toshbar 36 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Well today while instructing a 3 day Appleseed, I got out to the known distance range which goes out to 500 yards. I shot my 5.45 off sandbags and got a 4" group at 500 yards. I was using a $35 Tasco Pronghorn 3-9x40 on side mount. I just thought I'd let everyone know. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
physicsnerd 139 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Do you have pics of your target? What ammo did you use? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
patriot 7,197 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 3-shot or 5-shot? Now the ? is, can you do it again? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Garys4598 1,065 Posted May 30, 2011 Report Share Posted May 30, 2011 Oh yeah. . . and I've got some prime swampland property with a terrific view for sale. I call BS. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted May 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 Do you have pics of your target? What ammo did you use? No pics of today. Russian surplus from the '70s. Target was the same one as this thread: http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/59620-this-has-to-be-a-record It was a 5 shot group, but I pulled one down and to the right about 20". The remaining 4 shots could have been easily covered by a dvd, which I know is 5.5". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
paprotective 362 Posted May 31, 2011 Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 I don't call BS.. I had 2 1/4" groups at 200 yards with mine last spring with a FIXED 6x30 NCStar scope.. Al Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted May 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 I don't call BS.. I had 2 1/4" groups at 200 yards with mine last spring with a FIXED 6x30 NCStar scope.. Al Although mine is 3-9x, I just leave it on 9 and zeroed for 500 yards. Hold about 24" low @ 200 yards and you're good. I have found that if I change the magnification, the POI will shift. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
physicsnerd 139 Posted May 31, 2011 Report Share Posted May 31, 2011 Do you have pics of your target? What ammo did you use? No pics of today. Russian surplus from the '70s. Target was the same one as this thread: http://forum.saiga-1...-to-be-a-record It was a 5 shot group, but I pulled one down and to the right about 20". The remaining 4 shots could have been easily covered by a dvd, which I know is 5.5". Cool, that is some excellent shooting. Makes you wonder how careful they are with the acceptance certificates. I mean I have heard several people talk about them in the mid 100s of mm but it looks like they are capable of much, much more! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted June 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Cool, that is some excellent shooting. Makes you wonder how careful they are with the acceptance certificates. I mean I have heard several people talk about them in the mid 100s of mm but it looks like they are capable of much, much more! Mine said 141mm at 100m, which would be 5.5 MOA. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SergeK 15 Posted June 1, 2011 Report Share Posted June 1, 2011 Mine says 108mm Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sickness 89 Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Oh yeah. . . and I've got some prime swampland property with a terrific view for sale. I call BS. C'mon now.. this claim is certainly plausible.. now if he said he was shooting sub-MOA all day long, then I'd agree. But every gun will shoot a lucky group now and again. Even a gun that shoots 8" at 100 yds. Fire enough 5 shot groups, and you WILL get a sub-MOA group in there somewhere. An 8" gun like that will RANDOMLY put 5 shots somewhere in an 8" circle at 100 yds.. and since it is random, sooner or later if you keep trying, you'll get a sweet group. The groups before and after might suck.. but you will get a non-average one time or other. Sort of like roulette. Keep spinning the wheel, and sooner or later 00 will come up 6 times in a row. Its not ordinary, and the wheel isn't broken. Thats just how randomness works. A lot of shooters, who don't reflect on this point, will assume their rifle is a sub-MOA rifle, reasoning that the gun is capable of shooting a fine group (they have their lucky group on paper) and they figure if they could just get their act together, they should be able to repeat it. This is just as much in error as assuming that because you won some money once at roulette, that you could always win at roulette. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Garys4598 1,065 Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Oh yeah. . . and I've got some prime swampland property with a terrific view for sale. I call BS. C'mon now.. this claim is certainly plausible.. now if he said he was shooting sub-MOA all day long, then I'd agree. But every gun will shoot a lucky group now and again. Even a gun that shoots 8" at 100 yds. Fire enough 5 shot groups, and you WILL get a sub-MOA group in there somewhere. An 8" gun like that will RANDOMLY put 5 shots somewhere in an 8" circle at 100 yds.. and since it is random, sooner or later if you keep trying, you'll get a sweet group. The groups before and after might suck.. but you will get a non-average one time or other. Sort of like roulette. Keep spinning the wheel, and sooner or later 00 will come up 6 times in a row. Its not ordinary, and the wheel isn't broken. Thats just how randomness works. A lot of shooters, who don't reflect on this point, will assume their rifle is a sub-MOA rifle, reasoning that the gun is capable of shooting a fine group (they have their lucky group on paper) and they figure if they could just get their act together, they should be able to repeat it. This is just as much in error as assuming that because you won some money once at roulette, that you could always win at roulette. Is it "plausible" or possible? Sure; absolutely. But so are little green men from outer space. