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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a quick detach version using a Saiga . Nothing earth shattering but it's a nice bit of machining . But since we did it , it's a TOY ? We put together a launching unit that will put 15 rocket's inside a 25 yrd circle , each with enough concussive force to put you on your ass using components and construction methods in a way that keep it from putting everyone who touches it in jail and it's a TOY ? Well , ok , maybe that one , but it's a damn cool toy that damn well did it's job . We build solid firearms and we back them up . We've been doing this for over 10 years and will continue to do so . How that's going to destroy our credibility I don't know , guess I'm not the marketing genius you are . If you don't like the show , whatever , there's enough copycat's in the works that I'm sure you'll find one with a bland enough crew that you wont have to worry about "drama" . Enjoy

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We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a q

This one quote, just sums up 95% of the people here in a few lines.   "Just enjoy the show and be happy."   From day one, when you mentioned the wrong word, PRO MAG for example, you faced being r

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburb

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I wouldn't listen to them too much there will always be "haters." You do very fine work, that speaks for itself.

 

I don't fault the editors and producers of the show for focusing on atypical fire arms in the show, they're trying to give an audience of people who could checkout youtube the more mondane a more unique experiance. At the same time they're trying to walk a fine line for the purposes as broad based appeal. Not every part of the country is "gun friendly," and I feel alot of the percieved bias you guys see is really just an attempt by the production not to scare away that part of the audience.

 

I think the show is great entertainment, I've watched every episode, but I think if there is a failure its more a matter of venue. Then again I don't think the Discovery channel should even be called the Discovery channel at this point. The show matches up with the type of shows Discovery put out these days, shows seemingly targeted to working class viewers. There in lies where I see its failure, it seems too targeted while lacking enough educational aspects to warrant being on Discovery, much like those other shows . That aspect of it at times I find it comes off as condecending, where the producers gloss over anything techinal in favor of almost anything else. For example the Ma-Deuce episode, while I realize the point of the sequence was to show the guest was excessively knowledgeable, what you could make out over the "dazzled" sound effects and overlapped dialogue is exactly the sort of details even historical shows on firearms have failed to give us. So rather than embrace the fact that the cast of the show and their guests are highly intelligent and knowledgable its feels a bit dumbed down. I hope the show keeps coming, but if season 1 offered us a double M16 and season 2 opened with a triple m16... how much further can this format go?

Maybe a M16 version of this for season 20?-I hope so.

http://en.wikipedia....VII_century.png

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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a quick detach version using a Saiga . Nothing earth shattering but it's a nice bit of machining . But since we did it , it's a TOY ? We put together a launching unit that will put 15 rocket's inside a 25 yrd circle , each with enough concussive force to put you on your ass using components and construction methods in a way that keep it from putting everyone who touches it in jail and it's a TOY ? Well , ok , maybe that one , but it's a damn cool toy that damn well did it's job . We build solid firearms and we back them up . We've been doing this for over 10 years and will continue to do so . How that's going to destroy our credibility I don't know , guess I'm not the marketing genius you are . If you don't like the show , whatever , there's enough copycat's in the works that I'm sure you'll find one with a bland enough crew that you wont have to worry about "drama" . Enjoy

 

 

touché :up:

 

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I wouldn't listen to them too much there will always be "haters." You do very fine work, that speaks for itself.

 

I don't fault the editors and producers of the show for focusing on atypical fire arms in the show, they're trying to give an audience of people who could checkout youtube the more mondane a more unique experiance. At the same time they're trying to walk a fine line for the purposes as broad based appeal. Not every part of the country is "gun friendly," and I feel alot of the percieved bias you guys see is really just an attempt by the production not to scare away that part of the audience.

 

I think the show is great entertainment, I've watched every episode, but I think if there is a failure its more a matter of venue. Then again I don't think the Discovery channel should even be called the Discovery channel at this point. The show matches up with the type of shows Discovery put out these days, shows seemingly targeted to working class viewers. There in lies where I see its failure, it seems too targeted while lacking enough educational aspects to warrant being on Discovery, much like those other shows . That aspect of it at times I find it comes off as condecending, where the producers gloss over anything techinal in favor of almost anything else. For example the Ma-Deuce episode, while I realize the point of the sequence was to show the guest was excessively knowledgeable, what you could make out over the "dazzled" sound effects and overlapped dialogue is exactly the sort of details even historical shows on firearms have failed to give us. So rather than embrace the fact that the cast of the show and their guests are highly intelligent and knowledgable its feels a bit dumbed down. I hope the show keeps coming, but if season 1 offered us a double M16 and season 2 opened with a triple m16... how much further can this format go?

