action cycles back, and that seems to reduce wear and tear(it seems). I put one in mine and it feels so much smoother. Take care of your baby.

[pjj342 632]

With Russian steel cased ammo all running about $200/1,000 or even less, any of it is good. The white and black box Uly that Walmart sells for $.50/20 or CTD sell for $3.75/20 is great ammo. As far as lethal ammo, Wolf Military Classic 124 grain HP (NOT BLACK BOX 122 grn) has the devastating Sapsan 8M3 bullet. It is called the "fragtastic" bullet. The nice thing is that it is only $200/1,000. If you can find some old Chinese Norinco copper washed steel case ammo, it has steel core and make great barrier penetrating rounds. When I was a cop, I had a drive by shooting where the Chinese ammo went through both sides of a car (through the doors) and through the house behind it.

 

Good info. Is that sapsan 8m3 bullet in any other commercial ammo?

[stankfinger76 3]

I didn't get it sighted in that day, had to order a SKS sight tool online and screw the front sight out to make it shoot lower. I only shoot steel cased cheap ammo, the most accurate I have fired is Silver Bear soft point, in both my Saiga and SKS. Everything else is about the same, Monarch, Bear, Wolf & Uly.

 

I know the SKS and AK sights are basically identical, so I can use the SKS sight tool on my Saiga?

Edited March 9, 2011 by gerlon2fingers

[DrThunder88 912]

You should be able to do so.

[t3mac21 1]

I prefer yugo m67 myself. Yes, it's corrosive but if you just flush everything out with water and then clean as normal, you have no worries. Plus it's cheap, brass cased and non-magnetic. It's pretty accurate stuff.

 

The most accurate (imo) is american commerical production. It's expensive compared to everything else though. But, it's brass, non magnetic, non corrosive and reloadable.

[imarangemaster 315]

With Russian steel cased ammo all running about $200/1,000 or even less, any of it is good. The white and black box Uly that Walmart sells for $.50/20 or CTD sell for $3.75/20 is great ammo. As far as lethal ammo, Wolf Military Classic 124 grain HP (NOT BLACK BOX 122 grn) has the devastating Sapsan 8M3 bullet. It is called the "fragtastic" bullet. The nice thing is that it is only $200/1,000. If you can find some old Chinese Norinco copper washed steel case ammo, it has steel core and make great barrier penetrating rounds. When I was a cop, I had a drive by shooting where the Chinese ammo went through both sides of a car (through the doors) and through the house behind it.

 

Good info. Is that sapsan 8m3 bullet in any other commercial ammo?

 

 

You can find it in either white box with black writing or white box with blue writing Ulyvostok "Hunting Ammo" The key is to feel inside the hollow point with a pin or paper clip and feel the lateral ridges cut inside the jacket. There will be an "8" or an "M" somewhere in the label. That stuff is much rarer than the Wolf MC 124 HP. I saw some at a pawn shop for $10 a box. He knew what he had.

[Etek 32]

Certainly Yugo Brass cased ammo is plenty good...and inexpensive for any 7.62 X 39 sighting in or any other shooting.

[wulf 4]

+1 to yugo brass. Has never failed me and is plenty accurate. I think the sites all have 70s era yugo 7.62... I run 50's era yugo in my 8mm mauser and wow I could not ask for any more accuracy out of it for how inexpensive and old it is.

 

Also allows me to get romantic with my guns back at home.

[pjj342 632]

Maybe a dumb question and I may have already answered it (humor me). I read the ak sight in procedure in the link above.

When shooting three shot groups for sight in, start at 25yds, on the 100yd sight setting. When finished adjusting, this means that my rifle will be sighted in for 25 and 100 yds, so will I be a little high at 50yds?

[DrThunder88 912]

Yes, by the nature of a (rough) parabola.

[pjj342 632]

Yes, by the nature of a (rough) parabola.

 

 

Would make sense. If its on at 25 and 100 it may rise roughly at 50. First time trajectory has been described as parabola to me, good synonym.

[pjj342 632]

As for the moment I have 100rds wolf 154grSP, 40rds tula 122grHP, and just picked up 120rds silver bear123grFMJ. Im going to sight in with the silver bear . Im wondering, should the heavier 154gr's shoot a little lower at 100yds and which ones should I keep loaded for SD?

[DrThunder88 912]

Heavier bullets do tend to land a bit lower than lighter ones owing to their usually lower muzzle velocity. Some quick number-crunching on Handloads.com shows the difference should be about an inch.

 

First time trajectory has been described as parabola to me, good synonym.

If it weren't for drag it'd be exactly a parabola!

[pjj342 632]

Heavier bullets do tend to land a bit lower than lighter ones owing to their usually lower muzzle velocity. Some quick number-crunching on Handloads.com shows the difference should be about an inch.

 

First time trajectory has been described as parabola to me, good synonym.

