Just starting an AR build.

[magsite20 1,664]

I picked up a DPMS stripped receiver to do what will more than likely be my one and only AR build. I had an unused standard stock with the buffer and spring so I’m using those for now and don’t plan any big stock changes. A stripped receiver and a stock that is JUST starting.

 

Now I’ve got to figure out what to build. I’m torn between 2 concepts: 1^st is a light as possible plinker with a 16” barrel and just a red dot sight very plain Jane gun, 2^nd is a 24” free floated varmint version with a better 2 lb trigger and something like a 6-24 scope on it. I’m about out of iron sights because of my vision so I plan for some kind of optics regardless of what comes out as the build.

 

While I shoot left handed I don’t think I’m going with a southpaw build but that doesn’t need to be sorted out until the lower is done.

 

I kind of like the DPMS Lo Pro upper that comes without a forward assist or dust cover. Really looking at putting a better trigger on either build, plus the one thing I’ve always wanted is an ambidextrous selector. At this point I’m still staying .223 (got mags for that) but I’m going to finish the lower before I start on the upper so that may change. As more or less the last thoughts I’ve had on the build gave some passing thoughts to a 9mm or other pistol caliber and even something in a game hunting caliber like the 6.5 Grendel.

 

Added: For the time being I ordered a DPMS lower kit and a couple of other small parts I needed for another AR just so I could have a base line starting point. Still looking at up grades on the trigger, but I may look at doing a trigger job on the kit set just to see if I can get anything better than the 2 stock ARs I have.

Edited April 9, 2012 by 20-Mags

[wtjosaas 72]

I've been looking at doing an AR build my self. What are your thoughts on Spikes Tactical?

[MT Predator 2,294]

Why not go with a 14.5" barrel and pin a muzzle brake on to bring it back to legal if you want light weight? Just bite the bullet and build a lightweight carbine upper with a T-1/H-1 Microdot and an 18" SPR upper with some good glass on it. Then you have both spectrums covered.

[magsite20 1,664]

I've been looking at doing an AR build my self. What are your thoughts on Spikes Tactical?

Sorry don’t know enough about them to give any meaningful option.

 

Why not go with a 14.5" barrel and pin a muzzle brake on to bring it back to legal if you want light weight? Just bite the bullet and build a lightweight carbine upper with a T-1/H-1 Microdot and an 18" SPR upper with some good glass on it. Then you have both spectrums covered.

I hadn’t thought about using a 14.5 with a welded brake to work with, defiantly worth looking into.

 

 

Looking at ordering a Wolf Trigger Spring Kit to see if that gives any improvement over the factory stuff.

Edited April 10, 2012 by 20-Mags

[mgconnor13 206]

I'd start with a light weight set up as a starter. AR-15s are pretty accurate out of the box so unless your planning something crazy a light 14.5" with welded brake would suite most purposes. Build a second upper with some good glass and a heavier barrel, get a note book and start crunching numbers and testing loads if you want a real real tack driver.

[magsite20 1,664]

I’ve got 2 ARs now but a buddy really wants 1 of them 20” heavy barrel Bushmaster (that gun is a tac driver). I started to just sell it and change out the barrel on the 16” heavy barrel Oly to a lighter something and call it a day. Not shooting much competition any more so don’t have any real needs at this time, just wanted a lighter gun.

 

Then I got the proverbial wild hare and bought a stripped lower the other day. Over the years I’ve done several 1911s builds but never an AR but I’ve always wanted to. I’m not getting any younger, richer, or better looking so thought of this as a take my time and have something of a hobby build project. Figure I can play with this lower with a current upper while I figure out what I want for an upper.

 

Surprisingly to me I’ve started to drift towards a 6.5 Grendel build (kind of egged on by a buddy) to have something my son could use for a hunting rifle. I’d stopped hunting shortly after he was born so we've had guns for shooting matches (which he does) but nothing really as a hunting gun other than shotguns. Not that I’m in a hurry but when I go in the dirt for the big sleep he gets what’s left in the guns so while I still have at least one 223 a 2^nd AR in a different caliber make more sense that just repeating the same set up.