Maybe a M16 version of this for season 20?-I hope so.

http://en.wikipedia....VII_century.png

I've read every sentence you've written here twice . I agree wholeheartedly with you , in fact , I'd say you're more right then you could know . It's a constant battle for us . In the end , we explain everything 2 way's . In a manner that works for someone who has knowledge of what they're looking at and in a manner that someone who has never seen any gun will [hopefully] understand . Let me give you an example , take a ground up build like the long range AK and reduce it to 3 sentences . makes you nuts.

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I wouldn't listen to them too much there will always be "haters." You do very fine work, that speaks for itself.

 

I don't fault the editors and producers of the show for focusing on atypical fire arms in the show, they're trying to give an audience of people who could checkout youtube the more mondane a more unique experiance. At the same time they're trying to walk a fine line for the purposes as broad based appeal. Not every part of the country is "gun friendly," and I feel alot of the percieved bias you guys see is really just an attempt by the production not to scare away that part of the audience.

 

I think the show is great entertainment, I've watched every episode, but I think if there is a failure its more a matter of venue. Then again I don't think the Discovery channel should even be called the Discovery channel at this point. The show matches up with the type of shows Discovery put out these days, shows seemingly targeted to working class viewers. There in lies where I see its failure, it seems too targeted while lacking enough educational aspects to warrant being on Discovery, much like those other shows . That aspect of it at times I find it comes off as condecending, where the producers gloss over anything techinal in favor of almost anything else. For example the Ma-Deuce episode, while I realize the point of the sequence was to show the guest was excessively knowledgeable, what you could make out over the "dazzled" sound effects and overlapped dialogue is exactly the sort of details even historical shows on firearms have failed to give us. So rather than embrace the fact that the cast of the show and their guests are highly intelligent and knowledgable its feels a bit dumbed down. I hope the show keeps coming, but if season 1 offered us a double M16 and season 2 opened with a triple m16... how much further can this format go?

Maybe a M16 version of this for season 20?-I hope so.

http://en.wikipedia....VII_century.png

I've read every sentence you've written here twice . I agree wholeheartedly with you , in fact , I'd say you're more right then you could know . It's a constant battle for us . In the end , we explain everything 2 way's . In a manner that works for someone who has knowledge of what they're looking at and in a manner that someone who has never seen any gun will [hopefully] understand . Let me give you an example , take a ground up build like the long range AK and reduce it to 3 sentences . makes you nuts.

 

If somebody's hating it means your doing something right!

 

Keep blowing shit up!!!

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Well, I for one enjoy the hell outa the show. I don't get the Outdoor Channel and all of it's gun friendly/based shows, so Sons of Guns is about the ONLY firearm related show I can watch with my cable package. The fact that it's a company/people that we already know as a site sponsor for websites like this one and Gunco that are dedicated to our passion/hobby, is just the icing on the cake. If Will gets as famous or as wealthy as OCC did off of Discovery/TLC, then I say "GOOD FOR HIM"!!!!!! Good luck Will.

 

Signed "a fan".

 

And BTW, I got about misty eyed as you when I saw the wooden sign your friend made. That was freaking awesome, and the sign of a true brother.

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I wouldn't listen to them too much there will always be "haters." You do very fine work, that speaks for itself.

 

I don't fault the editors and producers of the show for focusing on atypical fire arms in the show, they're trying to give an audience of people who could checkout youtube the more mondane a more unique experiance. At the same time they're trying to walk a fine line for the purposes as broad based appeal. Not every part of the country is "gun friendly," and I feel alot of the percieved bias you guys see is really just an attempt by the production not to scare away that part of the audience.

