Are you really protected?

[Kiddjubbz 6]

Okay so everyone is talking if you'd rather have this or that in a SHTF or a apocalyptic situation....The zombie craze is a little funny and unrealistic to me but hey whatever makes your day. Point is if the economy really collapses and SHTF the military or FEMA is usually the first to respond. Who's to say they don't look up who has registered weapons and conduct raids to relieve you of your Gun & Ammo stockpiles? I heard somewhere once that police were going door to door in N.O. after Katrina to collect registered weapons. Might be bullshit but who knows? Ya you have tons of Gun's & Ammo but that's not gonna do much against a trained military team performing raids. I brought this up because the current situation with our gun rights is slowly diminishing. NWO is becoming more apparent and scarier then ever and realizing that if the goverment whats to take control, take our weapons and put us in "Camps" then there isn't shit we could really do about it. Just food for thought...prove me wrong...

[chevyman097 2,579]

There is no gun registery. The officers in New Orleans were not looking for "registered" weapons. They were looking for any weapons.

 

Edit to add: There is no "national" registery I should say. There is only like what? 2 states that require a registration when buying? Texas is not one of them.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Chevyman097

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

First off those who are UN-preppared are zombies in my book. Secondly there are several states making plans and starting resolutions to deal with what you are talking about. The federal government has been and seems will continue to overstep it's bounds. Most of these are in the south, so that will not help you much.........

[Kiddjubbz 6]

Ya I didn't think about this on a national level. I live in CT where any handgun needs to be registered and the Gun laws are absolutely ridiculous.

[armalite_ar50 86]

I'm not to worried about it, I know I'm on a list.

 

Hell I'm in the NFA registry. (more then once but not as much as some people)

[gregomega 929]

I just dont understand what the teams who will be doing the raiding and possible killing of armed citizens wanting to keep thier right to bare arms, will be thinking? Do all of their extended family not own guns and do they think that what they could possibly do to one persons family, could not happen to their own?

 

Ex. lets say im apart of this squad thats gonna take these weapons away from people. Well most of about everyone of my family and extended family members own guns. Do I not expect to raid them or have a similar team raid them?

 

This just doesnt make sense to me.

 

In that type of situation, would you stick around the squad to go raid people or go home to your family to protect and prepare for possibe oncoming hardships?

[Guns Are Great 140]

When it gets to that point, all you have to lose is your life! Living as a slave you're really dead already! Never run to FEMA or the safety of the barbed wire fence or football stadium b/c it soon becomes your prison! Many will just follow orders and do as told! There is always NATO and The U.N. Obama was said to have applied for Nato/Canadian troops in California in his early Presidency due to its likely collapse and rioting over lose of services. Rumor maybe? But They were reportedly used in N.O. La. also.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Guns Are Great

[Dad2142Dad 6,559]

I just don't understand what the teams who will be doing the raiding and possible killing of armed citizens wanting to keep thier right to bare arms, will be thinking? Do all of their extended family not own guns and do they think that what they could possibly do to one persons family, could not happen to their own?

 

Ex. lets say I'm apart of this squad that's gonna take these weapons away from people. Well most of about everyone of my family and extended family members own guns. Do I not expect to raid them or have a similar team raid them?

 

This just doesnt make sense to me.

 

In that type of situation, would you stick around the squad to go raid people or go home to your family to protect and prepare for possible oncoming hardships?

 

Can't see that happening in the south east or west. In the north, in larger cities is where it will happen. Won't be pretty......

[storm6490 2,768]

No offense to the OP but you need to quit with the defeated attitude. The best troops in the world are in Afghanistan right now. They are up against people who are defending their native land. They have shit for weapons and really bad training. The Russians couldn't beat them, we have a hard time holding them back.

 

Nobody I served with including myself would want the job of disarming Americans. In the case of Katrina, they went up against old ladies and easy law abiding targets to practice for their agenda.

 

Cost to benefit ratio comes to mind. Would you put in 10 million dollars worth of troops (10 men) to one home for 20 guns?

 

The only way an invading force be it foreign or domestic could take out the American people would be by psychological operations like the ones used on you to make you feel that that our special forces would have a flying chance in hell against our armed population.