[Spacehog 2,218]

My preference is a light carbine that can quickly be converted to an intermediate range gun. The base DMPS for 600 bucks is very accurate out of the box. This was the route that I went, and then added a better stock, removable bipod and decent glass. The overall weight is still low and I can still hit 4" steel plates out to 200 yds every time I pull the trigger.

 

My buddy just built a 20" bull on the DPMS lower with the Nikon M223 glass, and I can still out shoot him with a basic setup. There is no doubt he has a better gun which is capable of greater accuracy. The question is how much accuracy do you truly need. If you want to be able to shoot 1-2 MOA at 200 yards and your shooting skills are up to the precision of the gun, I would build the heavier barreled upper. However, if you are going to be shooting under 200 yds and want some versatility, I would choose the lighter build.

 

Either way you are going to have an excellent firearm. Here is a pic of mine:

 

 

 

 

Good luck with the build

[getitat 609]

Hello

 

+1 on the 14-1/2" barrel w/ pinned brake. If going that route, look for a "pencil" barrel w/ 1 :7 or 1:8 twist for the more popular heavier bullets.

A lot of the "sale" uppers seem to feature the 1:10 or 1:12 barrels that aren't that popular anymore.

 

As far as the actual construction, those confagled roll pins drop in like butta when you taks a heat gun and heat (expand) the aluminum hole thoroughly before trying to push the pin in. I mean, get that sumbitch so hot you can hardly hold it two inches away.

It's amazing how much difference that makes.

 

JMHO...

 

-guido

 

"God Loves Liberty"

[bohound 281]

After the Saiga, an AR seemed like it was going to be easier (and lighter!), in spite of it being way more parts (to potentially break).

 

Built a DTI lower with a cobbled together LPK... And bought a PSA midlength with an A2 profile barrel. I thought about cutting/perm attaching the vortex to this when it gets here... But I like the accuracy so far, so I'm leaving it be.

 

I like the PSA upper... and the longer than carbine HG is better for me too. It's a LOT lighter than my Saiga.

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

I've been looking at doing an AR build my self. What are your thoughts on Spikes Tactical?

Spikes is good to go. I own several components by them and a .22 upper. They put out great quality that adhere to the Mil-Spec at a much cheaper price than most of their competitors. Their Customer Service is phenomenal if you ever have an issue (the owner of Spikes was even willing to replace a competitor's defective product for a member of arfcom if the maker wouldn't).

 

To the OP:

DPMS Bull Barrels are good to go for your long & heavy. I have had amazing results with DPMS barrels in .223, .308 & .260 bull barrels. Great accuracy for the money.

[magsite20 1,664]

ordered an upper today went with the DPMS Lo Pro, also picked up a few other small items like a charging handle. still looking at calibers and barrels, won't get a bolt / carrier till I know what I go with.

 

 

added: Well there’s been at least one more change to plan 9 from outer space already. When I got home I took the DPMS stock off the Oly and was going to put it on the DPMS receiver, it don’t fit what a surprise.

 

To get it on the Oly I had to put a couple of relief notches at the rear of the lower so the wire stock could slide forward, the DPMS would require the same thing. Kind of thought they would have made their stuff to fit their stuff, seems not so much. This may have something to do with why this stock was discontinued by DPMS.

 

The Oly’s used has a little wear and tear showing so in my mind it was no big deal to do some mods, I’ll have to think about craving on a brand new gun.

Edited April 19, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

Well now I know what I’m building, a 6.5 Grendel with a “Black Hole Weaponry : 18" .264lbc (6.5) Standard Profile Mid Length Gas System .750 Gas Block - 1x9 Twist.” $236.99

 

I just couldn’t see where I needed a possible 3^rd 5.56 AR.

 

This will mean I’ll go with better optics and a better trigger than I might have but oh well its only money. Shells cost 3 to 4 times as much but I don’t own any thing that would remotely be called a “Hunting Rifle” so this one is at least a caliber that if my son shoots something won’t get a game warden on his ass for.