 

I think the show is great entertainment, I've watched every episode, but I think if there is a failure its more a matter of venue. Then again I don't think the Discovery channel should even be called the Discovery channel at this point. The show matches up with the type of shows Discovery put out these days, shows seemingly targeted to working class viewers. There in lies where I see its failure, it seems too targeted while lacking enough educational aspects to warrant being on Discovery, much like those other shows . That aspect of it at times I find it comes off as condecending, where the producers gloss over anything techinal in favor of almost anything else. For example the Ma-Deuce episode, while I realize the point of the sequence was to show the guest was excessively knowledgeable, what you could make out over the "dazzled" sound effects and overlapped dialogue is exactly the sort of details even historical shows on firearms have failed to give us. So rather than embrace the fact that the cast of the show and their guests are highly intelligent and knowledgable its feels a bit dumbed down. I hope the show keeps coming, but if season 1 offered us a double M16 and season 2 opened with a triple m16... how much further can this format go?

Maybe a M16 version of this for season 20?-I hope so.

http://en.wikipedia....VII_century.png

I've read every sentence you've written here twice . I agree wholeheartedly with you , in fact , I'd say you're more right then you could know . It's a constant battle for us . In the end , we explain everything 2 way's . In a manner that works for someone who has knowledge of what they're looking at and in a manner that someone who has never seen any gun will [hopefully] understand . Let me give you an example , take a ground up build like the long range AK and reduce it to 3 sentences . makes you nuts.

I'm an engineer I know how that "2 way's" can be.

 

The fact that they have you explain it twice and always go with the simple explanation... this is something thats great about the internet; Discovery's website already has streaming clips for a number of its shows and it has blogs and links for them as well. It might take a little arm twisting, but what'd be great to see is if they let you, either through their site or your site, use the unaired clips with the more technical information as something extra for fans to go online and see. Discovery always has the quick blurb "if you'd like know more go to Discovery.com"...more details about what's involved in a project sounds exactly like the sort of thing that would drive fans online to their website. The way I see it, thats pre-made online content that just needs a home.

 

That said, I have a technical question: at the end of the episode where you built the shoulder fired M1919, you removed barrel and forearm section of it, those parts you guys picked up as a kit... in the show we just heard that it was slowing down the rate of fire... what caused that section to slow the M1919's rate of fire? From what little I know, the recoil action of that front half partipates in cycling and that in lightening it as you did would have helped it, not hurt it as it did.

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To be quite honest, I'm jealous as hell. I wish I had the equipment you have at you disposal. I have cut up HK weapons for making a handful of crazy prototypes and did it all with a dremel and a tig. Had a hell of a good time doing it though, but it cost a shitload of money. It's just like when I was young man and I went to get parts to make a hoped up small block for my Ford Ranger. The guy at the parts counter said, speed cost money son, how fast do you want to go? (It way very fast by the way)

Guess it's just a passion some people have?

It would be great if I had a contact in the U of I Engineering Dept, like you do with the University in LA. I have had this idea for a "piston driven break" I have been dying to build for a couple of years now. In theory my design will counteract recoil by the inertia of a forward moving mass.

It could be the next great firearms invention, or just a nifty idea that really didn't do what I thought it should? Anyway, keep up the good work. I think you are starting to convert some of the liberals in my area.

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I wouldn't listen to them too much there will always be "haters." You do very fine work, that speaks for itself.

 

I don't fault the editors and producers of the show for focusing on atypical fire arms in the show, they're trying to give an audience of people who could checkout youtube the more mondane a more unique experiance. At the same time they're trying to walk a fine line for the purposes as broad based appeal. Not every part of the country is "gun friendly," and I feel alot of the percieved bias you guys see is really just an attempt by the production not to scare away that part of the audience.

 

I think the show is great entertainment, I've watched every episode, but I think if there is a failure its more a matter of venue. Then again I don't think the Discovery channel should even be called the Discovery channel at this point. The show matches up with the type of shows Discovery put out these days, shows seemingly targeted to working class viewers. There in lies where I see its failure, it seems too targeted while lacking enough educational aspects to warrant being on Discovery, much like those other shows . That aspect of it at times I find it comes off as condecending, where the producers gloss over anything techinal in favor of almost anything else. For example the Ma-Deuce episode, while I realize the point of the sequence was to show the guest was excessively knowledgeable, what you could make out over the "dazzled" sound effects and overlapped dialogue is exactly the sort of details even historical shows on firearms have failed to give us. So rather than embrace the fact that the cast of the show and their guests are highly intelligent and knowledgable its feels a bit dumbed down. I hope the show keeps coming, but if season 1 offered us a double M16 and season 2 opened with a triple m16... how much further can this format go?

