roachtron 49 Posted March 11, 2012 Report Share Posted March 11, 2012 I would follow the advice above and try it without the quad rail. Also try running federal bulk ammo instead of winchester. Your gas ports are in alot better shape then mine and mine runs federal without a hitch now. Have you polished the top of the hammer at all? 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
armory 142 Posted March 11, 2012 Report Share Posted March 11, 2012 (edited) I would follow the advice above and try it without the quad rail. Also try running federal bulk ammo instead of winchester. Your gas ports are in alot better shape then mine and mine runs federal without a hitch now. Have you polished the top of the hammer at all? Yes, and make sure those Promags aren't squeezing the shells. They tend to collapse a little and cause issues. If they are, there is a fix. Edited March 11, 2012 by armory Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guns Are Great 140 Posted March 11, 2012 Report Share Posted March 11, 2012 Not converted, but did install a collapsible stock, pistol grip and quad rail. When painted, no internal parts were painted. I checked the gas ports by using a pick. I haven't checked that they were to the right tolerance. When I pull the bolt back, it doesn't feel like its grinding or being help up. If I don't let it snap back and ride it forward manually it holds up right where the bolt's shell release goes into the gun (for lack of better word). I don't know if that matters. I live in Gettysburg so if someone can help me out that's close to here would be awesome!!! I'm gonna have to find a vendor. Check the installation of your quad around your gas tube. If you get it too tight, it can cause the weapon to bind up. Doesn't some of those quad rails also block the hole in the gas block where gas is vented. If blocked didn't this also cause issues? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted March 11, 2012 Report Share Posted March 11, 2012 I've never really believed that, the factory handguard blocks it as well. I'm not saying it isn't the case, I just doubt it myself. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
spaniel 7 Posted March 11, 2012 Report Share Posted March 11, 2012 You said that if you let the bolt forward slow, it hangs up. This is the bolt hanging up on the hammer, and if you've properly profiled the bolt and hammer this won't happen. You want it so that even if you ease the bolt forward, you can't get it to hang up before it closes. This is cheap and requires a dremel and some patience. I colored the parts of the bolt you do NOT want to touch (plenty of threads on this) with black sharpie, and carefully worked on it, profiling down then polishing, until I had smooth bolt closure. Since I did this I think I've had a single misfeed in about 500 rounds. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 I think he's referring to the last quarter inch of travel before it closes. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Caged is right, I'm referring to the last 1/4" before the bolt closes. I don't know if its that leg that slips into the groove or what it is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 Here is a picture of where I think the extractor leg is getting hung up on the last 1/4" before the bolt closes By mhagarman at 2012-03-11 By mhagarman at 2012-03-11 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 It's your extractor climbing the ramp, perfectly normal. After a few thousand rounds it lightens up quite a bit. It's nothing to worry about, standard operating procedure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TopOfClimb 1 Posted March 12, 2012 Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 One more UTG quad rail problem. Removed it and the gun cycled great. Ran 100 rounds today, and the last 25 cycled perfectly with a V-plug and light brass spring. Before, I needed slugs or 00 buck to get the gun to cycle without a misfeed or FTE. With the UTG quad removed, it cycled the OEM 5-rounder fine, and a couple of stovepipes for the 10-round ProMag gen2's, usually on the last round of the mag. Like so many others here, get the gun to cycle properly before adding anything! My S12 needed a 3rd port drilled, which I had done by a local gunsmith. I also have Pauly's polish job, and with those mods alone the gun is now cycling the way Khrushchev intended! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2012 I just dont see it being the quad rail. The gun ran beautifully right out of the box. The gun is only 2 months old. I shot probably 100 rounds out of it, all low brass garbage and it cycled fine. Never a misfeed. Then all of a sudden it just started jamming rounds. So with the quad rail and collapsible stock and eveything else that was on there the first time I shot it didn't make it skip a beat. It was odd that one day it worked, the next day it didnt. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I guess I missed that the first time I read it, derp! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Heavymetalzero00 0 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 I had the same problem. I purchased and installed the tac47 auto plug. http://www.tac47industries.com/content-product_info/product_id-2310/tac_47_a_k_a_auto_plug.html Follow the instructions. Fixed mine. I also have a utg quad rail installed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrBoomstick 16 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) Caged you out of Gettysburg PA ? I have my saigas worked on at a local gunsmiths in downsville MD. Its not to far from you. I had a real vodka special that he got running like a scalded dog. I had port issues and he does the conversion work. We can also meet if you like and try other parts combos if you like i havea few extra pucks and I had cobra here do bolt and hammer work so you could compare friction and see if there is any hammer bump going on when the bolt is cycled. Edited March 13, 2012 by MrBoomstick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Caged you out of Gettysburg PA ? I have my saigas worked on at a local gunsmiths in downsville MD. Its not to far from you. I had a real vodka special that he got running like a scalded dog. I had port issues and he does the conversion work. We can also meet if you like and try other parts combos if you like i havea few extra pucks and I had cobra here do bolt and hammer work so you could compare friction and see if there is any hammer bump going on when