Edited April 19, 2012 by storm6490

[armalite_ar50 86]

I'd rather go up against on afgany with a new FA AK then one with a 100 year old 303 enfield and new how to use it.

How many deer hunters are in america again?

[DogMan 2,343]

I just dont understand what the teams who will be doing the raiding and possible killing of armed citizens wanting to keep thier right to bare arms, will be thinking? Do all of their extended family not own guns and do they think that what they could possibly do to one persons family, could not happen to their own?

 

Ex. lets say im apart of this squad thats gonna take these weapons away from people. Well most of about everyone of my family and extended family members own guns. Do I not expect to raid them or have a similar team raid them?

 

This just doesnt make sense to me.

 

In that type of situation, would you stick around the squad to go raid people or go home to your family to protect and prepare for possibe oncoming hardships?

THIS. It's the Achilles Heal of any possible scenario which would have U.S. military or police going door to door seizing weapons or committing other unconstitutional atrocities on a widespread scale. They would start revolting and infighting once they came to the realization that their friends and family are being subjected to this.

[Ronin38 2,117]

I don't recall for certain during Hurricane Katrina if there were LEO's taking guns, but I clearly recall the articles about neighbors patrolling their own neighborhoods ARMED to keep gangs and looters out.

[chevyman097 2,579]

You didnt look very far Ronin. There are plenty of reports of people getting their guns taken during katrina.

[storm6490 2,768]

I don't recall for certain during Hurricane Katrina if there were LEO's taking guns, but I clearly recall the articles about neighbors patrolling their own neighborhoods ARMED to keep gangs and looters out.

 

Here's just one example...

[thebuns1 4,323]

Dear kiddjubbz,

 

we have a sacred duty to protect whats ours, protect ourselves and resist tyrant oppression. plain and simple. if you feel that there isnt anything that you can do, then you have already lost. it wouldnt take most of the military long wake up to whats going on. especially when people fight back. but many would continue to carry out orders on the simple fact that they dont want to get courtmarshall, or other type of disciplinary action taken against them. and there is some that is plain brainwashed. Theres a lot more veterans in this country that are more than willing to fight for what rights we have left, than to enforce a globalist agenda, or to sit back and let it happen.

 

You have to have a line in the sand. Would you sit back and let them take your shit and you and your family to a fema camp? i find it hard to protect yourself and yours when your in a fema camp situation. I would much rather willingly fight and teach my friends and family that freedom is worth fighting for, and dying for. I refuse to hide behind my family, i will stand infront of them. I refuse to sit back and let our government go door to door plundering our homes and property and sending our people to enslavement camps. The day the American people let this happen, is the same day that the American people turn their backs on the very men who fought and died for our flag. I refuse to be that asshole. Based on the current events, the time is getting closer than a lot of people realize.

 

Just remember the 3 percenters.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Captain Hero

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

The proportion of military and LEO to civilians was much higher during Katrina because there was an evacuation. The people still there didn't evacuate.

 

In emergency situations where no single agency is truly "in charge", information travels very slowly and everyone thinks they are in charge. Cooperation will be limited.

 

4473's are the only Federal registration of firearms in this country and the authorities would have to go to every point of sale to obtain these paper forms and the sheer number would be overwhelming to compile a concise & accurate "hit list" without cross referencing another database like the DMV records. CCW's and LEO signoff's with your sheriff are another story.

 

If society breaks down, the looting and violence will initially be in urban retail areas before spreading to neighborhoods. If there is no power, Playstations and IPads have no value and the thieving dumbshits won't realize that they should have been stealing food, water and clothing until a few days into it. Neighborhoods with armed defenders will be avoided for easier targets.

 

If LEO and Military open fire on civilians without cause, they will quickly dwindle in numbers as people will figure out that it is necessary to their survival to fight back. A military force cannot maintain control of a population without a ground presence and bombing our own cities is going to create a serious uprising with the American people and the vast majority of US military personnel will not obey orders to kill US civilians indiscriminately.

 

The UN, on the other hand...