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rifleshooter474 2 Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 I would say you are getting your money worth from both rifle and scope. Nice shooting :-) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jeep45238 6 Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Having personlly shot a 5.5 inch group at500 yards with a stock k31, no optic, using only a sling for support, I believe him. Fellow RWVA instructor here. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sickness 89 Posted July 10, 2011 Report Share Posted July 10, 2011 Is it "plausible" or possible? Sure; absolutely. But so are little green men from outer space. So if someone came home from Vegas and said they had an incredible night at roulette, you'd disbelieve them? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted July 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Glad to see this at the top! Well I just got back from another appleseed and forgot to take ANY centerfire rifles with me .... so I just played with my 10/22 paratrooper and shot a 232 on the AQT. Haven't shot one in 3 or 4 months. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jeep45238 6 Posted July 11, 2011 Report Share Posted July 11, 2011 Not bad. I hadn't shot one for about a hear, dropped down on somebodys 10/22 and did a 200 (did stage 2, called flier stage 3 and 4). I was satisfied. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IRONWORKER 0 Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I've shot some real nice groups with my 5.45 before so i don't doubt it - Nice shooting!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rifleshooter474 2 Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 This proves one does not need to buy a high dollar optic, to obtain good results with a quality rifle. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jeep45238 6 Posted July 30, 2011 Report Share Posted July 30, 2011 It's about the software of the shooter, not the hardware (most of the time). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
THX1138 7 Posted July 30, 2011 Report Share Posted July 30, 2011 It's about the software of the shooter, not the hardware (most of the time). Very true, I own several guns that are more accurate than the shooter (me)..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted July 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2011 (edited) This proves one does not need to buy a high dollar optic, to obtain good results with a quality rifle. I'll go with this to a point. I think the $40 scope is good enough for punching paper in very controlled conditions, but I doubt it would hold up long being drug through the woods. I'm looking into a POSP but not sure if I want to spend the monies on it now. The Tasco does hold good zero with this mount. Might only be off a foot at 500 yds. each time I put it back on. Edited July 30, 2011 by toshbar Quote Link to post Share on other sites
my762buzz 141 Posted July 31, 2011 Report Share Posted July 31, 2011 This proves one does not need to buy a high dollar optic, to obtain good results with a quality rifle. I'll go with this to a point. I think the $40 scope is good enough for punching paper in very controlled conditions, but I doubt it would hold up long being drug through the woods. I'm looking into a POSP but not sure if I want to spend the monies on it now. The Tasco does hold good zero with this mount. Might only be off a foot at 500 yds. each time I put it back on. My long range 500-1000 yard rig has produced 0.3 inch groups with Federal Gold Medal Match ammo pretty consistently but sometimes the same Gold Medal Match ammo on warmer days produces groups of 0.5 MOA. I have also managed to shoot some Australian surplus 7.62 Nato near 1 MOA on one of my last range trips. Most surplus ammo does not do nearly as well. More like 1 to 1.5 MOA out of the same rifle. I would say your doing good with a $40 Tasco scope. I tried less expensive scopes on the same rifle many years ago but the recoil destroyed them. I tried BSA, Tasco, and Simmons. Finally I got tired of buying replacements, so I bought some expensive glass. http://www.valdada.com/product/576e210e-44ed-4445-ad85-0905ed8dab82.aspx However if I had to do it over again, I would rather get a night force scope. http://www.nightforceoptics.com/SCOPES_OVERVIEW/8-32x56___12-42x56/8-32x56_-_12-42x56.html I seen a video about how they make them and nothing seemed to come close to the quality for the money. You could probably run over it with a SUV and it would probably still work perfect. The glass plane lazer etched reticles are pretty amazing and are extremely thin and precise for long range. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mpringle 0 Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Having personlly shot a 5.5 inch group at500 yards with a stock k31, no optic, using only a sling for support, I believe him. Fellow RWVA instructor here. Free hand with a sling? That is something i would have to see to believe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted August 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 (edited) Free hand with a sling? That is something i would have to see to believe. not sure what 'free hand' means, but he was shooting prone (lying on the ground), I'm sure. Wanna see someone not be able to hit the broad side of a barn from inside the barn, learn a few simple techniques, and then shoot 2MOA groups with a ruger 10/22? Come out to an Appleseed. Edited August 1, 2011 by toshbar Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jeep45238 6 Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Prone with a USGI web sling. Come out to Gibsonburg, OH and we'll duplicate the results :-) 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mpringle 0 Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 Prone with a USGI web sling. Come out to Gibsonburg, OH and we'll duplicate the results :-) I thought you ment standing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toshbar 36 Posted September 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2011 Shot another > 1MOA group at 500 yards today. Going angain to the range tomorrow. will get photogs. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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