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Anyone mod a WASR-3 to except the MSA mag adapter???

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lol arent the internet's great!? =P

ok, sorry guys...this is my first post...and i know this is a forum dedicated to the saiga's (which are popping up EVERYWHERE it seems here in central Florida)...i heard through the "grape vine" that there was a big shipment recently of saiga's in these here parts...and i see them everywhere!

BUT...

I took the plunge and got a Romanian WASR-3 (the 223/5.56 model ak incase anyone didnt know, that is...) instead...

heres the thing...

ive been roaming the internet for cool stuff i can do to my new "toy"...and stumbled upon these forum posts...ALL OF THEM...

i kinda feel like im that guy that walks into a bar and everyone turns around and looks at cause hes "not from around here"...so before i jump to any names and/or reletive posts, i just want to make it clear, im just here for some honest help and respect everyone's experience/opinions...

now, all that said...

there are some rather dramatic posts by a few people on this forum that make my recent purchase of the MSA AR2KU223 AK/SAIGA magazine adapter...link - http://magnoliastatearmory.com/products-page/page-header-list/ar2ku223-aksaiga/

makes me kind of question if i should have pulled the trigger on it so soon...unfortunately my over joy and excitement of finding out someone made an adapter that could fit in my WASR-3 to feed AR-15 mags got the better of me...

BUT...i hadnt read ALL the forum discussions involving "Nathan" and "Cobra"...and "YOU PEOPLE" lol...and even the ones on other related forums...till just now...

But i can say NOW that i have read ALL OF THEM...(or so i think)...and i have concluded that MSA is a reputable "mom and pops" business that fell into a rut, and caused some bad blood between a few people...hope all is well now, from when those posts where submitted, it looked to be a year or more ago...so im sure things have settled down since then (or so i hope)...

honestly, i like that a company like MSA is investing its time to actually respond to forums like this and be apart of its clientell...MAN, if more companies were like that...props to you guys!

anyways....to the reason i started this forum discussion in the first place (forgive me if im being over-winded)

 

HAS ANYONE MODIFIED A WASR-3 TO ACCEPT THE MSA MAG ADAPTER???

 

and IF SO, is it any diff than the saiga's?

 

like i said above, i just ordered one (yesterday), and i plan on using a dremel to custom fit it (i already went out and purchased good tungsten carbide cutters from sears in the 1/8 size and more cause i didnt have them just lying around)...but im wondering if the measurments that are posted for the saiga are relative to the WASR's, i cant imagine why they wouldnt be...but are there ANY OTHER hiccups that i should know about before-hand???...

 

oh, and if everything works out as planned, i hope to create a install video as i go, on youtube step by step...for anyone else that might be interested in the DIY dremel rout...

 

THANKS!

-J

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I dont know too much about fitting the adapter to the wasr3 but I did it to my Saiga 223 with a dremel. Its not to difficult as long as you go slow. The carbide cutters make quik work of the trunnion(relatively speaking) and are very controllable. Just look at the other threads about the measurements and if yours can be made to those said measurements you should be fine. I picked up a digital micrometer and it was very helpfull.

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I dont know too much about fitting the adapter to the wasr3 but I did it to my Saiga 223 with a dremel. Its not to difficult as long as you go slow. The carbide cutters make quik work of the trunnion(relatively speaking) and are very controllable. Just look at the other threads about the measurements and if yours can be made to those said measurements you should be fine. I picked up a digital micrometer and it was very helpfull.

 

thanks foreign firearm friend for the quick response, i plan on doing exactly as you say, and GO SLOW...

any tips on that digital micrometer tho?....i picked one up when i got those carbide cutters earlier, cause i didnt have a micrometer lying around either lol...but it looks like i had envisioned them working out better...

i just went with the inexpensive "general ultratech" digital micrometer...but i cant squeeze them into the frame of my ak...so im wondering if there are better micrometers out there with longer "arms" that will get me into the tight spot i need them...otherwise i was going to either glue some pieces to it, or measure the two sides and the whole and subtract the difference...what type micrometers are you using?

i guess i can just return the ones i got and find "better" ones if need be

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I dont know too much about fitting the adapter to the wasr3 but I did it to my Saiga 223 with a dremel. Its not to difficult as long as you go slow. The carbide cutters make quik work of the trunnion(relatively speaking) and are very controllable. Just look at the other threads about the measurements and if yours can be made to those said measurements you should be fine. I picked up a digital micrometer and it was very helpfull.