[ChileRelleno 7,071]

Ragnar Benson:

"Never, under any circumstances, ever become a refugee... Die if you must, but die on your home turf with your face to the wind, not in some stinking hellhole 2,000 kilometers away, among people you neither know nor care about."

 

My wife and I have discussed this at length.

My first thoughts are to 'Refuse & Resist', and for a long time this was my heart's desire.

But what does a Man do, die leaving his wife and three kids to fend for themselves?

Maybe, depending on the situation, e.g. a real 'Call To Arms' in organized Militia to fight for our Country & Constitution.

But, in the course of events in which such has happened and may again happen, no, it is time to be intelligent.

Give them a few cheap disposable firearms, kept at ready/visible, make a stink about, cower a bit when they posture/threaten, and pull the good shit out when they are gone.

[thebuns1 4,323]

Ragnar Benson:

"Never, under any circumstances, ever become a refugee... Die if you must, but die on your home turf with your face to the wind, not in some stinking hellhole 2,000 kilometers away, among people you neither know nor care about."

 

My wife and I have discussed this at length.

My first thoughts are to 'Refuse & Resist', and for a long time this was my heart's desire.

But what does a Man do, die leaving his wife and three kids to fend for themselves?

Maybe, depending on the situation, e.g. a real 'Call To Arms' in organized Militia to fight for our Country & Constitution.

But, in the course of events in which such has happened and may again happen, no, it is time to be intelligent.

Give them a few cheap disposable firearms, kept at ready/visible, make a stink about, cower a bit when they posture/threaten, and pull the good shit out when they are gone.

 

i thought about this as well chile, but what worries me, when they come to take your guns, they will most likely be taking you along with them as well. what we seen in katrina was a soft core version of what will eventually come. but they wouldnt be able to do so on such a large scale. mostly in heavily populated areas where they can close down the city to where no one gets in or out.

 

i always like the statement:

 

"Those who hammer their guns into plows, will plow for those who dont"

Edited April 20, 2012 by Captain Hero

[devildogdakota 804]

I'd rather go up against on afgany with a new FA AK then one with a 100 year old 303 enfield and new how to use it.

How many deer hunters are in america again?

Or elk hunters, antelope hunters, varmant hunters, upland bird and waterfowl hunters, range shooters, ex-military, gun lovers,etc... Amen brother.

[TacSat 90]

heard about this on the radio just found the artical. OP not to far off

http://www.examiner.com/article/alaska-gun-stores-say-atf-engaging-new-illegal-activity

[sowhat6565 20]

was seating around after work one day drinking and this topic came up. one of the guys works for the local sheriff as a jailer. ask him if the feds came in and told him to go door to door to collect guns and ammo while they stay out on the street and give back up, would/could he do it. his reply was "yes if they told me to." dont think it will never happen.

[preparehandbook 326]

The folks that lost their firearms in Katrina for the most part did several stupid things.

• Asnwered the door. When you see the cops going door to door confiscating your neigbor's guns, maybe just play "not home"
  
• answered "yes" to the question "do you have any guns". I'd say "God no, they scare me to death"
  
• Left weapons in plain sight.
  
• Lived in fucking New Orleans.
  

 

I live in Eastern Washington, everybody, and I mean everybody here owns and carries guns I see 2 or 3 poorly concealed guns and many "tactical fanny packs" on any given trip to the store. I would not raise arms against the police, but if even 3% would (the average revolutionary prone estimate) the cops would be going form gun battle to gun battle. Also, I doubt the cops around here would try it.

 

5 miles away the Idaho Militias are a very visible presence, these are the guys who will be attracting all the attention, I will be hunkered down eating MREs or out volunteering with red cross.

[DrThunder88 912]

To paraphrase Edmund Burke, it doesn't take an evil person to do evil things, just a bunch of regular schlubs doing their jobs. There's a reason the Founding Fathers were skeptical of standing armies and wrote so many protections of the suspected, accused, and convicted into the Bill of Rights. There's every indication to think that they didn't believe that rank-and-file soldiers and officers would respect the rights of citizens, and, honestly, I don't know if they were wrong. Maybe there are the fabled "few good men" in uniform who would be righteously insubordinate, but I'm a pessimist.