 

Just ordered a 2nd gen bolt / for $65.00 still have to get the carrier / carrier ordered DPMS $74.00

 

OMG I think I’ve finally done it got every part needed except for optics needed to build this rifle ordered.

 

DPMS: upper & lower receivers, trigger group, pins, mid length gas tube, charging handle, and bolt carrier.

 

Rock River: mid length free float tube forearm, cam pin, firing pin, and .750 lo profile gas block.

 

Black Hole Weaponry: 264 LBC / 6.5 Grendel barrel and type II bolt.

 

Yankee Hill Machine 5/8-24 thread protector, an AR-Stoner mag, and the old A2 butt stock, spring, and buffer off my used Olympic Arms AR.

 

Of course a bunch of this stuff went on back order but it feels good just to know it’s all coming at some point in time.

Edited April 24, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

Well build stuff for the Grendel is still trickling in, maybe by the end of the week I’ll have at least all the stuff for the lower as it will be 1^st set up. I ordered some hopefully better trigger / hammer springs (3 ½ JP Enterprises) and an ambidextrous selector. The more I’ve thought about this it’s going to be a “hunting rifle” so maybe I don’t want to get into match / target stuff as much as I thought I did.

 

I kind of plan to use the Millet DMS scope off the Bushmaster it only goes up to 4 power but for no more range than is available for shooting around here it should be fine. Can’t see the forest for the trees around here. Got a guy who wants the rifle he can buy his own scope.

 

Today I ordered 10 boxes / 200 rounds of the 120 grain Wolf ammo at $13.70 a box, dawned on me I could get the upper stuff in and not have any thing to test fire with. None of the local stores stock any 6.5 Grendel ammo. It’s not great ammo but I’ve read it will shoot 1 to 1.5 inch groups so it’s more than good enough for me. Even reloading I don’t think I can get the per shot down as low as the .223 so I want to keep the Oly for now.

 

Well shit this just keeps getting better and better. I got an AR barrel delivered yesterday I ordered a BHW .264 lbc (6.5 Grendel) 18” barrel I received a BHW 5.56 (.223) 16” barrel, both useful items but not interchangeable. The day before I’d gotten an email from the sender wanting me to do an online review wonder, if they still want that right now? For the record it was not from the mfg.

 

Barrel issue resolved right barrel coming wrong barrel on the way back.

Edited May 2, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

Got my son working on some art work seeing how this will more than likely be the only AR build I do. Took some art found on line and changing the color to work on a dark background.

 

 

Well I stuck together the lower this weekend, I’m not sure if my left thumb survived the operation. No doubt the people who do this have techniques and skills that make it less of an ordeal than I went thru on a few areas. Little pins and springs everywhere are not something that is for the fumble fingered likes of me. There is a lot to be said for store bought ready made guns.

 

The only thing that was slightly amiss was the ping pong paddle / bolt release is a little stiff but as I slapped some oil on it and worked it back and forth it’s loosened up. As to the trigger feel with the J P Enterprises reduced power springs it’s better than some triggers but no one is going to confuse it for a professional match trigger. Only some shooting will tell at this point feels like there is a little creep and over travel but it breaks fairly light (4 lb range).

 

On the subject of shooting I was going to try it with a .223 upper but sonny boy had the stock and I didn’t want to take one off one of the other guns. I finally got a new cheapy red dot for the Oly’s co-witness set up that seems to work pretty well and I’d ordered a set of springs for that gun too. So if Sam drops the stock off today I’ll try the new Grendel lower and the old Oly upper.

Edited May 7, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

Making progress the lower works I put the upper off the old Oly on it and shot it yesterday after work. The triggers not bad as with any trigger it could always be better, but it’s definitely shootable. Now if I can get Midway to get on the ball I’ll have a 6.5 Grendel done.

[TIMTIMTIM 57]

Been following your build and just picked up a bushmaster. Just saw the prices for the barrel go up! Doh!