 

thanks foreign firearm friend for the quick response, i plan on doing exactly as you say, and GO SLOW...

any tips on that digital micrometer tho?....i picked one up when i got those carbide cutters earlier, cause i didnt have a micrometer lying around either lol...but it looks like i had envisioned them working out better...

i just went with the inexpensive "general ultratech" digital micrometer...but i cant squeeze them into the frame of my ak...so im wondering if there are better micrometers out there with longer "arms" that will get me into the tight spot i need them...otherwise i was going to either glue some pieces to it, or measure the two sides and the whole and subtract the difference...what type micrometers are you using?

i guess i can just return the ones i got and find "better" ones if need be

 

Couger....

I installed an MSA adapter in my Saiga and did all of the cutting with a Dremel tool. Take your time, fit, fit, and fit again. I'm not a machinist and never played one on TV. I used a digital CALIPER for my measurements. I already had one because I reload and use it to compute my bullet O.A.L.. Instead of using the "jaws" of the tool, there is a narrow "shaft" (my non-machinist ignorance) that extends from the opposite end that allows depth measurements into narrow spaces.

Hope that helps and apologies to machinists around the world.

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it was a very cheap one. cost me $20 and I picked it up at harbor freight. Its just a little 4 incher but it has a depth thingy that comes out the end of the micrometer. Thats what I used for depth. Ill try and post exactly which model I have tomorrow. Just make sure you square the trunnion as best as you can because that will keep the adapter from fully seating. I couldnt understand why it wouldnt drop in and then i played with the the corners a bit and it popped in no problems. Also make sure you use oil periodically and check for heat. If its warm to the touch I just let it cool down to avoid ruining the temper.

 

post-27610-0-78547400-1315284564_thumb.jpg

post-27610-0-49868400-1315284592_thumb.jpg

post-27610-0-66658900-1315284735_thumb.jpg

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Heres a little write up I did on another thread on the install.

 

 

"As far as width goes I just started cutting that little stepped ledge thats on there untill its flush with the rivet. I think it was .96" I think.

Then I just measured doen with a depth gauge to .89" and used blue masking tape to mask off a line (point of no return!) to the said depth and slowely started making a ledge just above the taped line. Once that is done and is flush with the rivet I wrapped the blue tape around the trunnion and did a test fit. If it doesnt go in right away put a little pressure on the adapter so the the contact points will show on the blue tape. Then just little by little start cutting away at the contact points (mainly just working on the corners to square off the trunnion). I didnt realize the squaring the trunnion was so critical so I removed a little to much before I realized it was just the corner that needed to be worked on. But I found what helped me the most was the painters tape. Oh and be carefull of thousands of tiny metal shards the seem to imbed themselves in your hands while doing this mod. I was picking those SOB's out of my fingers for 3 days."

 

And heres a link to my own MSA help thread i started when I was doing mine. Hope this helps.

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/68283-msa-adapter/page__p__660728__fromsearch__1&do=findComment&comment=660728

Edited by foreign firearm fiend

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I dont know too much about fitting the adapter to the wasr3 but I did it to my Saiga 223 with a dremel. Its not to difficult as long as you go slow. The carbide cutters make quik work of the trunnion(relatively speaking) and are very controllable. Just look at the other threads about the measurements and if yours can be made to those said measurements you should be fine. I picked up a digital micrometer and it was very helpfull.

 

thanks foreign firearm friend for the quick response, i plan on doing exactly as you say, and GO SLOW...

any tips on that digital micrometer tho?....i picked one up when i got those carbide cutters earlier, cause i didnt have a micrometer lying around either lol...but it looks like i had envisioned them working out better...

i just went with the inexpensive "general ultratech" digital micrometer...but i cant squeeze them into the frame of my ak...so im wondering if there are better micrometers out there with longer "arms" that will get me into the tight spot i need them...otherwise i was going to either glue some pieces to it, or measure the two sides and the whole and subtract the difference...what type micrometers are you using?

i guess i can just return the ones i got and find "better" ones if need be

 

Couger....

I installed an MSA adapter in my Saiga and did all of the cutting with a Dremel tool. Take your time, fit, fit, and fit again. I'm not a machinist and never played one on TV. I used a digital CALIPER for my measurements. I already had one because I reload and use it to compute my bullet O.A.L.. Instead of using the "jaws" of the tool, there is a narrow "shaft" (my non-machinist ignorance) that extends from the opposite end that allows depth measurements into narrow spaces.

Hope that helps and apologies to machinists around the world.

 

Pogy....

i am by no means a machinist either...and i too am using digital calipers...not a micrometer...i dont know what the difference is...the debth measurements i can do with the calipers that i have...but not the width...ive seen a picture posted on this forum, that some one did up and had edited in the leangth and width of how far and wide you need to go...so naturally i wanted to measure the width...but i guess as long as i dont cut any further than the rivet on the sides, i should be fine...this is of course all just here-say until i get my adapter in...(hopefully soon!)...cant wait to start tinkering with it...thanks guys for all the advice and responses! its looking as tho im the first to mod a WASR-3 for this MSA adapter...at least the first one who has shared his experience with doing so on-line...

and foreign firearm friend, i like the painters tape tip...im gonna have to try that out...ill post more when i get to work on it...keep the tips coming guys!

