Saiga 7.62 vs Arsenal vs VEPR

[GrandLotus 0]

Whats the major differences between these rifles?

 

I was leaning towards the Saiga 7.62 and I could slowly piece together this rifle as funds became available.

I think I will have to thread the end of the barrel?

 

Pros and cons of each rifle in one easy to read thread will be awesome.

 

Thanks for helping me make a decision.

[hutchsaiga 93]

The saiga is the Sporter configuration of the Russian ak47. The pistol grip is not installed(although) there is commonly the hole cut for the nut) and a linkage is added to the trigger group to make reaching the trigger from a monte Carlo stock possible. The bullet guide is not installed in the front trunnion(which it is on actual non importable AK's)and the magazine catch tab is slightly longer to make AK designed magazines not install in the rifle. All these things are neccesarry beside of American firearm import laws of non sporting firearms

 

 

Arsenal is a company based out of las Vegas nevada who buys the saiga rifles(see above) in bulk and restores them back to the proper ak configuration using US made furniture and trigger parts to clear 922r regulations on non sporting firearms.

 

The VEPR RIFLES(VEPR not verp) are similar to saigas in the way that they are in an importable Sporter configuration. But they are normally higher quality rifles with wood thumb hole stocks, thicker receivers, and heavier profile barrels.

 

 

The most cost effective way to get one of these fantastic rifles and have it be in a ergonomic and functional package. Is to purchase a saiga rifle and do the basic conversion(just trigger,stock,PG,bullet guide and magazine catch modification are required. Which sounds like a lot but it really isn't.) now you can go all out (which I just finished) and do a full restoration(exactly what Arsenal does) and change out your gas and front sight block and add a standard ak handguard and retainer.

Edited April 8, 2012 by hutchsaiga

[GrandLotus 0]

The VEPR sounds like an option. It's gonna be between this and doing the Saiga conversion.

[armory 142]

You cannot beat the fit, finish and feel of an Arsenal.....Love my SGL-21.

Arsenal does a great job on the conversion.

Just my 2 cents, but if you don't want to convert, they are very NICE!

[Mullet Man 2,114]

The VEPR sounds like an option. It's gonna be between this and doing the Saiga conversion.

 

The VEPR's have a slant cut receiver, whichs limits what kind of butt stocks can be installed on it. Just FYI.

[GrandLotus 0]

Okay so the VEPR is out of the picture due to slant cut. Correct me if I'm wrong but a saiga does not have a fsb for a muzzle break or the threading? $350 for a saiga isint bad but for $800 I could get two polish under folders for the price of the arsenal..

Input?

[armory 142]

$350 for a saiga isint bad but for $800 I could get two polish under folders for the price of the arsenal..

Input?

Yes you could.....but then you would have 2 Polish underfolders wishing you had 1 Arsenal SGL-21.....

Don't get me wrong, I love my Yugo AKs....and my Romanian AKs........

But my Arsenal is sweet.

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

Okay so the VEPR is out of the picture due to slant cut. Correct me if I'm wrong but a saiga does not have a fsb for a muzzle break or the threading? $350 for a saiga isint bad but for $800 I could get two polish under folders for the price of the arsenal..

Input?

 

Somehow I suspect that any "Polish" AK, (underfolder or otherwise), that costs ~$400 is likely a rebarrelled kit-gun piece of shit.

[hutchsaiga 93]

A polish will be a rebarreled parts kit gun. If you want new manufacture and guaranteed quality. Saiga(or arsenal(starts off as saiga)) and vepr are the only way to go.

 

Now if you just want something that functions. But isn't necesarily the belle of the ball your ak options open up wide

[JBubbs 17]

Save some $ and convert a Saiga. As I've said before, if the Arsenal is set up EXACTLY how you want it then go ahead. My opinion has always been that brakes and comps only make small caliber rifles annoyingly loud

[Elliot@kvar 4]

Besides the great fit and finish of the Arsenal, Everyone of them is also laser sighted at the factory before it leaves to ensure that everything is lined up properly and ready to go.

[GrandLotus 0]

Neat fact Elliot. I would go ahead with a saiga but don't feel like dealing with all the BS just to add a flash hider. Do they or don't the saigas come ready to mount a flash hider?

Thanks for all the replys.

[jimdigriz 580]

Neat fact Elliot. I would go ahead with a saiga but don't feel like dealing with all the BS just to add a flash hider. Do they or don't the saigas come ready to mount a flash hider?

Thanks for all the replys.

