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Ultimak gas tube rail and optics on a Saiga 308


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#1 lunker

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Posted 24 April 2012 - 09:08 PM

I have been Googling and scouring through the forum and it seems that most of the info I see is a few years old. I would like to have a Scout setup on my Saiaga 308, and throw an Aimpoint T1/H1 on an Ultimak gas tube rail. The question I have is about the Ultimak rail. I have read about people using the standard tube/rail and just dremeling out the inside of the U-bolt to account for the thicker barrel profile. I see that Ultimak has VEPR tubes though. I owned a Robarms VEPR and know the barrel had a thicker profile. Can I use one of them? I would think the U-bolt would be bigger to accomodate the bigger barrel. It seems like if it fits, I have to modify the lower handguard. If I use the standard one, I have to modify the U bolts.
Also, if I do get this tube mounted, will the Aimpoint H1 or T1 cowitness? I am OK with a lower 1/3 Cowitness (although I prefer absolute) if it works out that way. Does anyone have the latest scoop? Thanks.

#2 Jim Digriz

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Posted 25 April 2012 - 07:06 AM

I have been Googling and scouring through the forum and it seems that most of the info I see is a few years old. I would like to have a Scout setup on my Saiaga 308, and throw an Aimpoint T1/H1 on an Ultimak gas tube rail. The question I have is about the Ultimak rail. I have read about people using the standard tube/rail and just dremeling out the inside of the U-bolt to account for the thicker barrel profile. I see that Ultimak has VEPR tubes though. I owned a Robarms VEPR and know the barrel had a thicker profile. Can I use one of them? I would think the U-bolt would be bigger to accomodate the bigger barrel. It seems like if it fits, I have to modify the lower handguard. If I use the standard one, I have to modify the U bolts.
Also, if I do get this tube mounted, will the Aimpoint H1 or T1 cowitness? I am OK with a lower 1/3 Cowitness (although I prefer absolute) if it works out that way. Does anyone have the latest scoop? Thanks.


The Saiga 308 barrel is tapered and also very thick, which makes it difficult to pull off the Ultimak for it. I opted for the RS AKML mount for my S308, which does allow co-witnessing of the T1, and actually helps balance the weapon, rather than unbalancing it further by adding yet more forward weight.

Edited by Jim Digriz, 25 April 2012 - 07:10 AM.


#3 squinty

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 10:39 PM


I have been Googling and scouring through the forum and it seems that most of the info I see is a few years old. I would like to have a Scout setup on my Saiaga 308, and throw an Aimpoint T1/H1 on an Ultimak gas tube rail. The question I have is about the Ultimak rail. I have read about people using the standard tube/rail and just dremeling out the inside of the U-bolt to account for the thicker barrel profile. I see that Ultimak has VEPR tubes though. I owned a Robarms VEPR and know the barrel had a thicker profile. Can I use one of them? I would think the U-bolt would be bigger to accomodate the bigger barrel. It seems like if it fits, I have to modify the lower handguard. If I use the standard one, I have to modify the U bolts.
Also, if I do get this tube mounted, will the Aimpoint H1 or T1 cowitness? I am OK with a lower 1/3 Cowitness (although I prefer absolute) if it works out that way. Does anyone have the latest scoop? Thanks.


The Saiga 308 barrel is tapered and also very thick, which makes it difficult to pull off the Ultimak for it. I opted for the RS AKML mount for my S308, which does allow co-witnessing of the T1, and actually helps balance the weapon, rather than unbalancing it further by adding yet more forward weight.


If I ask noce, would you post pics of the rifle with the mount attached, please? Sounds interesting.