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I recieved my MSA adapter yesterday and took a look when I got to the house at a few of my AK varients and I don't see any reason that one couldn't mate the MSA adapter to just about any 5.56 AK. I do not have a WASR-3 so I wouldn't take it all for gospel but with the right tweaking I would think it would work. Principles would be the same. I put my adapter in this morning. I put it on my own rifle so I could gauge what kind of time I had in it but even taking my time and everything along with it being early and me trying to get started with my day it only took about 2 hours and change. I did use a mill but I don't see why it would take a whole lot longer with a Dremel. As a side note I didn't get instructions with mine but with all of the stuff I found on here and everybody's willingness to share info I found I didn't need them. Once you review the part and your rifle its really pretty self explainatory. Good luck!

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I recieved my MSA adapter yesterday and took a look when I got to the house at a few of my AK varients and I don't see any reason that one couldn't mate the MSA adapter to just about any 5.56 AK. I do not have a WASR-3 so I wouldn't take it all for gospel but with the right tweaking I would think it would work. Principles would be the same. I put my adapter in this morning. I put it on my own rifle so I could gauge what kind of time I had in it but even taking my time and everything along with it being early and me trying to get started with my day it only took about 2 hours and change. I did use a mill but I don't see why it would take a whole lot longer with a Dremel. As a side note I didn't get instructions with mine but with all of the stuff I found on here and everybody's willingness to share info I found I didn't need them. Once you review the part and your rifle its really pretty self explainatory. Good luck!

 

good stuff! thanks msgw357, wish i didnt have to go the dremel rout...but i dont foresee myself using a mill enough to justify the cost...and im pretty good with a dremel anyways...so im pretty confident...but i like your reassurance

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FYI Volkov has used one in a WASR3. So we know it does work universal. The latest revision last year made sure of it.

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FYI Volkov has used one in a WASR3. So we know it does work universal. The latest revision last year made sure of it.

 

Good stuff! Yeah, it lists the WASR-3 as being compatible in the description of your adapter...so i was confident it would fit...i cant wait to test it out...just got an email saying that tracking info will show up monday, cant wait!

Hope business is going good! Ill be sure to show it off and try to bring ya some extra business...none of the local dealers had ever even herd of such a thing...but with all the saiga's flouting around, ill show the adapter off and hope some of these dealers wake up...

 

and due to the significance of this weekend, i want to say my thoughts and prayers go out to the victims, the victims families, and all the great men and woman of America affected by the 9/11 attacks...

LEST WE NEVER FORGET

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UPDATE : alrighty guys, just got my adapter in yesterday =P spent all afternoon and last night fitting it into my WASR-3 (well in between the Rays big win of course! =P)...took a long lunch today and got it to the range to test it out...here are my thought thus far...

 

(oh, and sorry...never made up a install vid...just some pics)

 

at first, i had to dremel away some of the frame to get it to even slide in...which i hadn't given much thought to before hand...so reluctantly i did the deed to widen the hole...(which made my original galil type magazines wobble ALOT and was all sorts of worried about that)...but got the adapter to just slide in...

gap1.jpg

 

 

next i had to do some dremmeling of the 2 "nubs" that stick out from either side of the body (which i honestly dont know what the purpose of them are...i dont see them serving any purpose other than to make sliding an ar-15 magazine all the way up to the feed ramp impossible...but whatever...)...

nub2.jpg

 

and after some serious dremel, check, dremel, rechecking...i got the adapter to fit in so it *clicked* into place...

adapter in!

adapter1.jpg

 

adapter2.jpg

 

 

But it took alot of tinkering to get the magazine to actually feed properly tho...but trying to rack the slide and have the firing pin mechanism catch and chamber a round, took some unforeseen modding to the rod (that i assume is there for support...in the middle)

bar1.jpg

(ugly handywork if you ask me...hard to get the dremmel in such a tight spot...but hey, it makes a world of difference in my case)

 

and some minner modding to the magazines themselfs...

mag1.jpg

 

and even some form fitting to the adapter...just so the rear of the round would sit high enough for the slide to catch....i did as little modifying as i possibly could to the actual rifle itself...i didnt want to go to far and "brick" my gun...even if it was just for fun and meant to be modded in the first place...still...being out $450 is not what i wanted...ill be out 15 for a mag or 80 for the adapter...those i can replace without consorting my wife =P anywho...i digress...heres the finished product with pmag and tapco mags in it...hope you all like my gunpron tac job =P

gunpron1.jpg

 

gunpron2.jpg

 

gunpron3.jpg

 

gunpron4.jpg

 

Now to my range time and testing:

 

so i was all pumped to take it out and see how badly i had f*d it up...completely intending for the thing to jam and fail in all sorts of ways...but surprisingly enough...it worked GREAT! the only FTF's i had were from a tapco galil style mag that i had gotten before i bought the adapter...(those things suck...still cant get it to fire right)...so any problems werent even related to the adapter...granted...the original magazines that it came with wobble like theres no tomorrow...but i did as much as i could to get them to jam up...and nothing...old mags worked just fine...and both the pmag and tapco mags worked like champs...