[gunfun 3,931]

For the artwork on the other side, you can have Grendel after his arms get torn off!

 

Looks like a fun build.

[magsite20 1,664]

The rifle got finished today but have to wait to get home to test fire it.

 

.264 lbc / 6.5 Grendel with Black Hole Weaponry 18" mid length gas system barrel and bolt

 

with DPMS receiver, lo pro upper, bolt carrier, and trigger group with 3.5 J&P springs,

 

Rock River free float forearm.

 

Moved my old Millett DMS 1-4 scope to it and put a Bushnell 1-4 on the Bushmaster.

 

1st and only AR build feels pretty good to be done with.

 

Photos to follow.

[magsite20 1,664]

Ok here’s the story: got home had company the granddaughter was there with the wife (thanks son) so I waited to even pull the gun out. After a while the desire to at least get a bullet in the chamber got the better of me so I get 2 rounds load them in the 5 shot mag and out the back door I go.

 

Mag in rifle, pull the charging handle, release it and a round chambers, rifle to shoulder, point it a the woods and bang, happy days it went off, 2^nd trigger pull and again bang, hot damn it cycles.

 

Here is where the story changes I look in the chamber and the 2^nd rounds brass is laying there. I look down and the 1^st rounds brass is between my feet. Well it cycled but just barely so I take the two pieces of brass in and start looking at them. Primers flattened on both, maybe a little dirty at the neck, can’t tell if the brass is budged at the base or not but there is a distinct change in the area between the lower area and the rest of the brass.

 

So don’t know yet because it was the cheap Russian Wolf ammo and I’ve read a lot of good and bad about that stuff. This is the 120 grain so it’s suppose to be ok but who knows with Putin he may be out to get me.

 

I’ll check a couple of things on the gun like the gas block and clean the chamber good but I’ll also buy some good ammo to see if it’s gun or ammo related.

Edited June 20, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

the rifle as it is right now

Edited June 20, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

OK a Tubb’s buffer spring and some bolt carrier weights I ordered came, I installed them with the heaviest weight, and I fired the gun. Two rounds 1^st run both ejected about 3 feet, bolt locked back (both still showing the same stress signs on the cases), 3 rounds 2^nd run first 2 ejected again about 3 feet, 3^rd round smoke stacked all still show the same pressure stress signs. Time to buy some better ammo I guess.

 

In a way this has been kind of funny in as much that the rifle only has a stoppage on the last round loaded but all the firing has been on loads of 2 or 3 rounds.

 

Anyway I’ll get something besides the Russian ammo more than likely the Hornady 123 gr A-Max and see where the rifle is at before any more changes to it.

[magsite20 1,664]

As far as the 6.5 Grendel it's still hit and miss with the Russian ammo ejecting but the Hornady runs 100%. Seeing how I bought a couple hundred of the Wolf figure might as well use it and be done with it. Both hit the target fine and consistent I just wouldn't want a mag full of Wolf if I really needed more than 1 shot for sure.

[tokinshitload 12]

I see you went with a smooth side upper without the Brenton bump. How is that treating you shooting it left handed? I have built several AR's in 5.56 and a couple now in 300 blackout, and they all leave brass on the bump. The reason I ask is I also shoot lefty, and wouldn't think of shooting a smooth side for fear of getting hot brass in the face. Does the 6.5 eject at a different angle?

xacex

[magsite20 1,664]

I can’t speak to all calibers and loads / bolt, buffer, and spring set ups but with this gun as configured it actually tends to send the spent cases out at just about a perfect 90 degrees angle. I figured if it was an issue I could add a shell deflector later but at this point I don’t think I’d ever need one. For one thing I built this as a hunting rifle and it won’t get a high volume of fire out of me like an AR at a 3 gun match. But this is not a 5.56 so how it would work with a different ammo or 6.5 load is an unknown to me.

[YARP 300]

Good build thread 20-mags! I don't know how I missed it, very interested in how the BHW barrel does in the accuarcy department. Any chance you could run some loads over a chrono and post your findings?

