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Why run crap ammo?


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Everybody is dead set on cycling wally bulk ammo. Why? These guns were never intended to fire subpar shells.

If 100 rounds of crap costs $20 and runs like shit. Why not spend the extra $2 on a hundred rounds of Federal Game load?

The game load is max dram and runs like a sewing machine and is also available at Wally world for $5.50 per box of 25

 

Just wondering?

Edited by WhiskeyMinion
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Everybody is dead set on cycling wally bulk ammo. Why? These guns were never intended to fire subpar shells.

If 100 rounds of crap costs $20 and runs like shit. Why not spend the extra $2 on a hundred rounds of Federal Game load?

The game load is max dram and runs like a sewing machine and is also available at Wally world for $5.50 per box of 25

 

Just wondering?

 

The 100 round wal-mart shit does not run like shit in my gun and I would rather save my wallet and my shoulder the pain.

Edited by BOB A. BOOEY
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The game loads are ~$7 a box at my Walmart and the rarely have it. So for me it's cheaper and more available. I tho k a lot of people want 100% reliability with any ammo as well. Dead set? I'm really not. If the local availability were switch for me, I wouldn't care.

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or winchester Xpert steel shot

1325 FPS, cycles fine in my gun and is actually CHEAPER than bulk pack!

bulk is $21/100 win xpert is 4.97/25 = $19.64/100

 

Thats usually what i run and its decent stuff. Its gone from $22 up to $24/100 where i get it at Farm & Fleet. F&F is now carrying the Win Universal 1200fps bulk at $23/100. I also run Estate 1250fps bulk when its cheap enough $60/250.

Mine will run the cheap stuff just fine but i mainly stick to #1 or #4 buckshot and slugs, unless i'm shooting clay. Shooting the dirt is fun with bulk pack and a drum, once in awhile. Stretching out with a slug or wrecking something with some buckshot is much more fun if you ask me.

Edited by Mullet Man
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The 100 round wal-mart shit does not run like shit in my gun and I would rather save my wallet and my shoulder the pain.

It runs decent in mine too but I get an occasional failure every now and then (stock 3 port with no polish or gizmos)

IMHO if an extra .5 dram is too much for your shoulder you have the wrong hobby wink.png

 

I want every weapon that I own to cycle nearly any ammo that is meant to fit the chamber. If it will cycle garbage, then everything else is a given.

I can see where you're coming from, but I see so many people that spend plenty of time and money to run ammo that was never meant to run in these guns. Do all these people running oversized and extra ports with lighter springs and special pucks just never shoot real ammo? It seems like you could over gas pretty severely when you try and run a 3" mag slug or 3" #2 steel or BBB

 

Mine will run the cheap stuff just fine but i mainly stick to #1 or #4 buckshot and slugs, unless i'm shooting clay. Shooting the dirt is fun with bulk pack and a drum, once in awhile. Stretching out with a slug or wrecking something with some buckshot is much more fun if you ask me.

My thoughts exactly, win universal is great for wasting ammo but I'd never use it for any kind of hunting or much of anything besides making noise.

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I want every weapon that I own to cycle nearly any ammo that is meant to fit the chamber. If it will cycle garbage, then everything else is a given.

 

Exactly. I have a gun that shoots a very broad range of ammo without worries. It is hard to think of a more versatile platform. That's useful if the world is ending, if you are being attacked and crap is the first thing at hand, or if in real life: I can go shoot clays with freinds. They will want to use my toys, and they can shoot whatever they bring. I could go hunting or on a trip to do some shooting, and buy whatever the store has and know it will work. I prefer to just have a large stash of my preferred fodder sitting on the shelf, but it isn't a requirement.

 

Plus Cheap is Cheap.

 

You say the platform was never "meant to" run crap..... well I "mean" for it to run everything. Also, the factory advertises it as being able to run all standard velocity 12 ga. ammo- so it should. Advertising also sounds to me like a declaration of intent. We are a bigger customer than the ~30 guys who were issued one in Spetznaz, who says it should all be about them? Americans made most of the things the factory has updated on our own. If their original intent was short sighted, they better get with the game.

Edited by GunFun
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Thank you for the input guys. I'm not trying to stir any pot. Just seeing why so many people are modding their guns to shoot low power ammo when decent ammo is not much more expensive.

 

If you have a gun that borderline runs bulkpack. In SHTF, couldn't you in theory just turn your gas adjuster out another 360 dgrees?

 

Also, any of you that added/enlarged ports to run bulkpack. Do you ever run hotter shells?

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I have an even more important question - where the heck are you guys shooting all these bird-shot shells!?!?!?! there isn't a range (indoor or out) within at least 100 miles of me that allows the use of birdshot. Heck many places don't even allow 00 (if they do, you're limited to just a couple for sighting-in), its slugs or nothing. So if I spend $10,000 on a build or $100, in the end she'll still be a safe queen.

 

I do, however, agree that making it so your gun can run anything is important. If for no other reason a 12G needs to work with all 12G ammo.

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I sunk a whole 20 bux in my gun to get it to run everything so it was worth it.