 

so in conclusion:

 

if you can get over your stock mags jiggling around (ill just keep the stock mags as backups anyways)...and if you install it with a dremel...it may not come out as pretty as you had hoped...but all in all it was easy to do...took about 6 hours total (for me)...and it works great! now i can fire my buddies ar-15 mags and visa versa when were out wasting our money on ammo...=P *that was a joke...

 

props to msa for coming up with this adapter and good luck everyone!...keep those muzzles down range!

oh and support the NRA!

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Anyone mod a WASR-3 to except the MSA mag adapter???

Not to nitpick, but the WASR-3 arrives from the factory with the ability to except the MSA adapter. One must modify the weapon to accept the adapter.

 

at first, i had to dremel away some of the frame to get it to even slide in...which i hadn't given much thought to before hand...so reluctantly i did the deed to widen the hole...(which made my original galil type magazines wobble ALOT and was all sorts of worried about that)...but got the adapter to just slide in...

gap1.jpg

The "frame" is called the receiver.

 

next i had to do some dremmeling of the 2 "nubs" that stick out from either side of the body (which i honestly dont know what the purpose of them are...i dont see them serving any purpose other than to make sliding an ar-15 magazine all the way up to the feed ramp impossible...but whatever...)...

nub2.jpg

The "nubs" are the locking lugs, which lock the bolt into the trunnion. Without them, the gun blows up in your face.

 

But it took alot of tinkering to get the magazine to actually feed properly tho...but trying to rack the slide and have the firing pin mechanism catch and chamber a round, took some unforeseen modding to the rod (that i assume is there for support...in the middle)

bar1.jpg

I can safely assume you are referencing the bolt when mentioning "the firing pin mechanism". The "rod" is indeed a center support.

 

and some minner modding to the magazines themselfs...

I do see minor modification to the magazines themselves.

 

Luckily, your dremel skills exceed your grammar and syntax. But it's only English.smile.png

Just ribbing. Welcome to the forum. I am thankful for spellcheck and online dictionaries.

 

Good pictures illustrating the process. Granny always said, "the proof is in the pudding".

 

buckmeister

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Anyone mod a WASR-3 to except the MSA mag adapter???

Not to nitpick, but the WASR-3 arrives from the factory with the ability to except the MSA adapter. One must modify the weapon to accept the adapter.

 

at first, i had to dremel away some of the frame to get it to even slide in...which i hadn't given much thought to before hand...so reluctantly i did the deed to widen the hole...(which made my original galil type magazines wobble ALOT and was all sorts of worried about that)...but got the adapter to just slide in...

gap1.jpg

The "frame" is called the receiver.

 

next i had to do some dremmeling of the 2 "nubs" that stick out from either side of the body (which i honestly dont know what the purpose of them are...i dont see them serving any purpose other than to make sliding an ar-15 magazine all the way up to the feed ramp impossible...but whatever...)...

nub2.jpg

The "nubs" are the locking lugs, which lock the bolt into the trunnion. Without them, the gun blows up in your face.

 

But it took alot of tinkering to get the magazine to actually feed properly tho...but trying to rack the slide and have the firing pin mechanism catch and chamber a round, took some unforeseen modding to the rod (that i assume is there for support...in the middle)

bar1.jpg

I can safely assume you are referencing the bolt when mentioning "the firing pin mechanism". The "rod" is indeed a center support.

 

and some minner modding to the magazines themselfs...

I do see minor modification to the magazines themselves.

 

Luckily, your dremel skills exceed your grammar and syntax. But it's only English.smile.png

Just ribbing. Welcome to the forum. I am thankful for spellcheck and online dictionaries.

 

Good pictures illustrating the process. Granny always said, "the proof is in the pudding".

 

buckmeister

 

haha...thanks buckmeister, yeah...the reciever, bolt and bolt carrier (had no idea what the "nubs" were called tho...but now i know they are called lugs...ya learn something every day)...but sorry...not running at 100% right now...not much sleep last night with all the excitement going on here in Tampa Bay...thanks for the response tho, dont mind my poor grammar and lousy syntax...you know what i meant =P that's why i posted pics! =) just hoping it might come in handy for anyone else lookin to get the adapter. I couldn't have done it without all the other forum members who posted earlier instructions any ways. So Thanks to all of them as well!

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