[magsite20 1,664]

As soon as I get a chance I’ll try to run some number to see what kind of velocities I’m getting.

 

We sighted it in over the weekend and even with just using a fork in a tree and with my blind shaky self shooting the gun at about 50 yards still was able to do at least one 3 shot group with all of them overlapped. So I know the rifle will out shoot me which is no great claim to fame but still something. When I get a chance to shoot from a bench with some sandbags I’ll post some groups good, bad, or indifferent.

 

Phil’s .264 LBC / 6.5 Grendel build

 

1^st thanks to Ed H. whose loaning me the tools made this even possible to do it myself.

 

Parts used during the build and lessons learned plus possible future changes:

 

Black Hole Weaponry: 18 inch .264 LBC / 6.5 Grendel barrel with mid length gas port and type II bolt. Might have been better to use a rifle length gas system for this build in this caliber.

DPMS: Lo-Pro upper, mid length gas tube, and bolt carrier added Tubb’s buffer spring and some bolt carrier weights.

Rock River: mid length free float tube forearm, cam pin, firing pin, and .750 lo profile gas block.

Yankee Hill Machine charging handle and 5/8-24 thread protector.

Model 1 Sales mount and a 1-4 Millett DMS scope. At some point chances are I will install a better scope with a lot more magnification. Also should add a bipod at some point.

 

DPMS: lower receiver, trigger group, pins, used 3.5 J&P Enterprises springs with the trigger group the old A2 butt stock, and rifle buffer out of a used Olympic Arms AR a couple of AR-Stoner mags. Might install a better trigger at some point down the road.

[YARP 300]

Any reason why you would go with the rifle vs. carbine length gas system?

[The_Caged_Bird 474]

I've seen brass deformed like that before, usually it's because someone loaded the wrong caliber but I've also seen it in severly worn/mis-machined chambers...

[magsite20 1,664]

Any reason why you would go with the rifle vs. carbine length gas system?

 

This ammo has some serious punch so there’s no danger of being under gassed, the shorter gas system even with a smaller port has no problem blowing the bolt back in fact I may still look at an adjustable gas block. The extra power over a 5.56 was why I added the Tubb’s spring and weights.

 

 

I've seen brass deformed like that before, usually it's because someone loaded the wrong caliber but I've also seen it in severly worn/mis-machined chambers...

 

Wolf now makes 2 loads for this caliber and as said earlier is suppose to be coming out with a steel case version of them as opposed to the brass ones. The 123 gr soft point load has a reputation with Grendel shooters for having problems while the 120 gr load is usually good but some lots have softer brass used and or some guns / chambers just don’t like it. My rifle may be one that doesn’t like it or it may just be soft brass in the batch I got I don’t know yet. I have some 123 gr Hornady that seems to be a little hotter than the Wolf and it works and cycles perfectly with no pressure signs on the brass in my rifle. I’ve got a buddy Ed that I’m going to give a box or 2 of the Wolf stuff to try in his rifle and we’ll see if it’s more or less ammo or gun / chamber related.

 

 

On the left is a spent Hornady case on the right is a spent Wolf case.

Edited July 16, 2012 by 20-Mags

[magsite20 1,664]

from a talk I had on a different forum:

 

Originally Posted by Bill Alexander

Your chamber neck is too tight and is probably too short to the transition angle. Your extractor has a sharp section somewhere on the edge.

 

Well when the expert speaks it's good to listen. Played with the extractor (thanks bwaites) but didn't want to scrap it out if I could help it so didn't move enough metal to change anything. Then it dawned on me I have another AR my old faithful Bushmaster 5.56 that never failed me. Swapped extractors and suddenly the Grendel runs with Wolf 120s. The bulge is still there on the spent cases but it cycles fine, while it's a shame to not have brass that can be reloaded more than likely it's good to have the gun cycle the cheapest ammo available. So a big thank you Mr. Alexander for your time and inputs on this. So all this time I was looking at this as one problem when there were / are at least 2.

 

 

ps the Bushmaster runs fine with the rejected extractor so now the two ARs are blood brothers.