If it weren't for drag it'd be exactly a parabola!

 

 

Yes, if it were only gravity pulling down the flight path would be a perfect parabola. It would be easier to predict the trajectory in a vacuum. Damn air anyways. Ill see how it goes I think im heading to the range today.

[danklab 57]

As for the moment I have 100rds wolf 154grSP, 40rds tula 122grHP, and just picked up 120rds silver bear123grFMJ. Im going to sight in with the silver bear . Im wondering, should the heavier 154gr's shoot a little lower at 100yds and which ones should I keep loaded for SD?

 

 

 

I'd load up the Soft Points for HD/SD. You will get reliable expansion from those. Your Tula HP's will be a toss up.. most HP's in this caliber behave much like FMJ's more often than expanding and fragmenting as they should.

[pjj342 632]

As for the moment I have 100rds wolf 154grSP, 40rds tula 122grHP, and just picked up 120rds silver bear123grFMJ. Im going to sight in with the silver bear . Im wondering, should the heavier 154gr's shoot a little lower at 100yds and which ones should I keep loaded for SD?

 

 

 

I'd load up the Soft Points for HD/SD. You will get reliable expansion from those. Your Tula HP's will be a toss up.. most HP's in this caliber behave much like FMJ's more often than expanding and fragmenting as they should.

 

 

I shot my rifle in with 123gr silver bear fmj and keep 154gr wolfSP in my mags. I think about it like i would be hunting. Would I use a tula hp for deer, NO, but a wolf soft point, sure. I Would rather a round hit below my aim than above anyways. I did shoot the wolf at 25yds and had no variation from the lighter silver bear.

[imarangemaster 315]

As for the moment I have 100rds wolf 154grSP, 40rds tula 122grHP, and just picked up 120rds silver bear123grFMJ. Im going to sight in with the silver bear . Im wondering, should the heavier 154gr's shoot a little lower at 100yds and which ones should I keep loaded for SD?

 

 

 

I'd load up the Soft Points for HD/SD. You will get reliable expansion from those. Your Tula HP's will be a toss up.. most HP's in this caliber behave much like FMJ's more often than expanding and fragmenting as they should.

While the HPs (like black box Wolf 122 Grn HPs) usually act like FMJ, the Wolf MC 124 grain "Sapsan" JHPs DO expand and fragment, even in water jugs. That is why they are known as "fragtastic" bullets. I have seen pics of 200 pound boar that the Wolf Sapsan just decimated. I keep my VZ58 and Saiga mags loaded with it.

[danklab 57]

As for the moment I have 100rds wolf 154grSP, 40rds tula 122grHP, and just picked up 120rds silver bear123grFMJ. Im going to sight in with the silver bear . Im wondering, should the heavier 154gr's shoot a little lower at 100yds and which ones should I keep loaded for SD?

 

 

 

I'd load up the Soft Points for HD/SD. You will get reliable expansion from those. Your Tula HP's will be a toss up.. most HP's in this caliber behave much like FMJ's more often than expanding and fragmenting as they should.

While the HPs (like black box Wolf 122 Grn HPs) usually act like FMJ, the Wolf MC 124 grain "Sapsan" JHPs DO expand and fragment, even in water jugs. That is why they are known as "fragtastic" bullets. I have seen pics of 200 pound boar that the Wolf Sapsan just decimated. I keep my VZ58 and Saiga mags loaded with it.

 

 

 

 

Those are pretty great. The only bulk HP I trust to perform in this caliber. I need to stock up on some more of those... seen some great vids in ballistics gel that sold me on them. Those are actually what I keep loaded up as well.. as I don't have any SP at the moment.

[pjj342 632]

How much more would the sapson bullets be? Are they still in active production? Are they available? I looked them up after the first mention in this thread but couldnt find any.

[Rhodes1968 1,638]

I use the Yugo Mil-surp almost exclusively at the range, its brass its accurate and its cheap. Clean the weapon when you get home its great stuff.

[pjj342 632]

I prefer yugo m67 myself. Yes, it's corrosive but if you just flush everything out with water and then clean as normal, you have no worries. Plus it's cheap, brass cased and non-magnetic. It's pretty accurate stuff.

 

The most accurate (imo) is american commerical production. It's expensive compared to everything else though. But, it's brass, non magnetic, non corrosive and reloadable.

 

 

When you say 'flush with water' how do you do that, just hose it down or is there a less messy method. The corrosive salts are the problem, correct? So just by cleaning it with the hoppes#9 isnt going to get these salts, the water has to get in to every crevice of the rifle it seems.

[imarangemaster 315]

How much more would the sapson bullets be? Are they still in active production? Are they available? I looked them up after the first mention in this thread but couldnt find any.

Wolf Military Classic has the 8M3 Sapsan bullet. It runs about $200/1,000 + or -. The bullets are not available separately.