AGAIN my gun is bone stock accept for the polish job I did to it. I shoot alot so it's the cheap stuff for the blasting and the good stuff for hunting and such.

 

 

No special this or that. just a S12 with the shitty stock and a 24 inch barrel.

No conversion yet. I'll get to that after I send out the F1's to the ATF.

That will give me something to do while I wait to chop the barrel to 12 inches.

Where do I shoot ?

Mainly private property 117 acres or @ a private range with another board member here.

 

My reasons are many, mainly I shoot alot of NFA stuff so it's @ a private setting as no gun range around here allows MG's or 50 bmg. or has the range for the 50.

 

And besides when you bust out the 50 or a suppressor @ the public range ya can't get left alone long enough to shoot due to the questions.

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The 100 round wal-mart shit does not run like shit in my gun and I would rather save my wallet and my shoulder the pain.

It runs decent in mine too but I get an occasional failure every now and then (stock 3 port with no polish or gizmos)

IMHO if an extra .5 dram is too much for your shoulder you have the wrong hobby wink.png

 

I want every weapon that I own to cycle nearly any ammo that is meant to fit the chamber. If it will cycle garbage, then everything else is a given.

I can see where you're coming from, but I see so many people that spend plenty of time and money to run ammo that was never meant to run in these guns. Do all these people running oversized and extra ports with lighter springs and special pucks just never shoot real ammo? It seems like you could over gas pretty severely when you try and run a 3" mag slug or 3" #2 steel or BBB

 

Mine will run the cheap stuff just fine but i mainly stick to #1 or #4 buckshot and slugs, unless i'm shooting clay. Shooting the dirt is fun with bulk pack and a drum, once in awhile. Stretching out with a slug or wrecking something with some buckshot is much more fun if you ask me.

My thoughts exactly, win universal is great for wasting ammo but I'd never use it for any kind of hunting or much of anything besides making noise.

I never run aftermarket springs or modify them. The gas system is regulated. I fire magnum loads as well and would not install AK100 folders on these things if I thought damage was a potential issue. It all depends on where you want to take the platform and what your expectations are. Mine are very high. I do all of the work myself, so expense really isn't a factor for me when it comes to making them run.

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I have an even more important question - where the heck are you guys shooting all these bird-shot shells!?!?!?! there isn't a range (indoor or out) within at least 100 miles of me that allows the use of birdshot. Heck many places don't even allow 00 (if they do, you're limited to just a couple for sighting-in), its slugs or nothing. So if I spend $10,000 on a build or $100, in the end she'll still be a safe queen.

 

Some ranges, Private property, BLM land or National forest. Get a map out and start looking for the green areas :)

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Thank you for the input guys. I'm not trying to stir any pot. Just seeing why so many people are modding their guns to shoot low power ammo when decent ammo is not much more expensive.

 

If you have a gun that borderline runs bulkpack. In SHTF, couldn't you in theory just turn your gas adjuster out another 360 dgrees?

 

Also, any of you that added/enlarged ports to run bulkpack. Do you ever run hotter shells?

I enlarged my ports and intend to still use the occasional 00 and slugs. Haven't tried with the auto plug installed yet.

I had thought about turning the gas plug out another half or full turn but I figured this would only give the gas a larger expansion chamber, reducing the pressure behind the puck, resulting in a weak cycle. I never actually tried it though? Anyone have any insight from trying this before?

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Thank you for the input guys. I'm not trying to stir any pot. Just seeing why so many people are modding their guns to shoot low power ammo when decent ammo is not much more expensive.

 

If you have a gun that borderline runs bulkpack. In SHTF, couldn't you in theory just turn your gas adjuster out another 360 dgrees?

 

Also, any of you that added/enlarged ports to run bulkpack. Do you ever run hotter shells?

I enlarged my ports and intend to still use the occasional 00 and slugs. Haven't tried with the auto plug installed yet.

I had thought about turning the gas plug out another half or full turn but I figured this would only give the gas a larger expansion chamber, reducing the pressure behind the puck, resulting in a weak cycle. I never actually tried it though? Anyone have any insight from trying this before?

 

Just be sure not to shoot yer eye out kid. LOL.

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Because I want to be able to take any 12 gauge that I find and put it in my gun and it work.

 

Then, when it does, I'll turn to the rich guy that has been slamming my gun since he pulled up in his Escalade and say, "Can your Benelli do that?"

 

This.

 

I want every weapon that I own to cycle nearly any ammo that is meant to fit the chamber. If it will cycle garbage, then everything else is a given.

 

Exactly. I have a gun that shoots a very broad range of ammo without worries. It is hard to think of a more versatile platform. That's useful if the world is ending, if you are being attacked and crap is the first thing at hand, or if in real life: I can go shoot clays with freinds. They will want to use my toys, and they can shoot whatever they bring. I could go hunting or on a trip to do some shooting, and buy whatever the store has and know it will work. I prefer to just have a large stash of my preferred fodder sitting on the shelf, but it isn't a requirement.

 

And this.

 

 

I still have mine stock except the UTG rail, some cheap sightmark holo sight. Mine shoots fed bulk and what ever else fed I've ran. I've yet to pick up any Winchester to try, but that is next on my list.