Maybe a M16 version of this for season 20?-I hope so.

http://en.wikipedia....VII_century.png

I've read every sentence you've written here twice . I agree wholeheartedly with you , in fact , I'd say you're more right then you could know . It's a constant battle for us . In the end , we explain everything 2 way's . In a manner that works for someone who has knowledge of what they're looking at and in a manner that someone who has never seen any gun will [hopefully] understand . Let me give you an example , take a ground up build like the long range AK and reduce it to 3 sentences . makes you nuts.

I'm an engineer I know how that "2 way's" can be.

 

The fact that they have you explain it twice and always go with the simple explanation... this is something thats great about the internet; Discovery's website already has streaming clips for a number of its shows and it has blogs and links for them as well. It might take a little arm twisting, but what'd be great to see is if they let you, either through their site or your site, use the unaired clips with the more technical information as something extra for fans to go online and see. Discovery always has the quick blurb "if you'd like know more go to Discovery.com"...more details about what's involved in a project sounds exactly like the sort of thing that would drive fans online to their website. The way I see it, thats pre-made online content that just needs a home.

 

That said, I have a technical question: at the end of the episode where you built the shoulder fired M1919, you removed barrel and forearm section of it, those parts you guys picked up as a kit... in the show we just heard that it was slowing down the rate of fire... what caused that section to slow the M1919's rate of fire? From what little I know, the recoil action of that front half partipates in cycling and that in lightening it as you did would have helped it, not hurt it as it did.

no booster on that front end kit . With it's lighter barrel it actually cycled fine but to get it faster , went to a 10 in barrel w/ a booster .

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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a quick detach version using a Saiga . Nothing earth shattering but it's a nice bit of machining . But since we did it , it's a TOY ? We put together a launching unit that will put 15 rocket's inside a 25 yrd circle , each with enough concussive force to put you on your ass using components and construction methods in a way that keep it from putting everyone who touches it in jail and it's a TOY ? Well , ok , maybe that one , but it's a damn cool toy that damn well did it's job . We build solid firearms and we back them up . We've been doing this for over 10 years and will continue to do so . How that's going to destroy our credibility I don't know , guess I'm not the marketing genius you are . If you don't like the show , whatever , there's enough copycat's in the works that I'm sure you'll find one with a bland enough crew that you wont have to worry about "drama" . Enjoy

 

Can I buy that 1000 yard AK TOY? :rolleyes:

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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a quick detach version using a Saiga . Nothing earth shattering but it's a nice bit of machining . But since we did it , it's a TOY ? We put together a launching unit that will put 15 rocket's inside a 25 yrd circle , each with enough concussive force to put you on your ass using components and construction methods in a way that keep it from putting everyone who touches it in jail and it's a TOY ? Well , ok , maybe that one , but it's a damn cool toy that damn well did it's job . We build solid firearms and we back them up . We've been doing this for over 10 years and will continue to do so . How that's going to destroy our credibility I don't know , guess I'm not the marketing genius you are . If you don't like the show , whatever , there's enough copycat's in the works that I'm sure you'll find one with a bland enough crew that you wont have to worry about "drama" . Enjoy

 

Can I buy that 1000 yard AK TOY? :rolleyes:

undecided . cost us close to 4 grand to make one . not sure how "streamline-able" the process is on that rifle . I wanted to do one , only way to find out if you can is to do it , not sure how many other folks want to toss 4 g at a AK though .

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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a quick detach version using a Saiga . Nothing earth shattering but it's a nice bit of machining . But since we did it , it's a TOY ? We put together a launching unit that will put 15 rocket's inside a 25 yrd circle , each with enough concussive force to put you on your ass using components and construction methods in a way that keep it from putting everyone who touches it in jail and it's a TOY ? Well , ok , maybe that one , but it's a damn cool toy that damn well did it's job . We build solid firearms and we back them up . We've been doing this for over 10 years and will continue to do so . How that's going to destroy our credibility I don't know , guess I'm not the marketing genius you are . If you don't like the show , whatever , there's enough copycat's in the works that I'm sure you'll find one with a bland enough crew that you wont have to worry about "drama" . Enjoy

 

Can I buy that 1000 yard AK TOY? :rolleyes:

undecided . cost us close to 4 grand to make one . not sure how "streamline-able" the process is on that rifle . I wanted to do one , only way to find out if you can is to do it , not sure how many other folks want to toss 4 g at a AK though .