#4 Jim Digriz

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 12:18 PM



I have been Googling and scouring through the forum and it seems that most of the info I see is a few years old. I would like to have a Scout setup on my Saiaga 308, and throw an Aimpoint T1/H1 on an Ultimak gas tube rail. The question I have is about the Ultimak rail. I have read about people using the standard tube/rail and just dremeling out the inside of the U-bolt to account for the thicker barrel profile. I see that Ultimak has VEPR tubes though. I owned a Robarms VEPR and know the barrel had a thicker profile. Can I use one of them? I would think the U-bolt would be bigger to accomodate the bigger barrel. It seems like if it fits, I have to modify the lower handguard. If I use the standard one, I have to modify the U bolts.
Also, if I do get this tube mounted, will the Aimpoint H1 or T1 cowitness? I am OK with a lower 1/3 Cowitness (although I prefer absolute) if it works out that way. Does anyone have the latest scoop? Thanks.


The Saiga 308 barrel is tapered and also very thick, which makes it difficult to pull off the Ultimak for it. I opted for the RS AKML mount for my S308, which does allow co-witnessing of the T1, and actually helps balance the weapon, rather than unbalancing it further by adding yet more forward weight.


If I ask noce, would you post pics of the rifle with the mount attached, please? Sounds interesting.


Posted Image
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#5 Berzerker2

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 05:47 PM




I have been Googling and scouring through the forum and it seems that most of the info I see is a few years old. I would like to have a Scout setup on my Saiaga 308, and throw an Aimpoint T1/H1 on an Ultimak gas tube rail. The question I have is about the Ultimak rail. I have read about people using the standard tube/rail and just dremeling out the inside of the U-bolt to account for the thicker barrel profile. I see that Ultimak has VEPR tubes though. I owned a Robarms VEPR and know the barrel had a thicker profile. Can I use one of them? I would think the U-bolt would be bigger to accomodate the bigger barrel. It seems like if it fits, I have to modify the lower handguard. If I use the standard one, I have to modify the U bolts.
Also, if I do get this tube mounted, will the Aimpoint H1 or T1 cowitness? I am OK with a lower 1/3 Cowitness (although I prefer absolute) if it works out that way. Does anyone have the latest scoop? Thanks.


The Saiga 308 barrel is tapered and also very thick, which makes it difficult to pull off the Ultimak for it. I opted for the RS AKML mount for my S308, which does allow co-witnessing of the T1, and actually helps balance the weapon, rather than unbalancing it further by adding yet more forward weight.


If I ask noce, would you post pics of the rifle with the mount attached, please? Sounds interesting.


Posted Image

Wow that looks great. I love the plum furniture. MI has a nice minidot mount that fits into the rear sight mount.

#6 Jim Digriz

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 07:36 PM

Wow that looks great. I love the plum furniture.


Thanks.

MI has a nice minidot mount that fits into the rear sight mount.


It looks pretty lightweight and slim, which makes it appealing, but I don't have any confidence that it will stand up to the recoil of the S308. (For the same reason, I passed on the TWS).

Edited by Jim Digriz, 22 May 2012 - 07:37 PM.


#7 RED333

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 07:56 PM

Just an idear.
I have shot close to 200 rounds and it holds up fine, shot a 1 foot round plate
at 300 yards many times.

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#8 longhorn03

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 08:02 PM

I have the CSS tri rail with the top rail attachment foregrip. I haven't shot with it yet but it seems very solid.

#9 post-apocalyptic

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 06:38 AM

Posted Image


Great set-up, Jim! She looks badass. :up:

What's the barrel lengh, if you don't mind me asking?

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#10 Jim Digriz

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Posted 23 May 2012 - 07:37 AM

Great set-up, Jim! She looks badass. Posted Image

What's the barrel lengh, if you don't mind me asking?


17.8". I know, a strange length. I asked the gunsmith to chop exactly 4 inches. The Battlecomp adds two inches, so a net reduction of two from the original length.

Edited by Jim Digriz, 23 May 2012 - 07:40 AM.


#11 SOPMOD

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Posted 25 May 2012 - 02:58 PM

That looks awesome with the plum furniture Jim!

