Saiga 12 without a stock?

[trbostwick 1]

Hey guys, I've been looking all over for answers to the following scenario, but I haven't been able to find any.

 

Has anyone converted an S-12 to have a pistol grip without a stock (i.e. blanked off receiver)? I was thinking about doing just that, with a pistol grip and a forward grip. I'm not sure, however, what I would need to get to "blank off" the receiver, but more importantly, I'm not sure of the legality. My S-12 still has the factory 19" barrel, and I've checked: without a stock, it would still be ever-so-slightly-longer than 26" (part of the definition of an SBS in South Carolina, where I live). I've already done the pistol grip conversion with the trigger group moved forward.

 

Thoughts? Anybody done this? What would I need to get? I'm mostly curious, plus I think it'd be a lot of fun

 

Thanks for taking a few seconds to read my maiden post here at the Saiga-12 Forum!

Edited September 29, 2011 by trbostwick

[physicsnerd 139]

I believe that you would have to register it as an SBS. To do what you want to do you would have to have bought the S12 without it ever having had a buttstock and even then you couldn't add a VFG.

 

I'll let others give better advice but you're off to a good start to not just do it and post pics.

[schultze13 354]

I think as long as the barrel is over 18" you should be ok should be no different than a pistol grip 12ga pump. as long as those are legal where you live you should be ok unless there are some local laws I do not know about.

[CBR Shadow 53]

I would be interested in seeing what that would look like - if you do it dont forget to post pictures!

[dowork1021 64]

I was actually thinking about that the other day. I have a tapco collapsable stock for non converted S12's and their is a nub on the base of the stock. I was thinking about cutting off the tube so that the nub will just be their with a single point sling attachment. That way I wouldnt have to remove the tang in case I wanted to change it back. I think im going to try it.

 

Here is a little pic to show what I mean..

 

[dowork1021 64]

As long as the overall length is over 26 inches, the S12 is for sure, you should be good.

[dowork1021 64]

Heres another little edit on a pic of my S12 with the nub.

 

[Matthew Hopkins 1,065]

the question I have is, why? it maybe will look cool, but without a buttstock shooting 00 buck is not going to be a enjoyable experience.

Edited September 29, 2011 by Matthew Hopkins

[vulcan16 971]

Centerfiresytems has them for unrestored rifles and shotguns.

[uzitiger 193]

As long as the overall length is over 26 inches, the S12 is for sure, you should be good.

 

Actually it's 28 inches for shotguns and 26 inches for rifles.

 

I shot my friend's pistol gripped 870 without a stock and my hand hit me in the face during recoil. Try shooting one with a folding stock folded to see how it feels.

[SaigaKen 338]

I've shot my Tromix 12 with the side folder......Not real bad with light loads (but not for hundreds of rounds)

 

Havent tried with the heavier rounds and not really sure that I would want to

[trbostwick 1]

I'm not worried about the recoil, it's just a way I want to modify my S-12

 

So, any ideas on what parts I should use? It's worth mentioning that I don't know the first thing about welding, so bolt-on is really the only way for me to go.

 

Thanks!

[Caspian 32]

26" for both, 16" for rifles, and 18" for shottys. federally, your state or local may vary.

 

As long as the overall length is over 26 inches, the S12 is for sure, you should be good.

 

Actually it's 28 inches for shotguns and 26 inches for rifles.

 

I shot my friend's pistol gripped 870 without a stock and my hand hit me in the face during recoil. Try shooting one with a folding stock folded to see how it feels.

[Lidocaine Looney 26]

I'm not worried about the recoil, it's just a way I want to modify my S-12

 

So, any ideas on what parts I should use? It's worth mentioning that I don't know the first thing about welding, so bolt-on is really the only way for me to go.

 

Thanks!

Just use CSS's internal block receiver and don't put a stock or anything on it..

[storm6490 2,768]

caspian is correct. don't go short either. most gunsmiths add a half inch or so just to insure proper length.

 

NO different than a mossberg pistol grip pump. you just removed the stock and left the pistol grip.

 

there went your accuracy.

[ewoketeer 35]

You'd be better served by using a folding stock. Extended, you would have a weapon that would be more effective at longer ranges, while folded, it would be handier in close quarters. Your call.

