MAAnew 162 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Anyone used the Kennesaw Cannon Company 22 Flare Gun insert? They now have a Single Shot 410 Shotgun or 45 Long Colt insert. What are your thoughts? http://www.mississippiautoarms.com/subcaliber-device-flare-gun-insert-p-2719.html Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bigsteel 14 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Would be a great survival gun,just something to keep in the hidden compartment in my pack. Pop a flare for being found or hunt a rabbit or small birds with the .410. Don't know what I'd use the .45 for. Too big for small game yet to small for bears... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
schultze13 354 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 I do like the idea you carry a flare gun in your plane , boat, ATV or while backpacking and with little extra weight you have a .22 or .410 to get some small game if something would happen. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MAAnew 162 Posted December 31, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Before I was old enough to carry a handgun, a 410 shotgun shell and this insert would have been great for some of the canoe trips that we went on. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Deadeye 325 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 where do you get the flair guns Quote Link to post Share on other sites
inflightmissiletech 27 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Pardon my ignorance but isn't that an AOW or something? I can't quite place it but I thought it was some kind of ATF problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
theturtlepond 31 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 where do you get the flair guns Maybe cheaper than dirt and that place where we get the $12 Saiga 12 mags. I was also wondering about the legalities but the ATF did approve it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 As long as the .45 bore is rifled, it shouldn't be an AOW. If it's smoothbore, definitely. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
second shooter 22 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 i would be a little concerned about the strenght of the flare pistol firing fairly powerful ammo(410 and 45) ? you know how some things dont break if you hit it once with a hammer,but after you hit it 20 times it falls apart....... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Valid concern. Guess you don't know until you try? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
super jim 14 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 flare guns at any boating supply store...westmaine. I keep one on my boat so this makes sense to carry next to it just for when the pirates attack. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RED333 1,025 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 where do you get the flair guns Keep Shooting has this Polish Model 78 26.5MM Signal Flare Gun Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Kenny 144 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Why would it be an AOW? It's under .5" bore diameter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Smoothbore pistols fall under the AOW classification, regardless of barrel diameter. The Taurus Judge is a handgun because the barrel is rifled - the fact that it can use a .410 shotshell doesn't factor into it. Since this adapter has a rifled bore, it's good to go - turns a flaregun into a Title 1 firearm, a handgun. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Heath_h49008 442 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 But wouldn't that make the owner a "manufacturer" unless the insert was registered as a pistol? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dad2142Dad 6,559 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) Kind of old but?? http://www.atf.gov/p...re-inserts.html Flare Launcher Inserts Classification Any Other Weapons, only when possessed with a flare launcher Distinctive Characteristics Generally made of metal Special Note 25 mm 12 GA adapter is lawful unless modified Rate of Transfer Tax $200.00 if installed in a flare launcher (making of AOW) Edited December 31, 2011 by Dad2142Dad Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shandlanos 1,470 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 (edited) But wouldn't that make the owner a "manufacturer" unless the insert was registered as a pistol? Yes to the first half, no to the second. You don't "register" pistols federally, and I don't think the adapter could be classified as a pistol, or it already would be. Yes, you become the manufacturer of the pistol. Kind of old but?? http://www.atf.gov/p...re-inserts.html The adapters referred to in the open letter you linked were smoothbore inserts. Had they been rifled, they would have been lawful, but still dangerous and foolish to use. Edited December 31, 2011 by Shandlanos 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Donkeyshins 87 Posted December 31, 2011 Report Share Posted December 31, 2011 Just as a quick spelling reminder. Flare gun: Flair gun: 6 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
schultze13 354 Posted January 1, 2012 Report Share Posted January 1, 2012 As for the ATF laws it is basiclly a loop hole that lets this happen, it has been sumitted to them and was APPROVED I think they come with a copy of the letter so enjoy there fuckup because one day they will fix it. I do want to stress just because ATF approved it does not mean your state won't try to screw you over it so check your laws. And for the guy who asked where to get a flare gun any mili-surplus store or on Gunbroker you can get them cheap. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ironhead7544 35 Posted January 2, 2012 Report Share Posted January 2, 2012 Interesting. Anyone know the pressure specs on a flair round? I think most of the pressure would be taken by the converter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Kenny 144 Posted January 2, 2012 Report Share Posted January 2, 2012 Flare. they're low-pressure. The flare pistol makers tell you that those pistols are not safe to load with a real 12-gauge round. Not illegal. Unsafe. Look how thick the steel is around that insert! Most rifle barrels are about that thick, and the .45LC is a rather low pressure round. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
second shooter 22 Posted January 2, 2012 Report Share Posted January 2, 2012 the danger area that i can see is the breach face, and the strength of the barrel latch.when using the correct ammunition the pressure to the rear or the cartrige is spread over the 1 inch diameter of the breach face, when firing a 45lc you considerably reduce the area you are transferring the load to. in simple terms its easy to poke the sharp end of a screwdriver through a sheet of roofing iron, turning it around and trying to poke the handle through the iron with the same force will take you all day. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 These are a BAD idea. Most flare gun frames are not meant for this. Might be fun in the old Mossy12ga bolt gun! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MT Predator 2,294 Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 I think keeping the flare launcher and some flares in your vehicle for an emergency is a good idea but I wouldn't trust it with .45 lc or .410 any more than a homemade zip gun. I carry a pistol all the time anyways so I don't see myself scrambling to the back of my vehicle for a single shot inaccurate weapon in any situation. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChileRelleno 7,071 Posted January 3, 2012 Report Share Posted January 3, 2012 I think keeping the flare launcher and some flares in your vehicle for an emergency is a good idea but I wouldn't trust it with .45 lc or .410 any more than a homemade zip gun. I carry a pistol all the time anyways so I don't see myself scrambling to the back of my vehicle for a single shot inaccurate weapon in any situation. Word! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
storm6490 2,768 Posted January 4, 2012 Report Share Posted January 4, 2012 I'd trust it in a HK signal launcher... nothing else! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Kenny 144 Posted January 5, 2012 Report Share Posted January 5, 2012 Yeah, I really can't see having one of those on land. Stuffed into a boating survival kit (assuming I'm clear the hell and gone in the Pacific somewhere), sure. H&K 26.5mm flare launcher is $65, and another $60 for the insert. Add a box of .45LC and .410, and you're still under $200. And I'm not sure how 'inaccurate' that insert is, it has at least 5" of rifling! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BuffetDestroyer 969 Posted January 5, 2012 Report Share Posted January 5, 2012 How do you get the spent shell out of the insert without a rod and hammer? SportsmansGuide has inserts for putting a 7.62x25 into a .303 British and a few other caliber conversions to small pistol rounds and the overwhelming complaint is trying to eject the spent case that has expanded into the insert after being fired. It's a neat novelty item, but you better make that one shot count if you ever have to use it (or just stick with flares). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scott Kenny 144 Posted January 6, 2012 Report Share Posted January 6, 2012 Hell, someone got a spare $200 to play with one? I won't until August. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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