 

I will be eye balling that rifle.

Maybe I could make a redreck copy using a Vepr, YHM handguard and a 24 inch bull barrel with a target crown.

Not sure if 1 in 10 will be the best the twist rate for a barrel that long though? Anyone know what the twist rate was on the NDM-86 308 Dragunov rifles?

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no booster on that front end kit . With it's lighter barrel it actually cycled fine but to get it faster , went to a 10 in barrel w/ a booster .

 

I wondered that too. Also, do you recommend that buffer tube that came with the kit? It looked like it was causing you guys issues. I asked about it in this thread, if you'd prefer to keep this one more on topic.

 

 

Thanks Will

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I like the show a lot. Most people's complaints seem to revolve around how it's dumbed down or glossed over on the technical details that gunnies would find interesting, but it has to be that way. If they went into all the technical details (not to mention the time constraints of cramming a week long build into about 15 minutes when you factor in the commercials) it would make the non-gun folks change the channel.

 

Maybe Will can just install a live webcam in his shop so we can watch all the unedited and "boring" stuff the Discovery channel leaves on the cutting room floor. Like headspacing discussions, filling out form 1s, and chewing his boy's asses out when they screw up something :)

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Examine, simplify and eliminate... This is what the producers do to SOG. It's also an effective development tactic that can be applied to gunsmithing and coincidentally what Will should do to the haters.

 

The show is what it is. Will doesn't/can't control editing. So to hate on him for it or to question his integrity is stupid. Will is getting the opportunity to do something never done before and we are lucky enough to get to see it. You also have to understand that guns/gun smithing alone isn't enough to keep your ratings where you need them. So there has to be some drama/reality TV to keep the "average" watcher involved. All in all it's a fun show. It's the only show I actually set aside time to watch.

 

Congrats to Will, his staff and the TV crew for putting together such a unique experience. I wish you all great success and many more future episodes.

 

BTW, don't miss Sons of Guns tomorrow night at 9:00 pm Eastern on the Discovery Channel. LOL!

 

GL Red Jacket!!!

Edited by Bridis
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I like the show and try not to read to far into what they build. I think it is entertaining and about my favorite topic, guns. I kind of wonder at some of the projects done on the show but still find the majority interesting. I just wish the folks on the show came across as a little more professional. That being said, keep up the interesting shows and I appluade you guys for the flamethrower episode. I thought that was really awesome what was done for that Marine. The flamethrower was pretty bad assed also ;]

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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

 

 

 

There always has to be some Tampon that has to be negative about something. Will is about Family and Friends more then money and I don't recall Will bashing his daughter or talking down to her like the dad does of OCC which shows family isn't important there ( the start of a faled company ) so the 2 CAN NOT be compared . I now that Will would choose his daughter over any amount of money or fame !!!!!!!!! I don't recall anybody on Military channel making a shotgun for a soldier that lost feeling of his right arm fighting for our country ( and so you can be negative ) that wanted to still do what he loves which is hunting, but I DO recall Will doing it and giving it to him as a thank you for his services !!!!

Edited by THE AK DUDE
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"Y'know, it really seems as though the people who produce the show are at least slightly anti-gun, the way they imply that Saiga-12s are some kind of mysterious animal that most citizens have no business owning; the only customers shown are there for NFA items or are completely ignorant and couldn't be trusted with a .22LR without some instruction, much less a 12-ga anything. The implication is that only specially licensed individuals have any business in the shop at all, and when some fool happens by, that's supposed to represent most of society.

 

In the last episode, the Saiga 12 was referred to as a "combat shotgun". This is a gun that is imported specifically as a sporting arm. It is not a "combat shotgun". No anti-gun bias influencing that arbitrary choice of term, right? :rolleyes:

 

Maybe not, but it seems suspect. Something to think about."

 

 

Yep, I picked up on that last season, selling the program is given priority over things like a pro gun theme, or common sense.