#12 Netpackrat

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 03:49 PM

Necroposting in this thread to note that I phoned Ultimak a few minutes ago to inquire as to the status of the gas tube rail for the Saiga .308 that they have been reportedly working on for some time.  I was told that it had been put on hold due to some sort of family emergency, but that it was fully prototyped and awaiting field testing.  The person I spoke with on the phone said that assuming resumption of normal operations as planned, to expect the S-308 rail in 4-6 months.  FWIW.



#13 jasondavisesq

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 10:20 AM

Did they give any idea of a price range for the rail?



#14 Netpackrat

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 03:13 PM

No, I didn't ask.  I would assume it to be in the same range as their other rails, but that's just speculation.



#15 jasondavisesq

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 09:17 AM

good news nonetheless, thanks!



#16 longhorn03

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 03:15 PM

Back from the dead again...

An update to my post in here about the CSS rail, similar to ultimak.

 

My T1 does not cowitness with my HK sight while it is mounted on the top rail as shown.  The top of the HK sight is not cut out, or else it might co witness but as it stands right now the dot top part of the iron....

 

I'm ordering an AKML soon to achieve 1/3 and taking the top rail of the CSS rails system off to shed some weight.

 

20131019_160232.jpg

 

another look,

 

20131019_160316.jpg


Edited by longhorn03, 22 October 2013 - 03:16 PM.

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#17 Netpackrat

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 01:49 AM

If it doesn't co-witness and you can take the top rail off, how is it similar to the Ultimak?  The main reason I am interested in the Ultimak is because it replaces the gas tube, and adds some small amount of stiffness.  My goal is to reduce the stringing I am experiencing as my .308 heats up.



#18 longhorn03

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 09:02 AM

If it doesn't co-witness and you can take the top rail off, how is it similar to the Ultimak?  The main reason I am interested in the Ultimak is because it replaces the gas tube, and adds some small amount of stiffness.  My goal is to reduce the stringing I am experiencing as my .308 heats up.

 

It's just a top rail, not a replacement.  I am going to try to get a small riser to get a 1/3 cowitness, but absolute cowitness is not possible with this rail.



#19 Netpackrat

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 04:21 PM

To the best of my knowledge, you're not going to get an absolute co-witness with the Ultimak either, at least not if you use the standard AK sights.



#20 Rhodes1968

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Posted 30 October 2013 - 07:59 PM

If it doesn't co-witness and you can take the top rail off, how is it similar to the Ultimak?  The main reason I am interested in the Ultimak is because it replaces the gas tube, and adds some small amount of stiffness.  My goal is to reduce the stringing I am experiencing as my .308 heats up.

 

That hardly going to correct a condition every rifle ever made suffers.

 

One of the reasons for the rifleman's cadence is to keep the heat down and firepower up. 

Yeah results are a bit mixed but hey what else you going to do?


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#21 Netpackrat

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Posted 31 October 2013 - 11:08 PM

 

If it doesn't co-witness and you can take the top rail off, how is it similar to the Ultimak?  The main reason I am interested in the Ultimak is because it replaces the gas tube, and adds some small amount of stiffness.  My goal is to reduce the stringing I am experiencing as my .308 heats up.

 

That hardly going to correct a condition every rifle ever made suffers.

 

One of the reasons for the rifleman's cadence is to keep the heat down and firepower up. 

Yeah results are a bit mixed but hey what else you going to do?

 

 

I'm willing to try on the chance that I can maybe reduce it a little.  My rifle will put the first 5 shots into 1.5" or less at 100 yards, after the recrown.  But beyond that, it opens up into about a 3MOA gun, and the POI shifts up quite a bit.



#22 cbr

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 08:32 PM

I have a Ultimak and hate it, it defeats one one the best qualities of the AK. Once installed tools and time are required to break the gun down for cleaning. Plus it gets real hot and I mean hot it cooked my EOtech causing reticle to fade completely. 






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