 

There are models in the $450 range that already have the front-end conversion done, you just need to remove the thingy covering the threaded front sight block:

 

That seems to me to be the best route to go nowadays, rather than the low-end Saiga or the high-end Arsenal. Just pick one up, convert the back end, add the bullet guide, and remove the cap. Done.

 

Besides the great fit and finish of the Arsenal, Everyone of them is also laser sighted at the factory before it leaves to ensure that everything is lined up properly and ready to go.

 

Probably most Arsenals come out great. However, my SGL31 has a canted side rail.

Edited April 12, 2012 by Jim Digriz

[G O B 3,516]

Check that top of the side rail is parallel to the top rail of the receiver.

[skullface405420 45]

Neat fact Elliot. I would go ahead with a saiga but don't feel like dealing with all the BS just to add a flash hider. Do they or don't the saigas come ready to mount a flash hider?

Thanks for all the replys.

 

There are models in the $450 range that already have the front-end conversion done, you just need to remove the thingy covering the threaded front sight block:

 

That seems to me to be the best route to go nowadays, rather than the low-end Saiga or the high-end Arsenal. Just pick one up, convert the back end, add the bullet guide, and remove the cap. Done.

 

Besides the great fit and finish of the Arsenal, Everyone of them is also laser sighted at the factory before it leaves to ensure that everything is lined up properly and ready to go.

 

Probably most Arsenals come out great. However, my SGL31 has a canted side rail.

can you give me a link of where i could buy a saiga for roughly 450$ already has the front converted like that ready for a bayonet and flash surpressor? i can move the trigger add my stock and what not..i have done a full conversion before and even added the handguard retainer ect for original ak front grips.

[jimdigriz 580]

can you give me a link of where i could buy a saiga for roughly 450$ already has the front converted like that ready for a bayonet and flash surpressor? i can move the trigger add my stock and what not..i have done a full conversion before and even added the handguard retainer ect for original ak front grips.

 

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storecategory90.aspx

[BrutalGardener 205]

The VEPR RIFLES(VEPR not verp) are similar to saigas in the way that they are in an importable Sporter configuration. But they are normally higher quality rifles with wood thumb hole stocks, thicker receivers, and heavier profile barrels.

 

It's actually "Vepr" ("Вепрь") and not "VEPR". It is NOT an acronym. It's a Russian word, meaning "wild boar".

[MyGrassIsBlue05 14]

Neat fact Elliot. I would go ahead with a saiga but don't feel like dealing with all the BS just to add a flash hider. Do they or don't the saigas come ready to mount a flash hider?

Thanks for all the replys.

 

There are models in the $450 range that already have the front-end conversion done, you just need to remove the thingy covering the threaded front sight block:

 

That seems to me to be the best route to go nowadays, rather than the low-end Saiga or the high-end Arsenal. Just pick one up, convert the back end, add the bullet guide, and remove the cap. Done.

 

Besides the great fit and finish of the Arsenal, Everyone of them is also laser sighted at the factory before it leaves to ensure that everything is lined up properly and ready to go.

 

Probably most Arsenals come out great. However, my SGL31 has a canted side rail.

 

I bought the 5.45 version of this rifle, converted it, and couldn't be happier.

 

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

...It's actually "Vepr" ("Вепрь") and not "VEPR". It is NOT an acronym. It's a Russian word, meaning "wild boar".

 

Thanks for the clarification, but it's listed as "VEPR" nearly everywhere, even by firearms dealers. So, in most cases, you're more likely to be understood if you refer to it as a "VEPR" rather than "Vepr".

[BrutalGardener 205]

...It's actually "Vepr" ("Вепрь") and not "VEPR". It is NOT an acronym. It's a Russian word, meaning "wild boar".

 

Thanks for the clarification, but it's listed as "VEPR" nearly everywhere, even by firearms dealers. So, in most cases, you're more likely to be understood if you refer to it as a "VEPR" rather than "Vepr".

 

Well, let's come up with some acronyms for VEPR then. I'll start:

 

Very Excellent Pretty Rifle

Vyatskiye Polyany Rifle

[jbanzai 113]

The 7.62x39 with front end conversions already done don't have dimples.....at least the ones I can find currently. The 5.45x39 do though. That would definitely sway my leanings. I'm vain, dimples are important.

 

Get the barebones saiga and convert. First the basic PG conversion to get you to the range. As time goes, you can turn it into a full blown conversion that will rival an Arsenal. Then everyone will think you are badasss and you can brag about how much $$$ you saved!

