Why Do Newer AK Variants Have Skinnier Barrels ?

[scattergun10 125]

Not sure if this is the right forum for this topic, but here goes..... I'm just curious why some of the newer AK variants (AK-103,Saigas,etc.) use skinnier barrels than the original AK-47/AKM ?

 

Is it to lower production costs by using less steel ? (AK are already cheap to produce) I mean what other purpose could using a skinnier barrel serve ? (kind of seems like a negative to me)

 

Random question, I know, just wondering. Thanks in advance.

[Fallschirmjager667 729]

what gun are you comparing the barrels to? i wasn't aware that they were thinner, but some guns use rpk barrels which are thicker and if you compare a saiga to one of those the barrel will look thinner

[physicsnerd 139]

what gun are you comparing the barrels to? i wasn't aware that they were thinner, but some guns use rpk barrels which are thicker and if you compare a saiga to one of those the barrel will look thinner

 

Maybe if I get some time I can take a picture to show the thickness difference between the VEPR (RPK style) and Saiga (AK100 style) barrels.

[TARE 47]

One of the changes made the the AKM over the years was to manufacture barrels at the current Izhmash diameter. I believe this was thought to not noticeably effect accuracy but would lighten the heavy rifles. This compared to earlier russian riffles. The Bolt and carrier also have been changed over the years. Heavier barreled and receiver rifles still are available, some countries continued making rifles to old specs after the russians had made design changes. The Chinese and Yugo rifles have thicker receivers and barrels which should yield slightly better accuracy, but also more weight. Before the days of the heavy barreled stamped AKMs the rifles had milled receivers as you likely know, these were mostly phased out to reduce production cost, production time and weight.

[Agent Lemon 157]

I don't have a clue, but I have heard that Saigas have thin barrels/recievers compared to chinese/other battle AK guns. Also the barrel thickness on Saigas is the same for 762 and 545 from what I hear. I thought that bigger bullets would mean ticker barrels too?

 

I have always assumed that it is being done to save money, just like glock with its polymer frame. Resources are getting more expansive because people today LOVE to talk about how resources on earth will run out, talking about wars over resources and what not. Not that Russia has a problem with steel production... or any other resource for that matter, looking at how huge they are. Guns back in the day were WAY more sturdy and hard to brake. You think that modern AKs are invincible? I want to see you ruin a Mosin Nagant, with its super thick heavy receiver.

 

inb4 glock only makes polymer frames to reduce weight... I own a glock and it feels retarded and top heavy when not loaded.

[scattergun10 125]

I have an SGL-20. Aren't these supposed to be the same rifles the Russian military currently issues their troops, only in fully-auto and 5.45 instead of 7.62 ? (SGL-31)

 

I would think if they are using these guns for full-auto fire, they should plenty robust for civilian semi-auto fire. Still, I don't like the idea of thinner receivers/barrels to reduce weight and production costs at the risk of them not holding up or wearing out faster.That's just plain stupid if you ask me. I don't mind if the rifles are a little heavier, who cares.

[JBubbs 17]

I'll wait here for someone to post that they have worn out their Saiga

[GregM1 241]

I don't have a clue, but I have heard that Saigas have thin barrels/recievers compared to chinese/other battle AK guns. Also the barrel thickness on Saigas is the same for 762 and 545 from what I hear. I thought that bigger bullets would mean ticker barrels too?

 

the russians have been using a standard sized barrel outer diameter since 74. this makes production of parts for barrels easier and interchangeable. (trunions, gas blocks, & sight blocks). they are doing the opposite of your thinking by using the same barrel with smaller bullets. the receivers are the same thickness as other ak's by countries copying russia. (1.1mm) . these are the same specifications that russia is using on their ak-100 series, made on the same machines making the ak-100s.

[mancat 2,368]

There is some variation in barrel diameters across Warsaw pact nations where AKs were manufactured, and across all major AK types/variants, but there were still standards that were followed. Most AKM variants stuck close to the original AKM barrel specifications. Saiga 5.45, 7.62, and the newer .223 models all share common AKM barrel diameters. Fortunately, so did many other Warsaw pact nations, which is why barrel components can often be transferred from AKs of completely different country origins - e.g. Bulgaria, who generally directly copied most everything that Russia did.

 

Of course the large-bore and shotgun Saigas will be different, and .223 Saigas in the past had larger diameter barrels that appeared to have possibly been machined from RPK-74 barrel blanks.

 

If you google "AK barrel diameters" you'll get plenty of sizing charts.

 

The AK was never really intended for sustained automatic fire, so having an extremely heavy barrel is generally a waste of material. That is what the RPK, PK, and other Soviet-design squad automatics are used for.

Edited March 20, 2012 by mancat

[my762buzz 141]

I have an SGL-20. Aren't these supposed to be the same rifles the Russian military currently issues their troops, only in fully-auto and 5.45 instead of 7.62 ? (SGL-31)

 

I would think if they are using these guns for full-auto fire, they should plenty robust for civilian semi-auto fire. Still, I don't like the idea of thinner receivers/barrels to reduce weight and production costs at the risk of them not holding up or wearing out faster.That's just plain stupid if you ask me. I don't mind if the rifles are a little heavier, who cares.

 

A millimeter thick stamped receiver spec has been the standard since 1959 for AKM type rifles. You might be confusing either milled receiver ak47 versions or RPK 1.5-1.6mm receivers.

The original AK47 in the 1940s Type one had a stamped receiver, but because of manufacturing problems they used a milled version untill they could work out the issues.

If your comparing chinese or yugo rifles, they had a different mil spec and are not typical of an original AKM. Russian Vepr rifles in 7.62x39 are based off of the RPK concept and these have much heavier barrels and a thicker receiver of 1.5mm. The main point you can draw from this is that saigas are not any thinner in the receiver than typical mil spec AKM rifles since 1959, and that the barrels are standard also.

If you can manage to wear out a 7.62x39 saiga in less than 50,000 rounds, then you might have a legit argument. I have not seen a single report of anyone doing this. If someone wants to donate that much ammo for a torture test, I will sacrifice one of my saigas for the cause. I will provide pictures and video footage. Maybe Will on "Sons of Guns" the TV show might come up with such a torture test.