 

Estes powered rocket launchers.... really? I bought that book at a gun show back in the 1980s, when I was still laden with more testosterone than brains. I will admit there is nothing like getting some "Black Powder face blast" on..:angel: And to violate every rule of the Model Rocket Association...Just make sure not to pass on a shogun shell/nail fusing system on to Al Quaeda :osama: Or the Guvmint may come looking for aiding and abetting terrorists and the like :cryss:

 

 

Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is. The Estes rockets, the M-16 they put on the Suburban controlled with a game controller, the master key, the list goes on an on. Anyone who knows anything about real military and law enforcement weapons knows that these toys they create are for the uniformed masses. If you like the show for it's entertainment and fake drama then so be it. I can only think that this show will do for Red Jacket what it did for OCC, It will make Will rich in the short term but they will become a joke in the industry and lose all credibility in the long term. Look at OCC they are in bankruptcy and no one but no one buys their bikes anymore.

We build a self contained turret with 360 traverse , 60 degree elevation , target lock and tracking and it's a TOY ? The masterkey , 3 or 4 different versions , been around since the 70's , we do a quick detach version using a Saiga . Nothing earth shattering but it's a nice bit of machining . But since we did it , it's a TOY ? We put together a launching unit that will put 15 rocket's inside a 25 yrd circle , each with enough concussive force to put you on your ass using components and construction methods in a way that keep it from putting everyone who touches it in jail and it's a TOY ? Well , ok , maybe that one , but it's a damn cool toy that damn well did it's job . We build solid firearms and we back them up . We've been doing this for over 10 years and will continue to do so . How that's going to destroy our credibility I don't know , guess I'm not the marketing genius you are . If you don't like the show , whatever , there's enough copycat's in the works that I'm sure you'll find one with a bland enough crew that you wont have to worry about "drama" . Enjoy

 

Can I buy that 1000 yard AK TOY? :rolleyes:

undecided . cost us close to 4 grand to make one . not sure how "streamline-able" the process is on that rifle . I wanted to do one , only way to find out if you can is to do it , not sure how many other folks want to toss 4 g at a AK though .

 

That is the sexiest fucking gun ever.

 

EDIT: Post some gun porn of that one please :killer:

Edited by Saiga Power
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The ONLY reality-themed show I watch, well Man vs. Food too :lolol: I can't even look at Top Shot any more now.

 

I was on The Daily Beast the other day, and there was an article about guns in the U.S. The best part is the comments. Some loon posted "Guns are being made out to be sexy in this country, there's even a show where a family makes assault weapons". I laughed hysterically!

 

Keep it going Will!

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Gosh darn it i don't care what anyone says, and I also love "ANY" show that showcases firearms in a tasteful and respectful manner, and to show the build process and engineering of the products. I watch it every Wednesday night.

 

 

 

Will just remember that you can't make everyone happy, and continue to do what you do brother, cause you have alot more supporters than you do haters.

 

 

 

Keep rocking my DVR on Wednesday nights...!!!

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Frankly, its was, and is becoming more "Jerry Springer for the low IQ gun owning crowd":ph34r: (See also "BUBBA" and how the term is used to represent white, gun owning, America) than it is a hard core show dedicated to true gun enthusiasts.

 

I think I will stick more to the "Military" channel, and its more reality based fodder, which doesn't carry some hidden "Hollywood" agenda.

 

Though I do admit I would like to see a "Gangsta" episode, where younze all have to wear black do rags to sell a anti po po, no knock raid, front door defense system to some brother in the hood.

 

"FO SHIZZLE SNOOP, when Homey the cop smash him big, azz ram on you front do', his azz gets capped with not twenny, not thirty, but fitty, get dat, FITTY AK's all gwin off AT ONCE!"

 

Of course that may be selling your soul to the devil that hates you, or, perhaps thats already happened?

 

I thought I was the only one who thinks this show is totally ridiculous.Thank God I see someone else out there who sees this travesty for what it is.

What rotten & hateful things to say about a good group of honorable people who are helping us keep our rights by making this passion we all have for cool toys more mainstream. :(

 

May the Lord watch over your shop Will.

I hope the show doesn't take a toll on you guys's personal lives.

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Once again, a captivating show of craftsmanship and professionalism(except maybe firing that .410 in the shop :lolol: ). About personal lives being affected by the show, your daughter's seems to be a bit strained but like a trooper she puts on a brave face. Good for her, I like how she really values her time with her father.

 

Can't wait to see the next show, a bike themed gun or gun themed bike? Were you up here in Newburgh to do the show with the guys from OCC? Well I guess I'll have to wait till wednesday.

 

Congratulations once again on the success of the show and I look forward to more gun fun and magic.

 

Sincerely,

 

nyclu3

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