[shades_of_grey 1,092]

...It's actually "Vepr" ("Вепрь") and not "VEPR". It is NOT an acronym. It's a Russian word, meaning "wild boar".

 

Thanks for the clarification, but it's listed as "VEPR" nearly everywhere, even by firearms dealers. So, in most cases, you're more likely to be understood if you refer to it as a "VEPR" rather than "Vepr".

 

Well, let's come up with some acronyms for VEPR then. I'll start:

 

Very Excellent Pretty Rifle

Vyatskiye Polyany Rifle

 

Very Exceptionally Ponderous Rifle

 

They're just plain overbuilt and too heavy in any caliber under .308 or x54.

Edited May 29, 2012 by post-apocalyptic

[BrutalGardener 205]

...It's actually "Vepr" ("Вепрь") and not "VEPR". It is NOT an acronym. It's a Russian word, meaning "wild boar".

 

Thanks for the clarification, but it's listed as "VEPR" nearly everywhere, even by firearms dealers. So, in most cases, you're more likely to be understood if you refer to it as a "VEPR" rather than "Vepr".

 

Well, let's come up with some acronyms for VEPR then. I'll start:

 

Very Excellent Pretty Rifle

Vyatskiye Polyany Rifle

 

Very Exceptionally Ponderous Rifle

 

They're just plain overbuilt and too heavy in any caliber under .308 or x54.

 

I generally agree, but they very well-built and accurate though. I have a Super 308, which is about the same weight (or even less) as a Saiga 308. Hey, some people still swear by milled receiver AKs... I have to admit, I do have a hard-on for this Vepr 7.62x39 build:

http://www.atlanticf...roduct1222.aspx

 

I wonder how much it weighs, compared to our (I know that you really like yours too) beloved SGL21s? SGL21s are already very accurate "AKs", but the extra barrel thickness on these, could potentially offer better accuracy after some rapid fire.

Edited May 29, 2012 by SpetsnazGRU

[Jaba1017 71]

I looked at Atlantic's website last night and there are some very cool choices for Ak on there that pretty much kill the need to buy a base Saiga or Vepr and build it out.

[Jaba1017 71]

Get the barebones saiga and convert. First the basic PG conversion to get you to the range. As time goes, you can turn it into a full blown conversion that will rival an Arsenal. Then everyone will think you are badasss and you can brag about how much $$$ you saved!

 

Lol..............I don't know about money saved. Let's be honest the modification and upgrading of the Saiga never really ends. Yea you can build out a descent Saiga. But you can end up with a closet full of parts too. And having all those extra parts around becomes a justification to buy and modify another Saiga.

[Mullet Man 2,114]

Lol..............I don't know about money saved. Let's be honest the modification and upgrading of the Saiga never really ends. Yea you can build out a descent Saiga. But you can end up with a closet full of parts too. And having all those extra parts around becomes a justification to buy and modify another Saiga.

 

Young apprentice, you catch on quick!

[AtlSaiga 25]

Love my Vepr K.

 

FYI there are receiver blocks that fit the slant cut receivers that accept all stocks. You Just have to cut off the tang. I had no prob slicing off the tang from S12, but I'd be nuts to take a saw to my RobArm Vepr.

[doodi1 23]

Love my Vepr K.

 

FYI there are receiver blocks that fit the slant cut receivers that accept all stocks. You Just have to cut off the tang. I had no prob slicing off the tang from S12, but I'd be nuts to take a saw to my RobArm Vepr.

Bonesteel Arms and CNC Warrior have a folder adapter that does not require you to cut the tang.

[skullface405420 45]

can you give me a link of where i could buy a saiga for roughly 450$ already has the front converted like that ready for a bayonet and flash surpressor? i can move the trigger add my stock and what not..i have done a full conversion before and even added the handguard retainer ect for original ak front grips.

 

http://www.atlanticf...category90.aspx

 

thank you for the link! i highly appreciate it!

[devilfish13 6]

Just received my Vepr today, have to say the fit and finish blows the crap out of my 06 Saiga .223. I wish I'd just spent the extra money and gotten the Vepr to begin with. The slant-cut receiver isn't a big issue as there are plenty of stocks that accommodate for it, just google for "vepr stock adapter" and you'll see what I mean. I already think I know what I'm going to do, one company that is on the boards here carries a block that allows use of a standard stock after grinding down the sides and bottom of the stock to fit, it's reinforced by the pg nut in the front to keep it straight. I'm between that and making my own with scrap metal. Either way, it ought to be an interesting conversion