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I want every weapon that I own to cycle nearly any ammo that is meant to fit the chamber. If it will cycle garbage, then everything else is a given.

 

Exactly. I have a gun that shoots a very broad range of ammo without worries. It is hard to think of a more versatile platform. That's useful if the world is ending, if you are being attacked and crap is the first thing at hand, or if in real life: I can go shoot clays with freinds. They will want to use my toys, and they can shoot whatever they bring. I could go hunting or on a trip to do some shooting, and buy whatever the store has and know it will work. I prefer to just have a large stash of my preferred fodder sitting on the shelf, but it isn't a requirement.

I really didn't want to say all of that, but I knew many could read between the lines and see where I was going with it. We are like minded in more ways than we differ.

 

 

 

Here are a few points to consider as well.....

Many people discount birdshot for any type of defense, but none of them will let me shoot them in the gut with birdshot at close range. I have been shot with birdshot at around 500-600 feet and there wasn't much to it beyond the sting, but I'll pass on the close range action.

 

"It will cycle anything" is a better position to be in hard times than "Damn.... I know it won't cycle that. Looks like I'm going bolt action.". Being forced to use birdshot to defend yourself is not ideal, but doing it with a bolt action is much worse. Just my opinion.

 

Because I want to be able to take any 12 gauge that I find and put it in my gun and it work.

 

Then, when it does, I'll turn to the rich guy that has been slamming my gun since he pulled up in his Escalade and say, "Can your Benelli do that?"

 

This.

 

I want every weapon that I own to cycle nearly any ammo that is meant to fit the chamber. If it will cycle garbage, then everything else is a given.

 

Exactly. I have a gun that shoots a very broad range of ammo without worries. It is hard to think of a more versatile platform. That's useful if the world is ending, if you are being attacked and crap is the first thing at hand, or if in real life: I can go shoot clays with freinds. They will want to use my toys, and they can shoot whatever they bring. I could go hunting or on a trip to do some shooting, and buy whatever the store has and know it will work. I prefer to just have a large stash of my preferred fodder sitting on the shelf, but it isn't a requirement.

 

And this.

 

 

I still have mine stock except the UTG rail, some cheap sightmark holo sight. Mine shoots fed bulk and what ever else fed I've ran. I've yet to pick up any Winchester to try, but that is next on my list.

Winchester Universal is my baseline testing ammo, but I do the testing in MD-20s. It is a great ammo so see where your S12 stands.

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If you have a gun that borderline runs bulkpack. In SHTF, couldn't you in theory just turn your gas adjuster out another 360 dgrees?

You should pull the gas block off of your S12 and run the gas regulator in there. Take a look through where the barrel would be coming out of the front of the gas block with the regulator in the #2 position. You will have a better understanding of what is going on there, as far as regulation goes. Another thing to consider is that each thread on that regulator acts like a seal, to some degree. With every turn out, you lose some gas via leakage, assuming it is not heavily fouled yet. Also, you can only use gas that is available. If the amount of gas that is getting through the ports is not enough to cycle it on a wide-open setting, there isn't much more that can be done except friction reduction and resistance reduction. Gas modifications can take reliability further than friction reduction (a clue: gas operated weapon). However, I do recommend friction reduction because it can greatly reduce recoil if done well and will get weapons over "the hump" when they are close to running well. I see FR as more of a refinement. I do not recommend weaker springs or modified springs just because I know insane reliability and low recoil impulse can be achieved with factory springs. Many may disagree.... and probably will.

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Plus, it's kinda embarassing to speak with one's friend about a future shoot and said friend expresses interest in shooting the S-12 so you have to e-mail him a list of ammo that will cycle your gun which he never prints out. Instead he just remembers one thing on the list and when the store is out of that, and they ALWAYS are, he grabs something else that he THOUGHT was on the list, turns out that it wasn't though, and now we're all bored because we can't drum dump the S-12 without dumping an empty hull out of the action every second or third shot. It's a lot easier to just tell him to bring 12 gauge ammo.

 

If you think I only do this with the S-12, you are wrong. All of my weapons cycle what I feed them regardless of case-type, load, whatever, that's the epitome of reliable...

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Id rather spend $20 on 100rd of Cheap bulk to have some range fun than $100 on 100rd decent quality buck. And with the MD-20 & 10rd sticks you tend to go through ammo fairly quickly! anger.gif

 

Actually you can get 250rd case of good quality buck from ~$100 up to ~$170 depending on make and model.

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Id rather spend $20 on 100rd of Cheap bulk to have some range fun than $100 on 100rd decent quality buck. And with the MD-20 & 10rd sticks you tend to go through ammo fairly quickly! anger.gif

 

Actually you can get 250rd case of good quality buck from ~$100 up to ~$170 depending on make and model.

 

Yep, local Cabelas has 25rd packs of 00 & #4 Estate for 13.99 at least once a month.I'm sure you can find much cheaper online. I'm just a local buisness/cash guy, I don't buy off the net if I can help it.

Edited by WhiskeyMinion
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