[RobRez 1,896]

As far as I know it would be legal if the overall lenght of the gun was no less than 26" and the barrel was no less than 18". There certainly are laws pertaining to the Illegal aspect of turning a weapon, manufactured as a Long gun and turning it into a pistol. Removing the stock would effectively doing just that and would be a BIG NO-NO!!

Use a folding stock and keep it folded. Try it out, say "whoopie" and get over it.

Seems like a modification that is the result of too many movies. Kinda piontless. With hot loads it helps cycle if you shoulder the weapon tightly.

[glennhmd 23]

it would be enlightening to see (video) you shoot this once your project is done.

[trbostwick 1]

Well, I just ordered the necessary parts from CSS, but my chaos tri-rail won't be ready until sometime in November. In any case, I'll post pics (and video from the next time I go to the range) once I've removed the stock. I'll post more once the tri-rail is here so you can see what it looks like with the forward grip. I'll be using the STL 300J grip/light/laser, which promises to be awesome

[Peckaldee 12]

I want to see video of this also. I wonder if it will be anything like those female S&W 500 head bangers. Hopefully you have strong arms.

 

On a more serious note, you want to make sure a pistol grip is firmly attached to the weapon, ie. Use of grip nut, not the DIY guard. Not saying they are a weak link but anything to insure a potentially blinding metal to eye smack in case you ever think about actually using some sort of aiming apparatus.

 

I could remove my Ace stock and pretty much have the same thing. Would I shoot it that way? Yes. Would it be practical? Meh.

Edited October 1, 2011 by Peckaldee

[Fallschirmjager667 729]

there is absolutely no problem shooting heavy loads from the hip, an s12 has very low recoil for a 12ga, so unless your running reduced power recoil springs with a booster puck and your gas valve wide open, recoil should not be a problem

[MgcShroomz 0]

I have no problem shooting my Mossberg 500 12ga from the hip with any load. I have a hand made birdshead grip that does the trick. I've shot one with the hogue pistol grip also that was very comfortable, although after a box of slugs with the pistol grip I could feel fatigue in my wrist.

GL with your build, and post pics!!!

[Doug Hartley 526]

Here is a shot of the shorty Saiga 12 made by R&R for the FBI. There is a sling swivel at the rear to carry the gun.

 

Doug

 

[menace667 194]

Proof that the govt. are assholes that want to have the coolest toys. That r&r is absolutely sick.

[Wildcatter 28]

 

Very controllable. This is with a mix of buck, slug and bird shot.

[trbostwick 1]

Pics! These include my new barrel shroud from CSS as well as the larger Tromix charging handle. Still have the OEM hand guard, but mid- to late- November, my Chaos rail should be here and I'll be able to put my forward grip on it. Enjoy! (sorry one of them is sideways...)

 

Edited October 6, 2011 by trbostwick

[lbsrdi 1,078]

I like the look of S12's without stocks.

[rastamanila 313]

the question I have is, why? it maybe will look cool, but without a buttstock shooting 00 buck is not going to be a enjoyable experience.

 

Yeah sounds painful to shoot...

[gunfun 3,931]

Isn't the whole point of a gun like that for the Feds as an entry devise?

 

Doug- Why didn't they ask for a breacher (& sidefolder)?

 

IMO the magwell and left side charging handle make this more useful for everything, but I am curious what specific intend they had for that without a stock or breacher, which I would expect. Was it for use as a PDW in vehicle transports or something?

 

It's cool and all, I just feel like I am missing something.

[Doug Hartley 526]

Isn't the whole point of a gun like that for the Feds as an entry devise?

 

Doug- Why didn't they ask for a breacher (& sidefolder)?

 

IMO the magwell and left side charging handle make this more useful for everything, but I am curious what specific intend they had for that without a stock or breacher, which I would expect. Was it for use as a PDW in vehicle transports or something?

 

It's cool and all, I just feel like I am missing something.

 

My understanding is that they wanted this for a door breacher, but it does have other uses. The short stockless gun was what they requested and there have been several modifications to the original gun at FBI request. I have had a chance to handle it but not shoot it yet. Hopefully this fall Robert and I will get a chance to make a new video and this will be in it.

 

Doug