 

I'm also skeptical about the non-availability of gun buying data to federal authorities when the NICS check is used. Working as a phone and database jockey, I've been reassured that just about everything I do in an official capacity is recorded forever. When dealing with sensitive information, accountability is paramount, and this means that every query is logged and timestamped. It's possible that the database queries are not saved or are saved in such a way that can't be easily searched or sorted, but, like I said, I'm a pessimist. Or it could be that either the rank-and-file database users would refuse to comply with illegal attempts to access the data, but...well, you know: pessimist.

[patriot 7,197]

....someone could have an "oops!" moment and wipe said database easily. restoring backups takes time.

 

Corrupting it is even easier and less likely to be immediately discovered.

 

Just a couple of possible scenarios.

Edited April 20, 2012 by patriot

[G O B 3,516]

Here in Maryland all scary hand guns and "assault weapons" are illegally registered by the socialist regime. They have gone as far as 3AM raids on honest citizens who bought hand gun ammo in a caliber for a handgun witch there records did not show ownership of. SWAT kicking in doors demanding to search for the "illegal,unregistered gun".

 

Remember this: "just because you are paranoid, that doesn't mean that they are not really after you!"

 

(Edit to add:) You can research the above incidents at Maryland Shooters Forum.

Edited April 20, 2012 by G O B

[Guns Are Great 140]

Well there are some very good points above and I love the optimism expressed. OP, I do belive they are disarming Americans. Here's how: with increase prices of goods and services, increase energy cost, limiting food and health care availability, decreased jobs and quality of education, creating a nation of deservers rather than a nation independence, independent thinkers and doers! Corruption is king right now. The media and Govt lie every breath and people either believe it or don't care. I don't know when the end comes according to the Bible, but for America it is very close if we don't put a stop to the lies and over reaching govt once and for all. And when evil rears its head we have to cut it off everytime! I mean evil here in America like race baters and haters. Politicians that lie and cheat the American people, corrupt agents, citizens that want to live off the welfare tit without true disability or elderly need. until we fix this all the guns in the world cannot save you, your family or our country. the easiest way to control people is pain and hunger. Starve then offer food and see what people are willing to do. Find people with much sickness and pain and sufferring and offer pain meds and antibiotics and watch what they will do for you. We are headed there now. there are constant med back orders everyday, there are more insurance denials and foreclosures and joblessness and it will come to a head oneday soon.

Edited April 20, 2012 by Guns Are Great

[G O B 3,516]

Bread and Circus.

[BpS12 512]

No military/government has ever fully defeated an armed insurgency defending it's homeland short of COMPLETE genocide.

 

An all out gun grab would cause an all out revolution. It's the "little bit at a time" grabs and anti American legislation that worries me more. If we have enough SHtFs(a la Katrina) going on at one time to allow a nation wide grab, the Gov wil have way too much to worry about to make it effective across the country, esp in the more rural areas. Imho, the beiggest worry for the Individual and our families will be the rise of local "warlords" like in parts of Africa. Esp those who would claim to be "Cleansing America" of the those of us that don't fit their idea of what an American should be.

 

Just my two bits,

 

Never surrender, never bow unless to disembowl your enemy.

[twoskinsoneman 72]

I take heart from the post that say "die on your home turf instead of live as a prisoner in a camp" but the reality is if a swat team comes to your door and tells you the area is contaminated and you a required to come with them for you own safety, I doubt anyone is going to resist. And I bet that big cop who tackled the little old lady in her home to force her to leave feels quite proud of himself for doing his duty.

 

The real problem is I doubt we WILL ever see it coming. If any serious situation happens whatever "media" available is going to be telling you exactly what the gov wants you to hear to get you to comply.

[Kiddjubbz 6]

Thanks for the views expressed here. Some really good topics and opinions expressed here. I do believe that the U.S government is slowly disarming us though, and it's a very scary thought. I would def. fight for my life when it comes down to it because like some other posts stated, "I would rather die then be a slave". The Saiga 12 community needs to unite and prepare for this type of event HA! Could you imagine everyone joining together from the saiga 12 community to form one giant saiga army?