the bolt is cycled. Yes, I am in Gettysburg, PA...I work in Taneytown MD, not sure if that is closer or not. Yea i'd love to test it out one weekend. See what could be going on. Its always good having another saiga guy look at it. No one I know has one up here, so when I even mention the problem no one has enough info or hands on experience with it to know whats going on. They have only "heard" of them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cobra 76 two 2,677 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Caged is in Texas... Yeah you and MrBoomstick should get together sometime and compare guns. After you see how his cycles compared to yours, things will become very obvious. You can even try swapping out the bolt and carrier if he doesn't mind. That would let you know how much good it would do, or if you still need port work. If you came here that's what I would do. If the gun worked fine before then it's not the quad causing problems. You either have clogged ports, something wrong with the puck and /or gas chamber, the gas plug has been adjusted wrong, or some uneven wear has happened between the bolt carrier, rails, and ejector....and caused it to start hanging up the carrier. Email me some pictures of the internals. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
The_Caged_Bird 474 Posted March 13, 2012 Report Share Posted March 13, 2012 Yep, I'm in Texas, bitch!!! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tunnelrat 10 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 I would also check the ejector slot on the barrel: There were sharp edges in the slot that would catch on the shell and would actually shave it: Of course this affected the cycling, so I removed the barrel and filed/polished these areas. You might be able to do it without removing the barrel. I'm not sure if this is what's causing your issues but it's worth checking out. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guns Are Great 140 Posted March 14, 2012 Report Share Posted March 14, 2012 I would suggest profiling and polishing the hammer and bottom of the the BCG more. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2012 Gonna take it out on sunday and fire it without the quad rail. I also polished down the bolt and hammer, it seems to run a lot smoother. I put the original puc back in. So we will see come sunday. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TO THE FLOOR IN A 63 121 Posted March 16, 2012 Report Share Posted March 16, 2012 Out of couriousity what gas plug are you using. I would go back to the basics. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2012 Out of couriousity what gas plug are you using. I would go back to the basics. I am using the stock gas plug. Its firing the same with the CSS Reliability kit gas plug, so i went back to the original one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TO THE FLOOR IN A 63 121 Posted March 16, 2012 Report Share Posted March 16, 2012 I thought you said you were using a 6 position plug. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mullet Man 2,114 Posted March 16, 2012 Report Share Posted March 16, 2012 Sounds like he means gas puck. Gas plug means adjustable gas regulator, gas puck is the "piston". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2012 The CSS reliability kit has a 6 setting gas plug, I used that with the CSS reliability puc. Then I switched to stock gas plug and stock puc. Same results. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrBoomstick 16 Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 Sorry for dropping off the conversation, but school is hectic. I'm on my med surge rotation. I happen to have my one saiga completely ripped down at the moment for duracoating. So if you still need to do a part to part comparison let me know we can set up a day to test it out. I. only in Chambersburg/ Marion pa area you not too far up the road. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mhagarman 2 Posted March 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2012 Sorry for dropping off the conversation, but school is hectic. I'm on my med surge rotation. I happen to have my one saiga completely ripped down at the moment for duracoating. So if you still need to do a part to part comparison let me know we can set up a day to test it out. I. only in Chambersburg/ Marion pa area you not too far up the road. I took it out on sunday and it fired like a dream. I left the quad rail on, but took off the top rail that holds the red dot. SO i'm going to put that back on and try it again, if it runs flawless again i'm just going to leave it go. Before sundays trip i had polished the hammer and BCG down a little bit more and filed out the opening in the gas block a little bit more. It ran high brass and low brass perfectly. No jams, no FTEs, nothing. I was very happy with it. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
casper980 0 Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 Are you sure you are installing the gas plug properly? Screw it in completely then back out to first minus, then adjust out from there. Just a thought, I find it odd that slugs and wally world specials are functioning basially the same. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
xICEMANx 13 Posted March 23, 2012 Report Share Posted March 23, 2012 Sorry for dropping off the conversation, but school is hectic. I'm on my med surge rotation. I happen to have my one saiga completely ripped down at the moment for duracoating. So if you still need to do a part to part comparison let me know we can set up a day to test it out. I. only in Chambersburg/ Marion pa area you not too far up the road. I took it out on sunday and it fired like a dream. I left the quad rail on, but took off the top rail that holds the red dot. SO i'm going to put that back on and try it again, if it runs flawless again i'm just going to leave it go. Before sundays trip i had polished the hammer and BCG down a little bit more and filed out the opening in the gas block a little bit more. It ran high brass and low brass perfectly. No jams, no FTEs, nothing. I was very happy with it. Good to hear! When I removed my top rail my gun ran better also. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MrBoomstick 16 Posted March 24, 2012 Report Share Posted March 24, 2012 Great news, they can be problematic, but they are worth the time to get running. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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