irishsandman 17 Posted May 18, 2012 Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 So after a lot of hemming and hawing I finally decided to man up and do the bullet guide myself. I bought a punch, a tap handle, cutting fluid, CSS bullet guide kit, and gave it a whirl. After I marked with the punch, my bit actually walked a bit (it took me a second to realize). It wasn't ideal, but I knew the hole would still work, so I finished drilling and then went to use the tap and after reading broken tap stories I went super slow. I got stuck on what had to be the bottom of the hole. Tried to gently back it out and it broke (pretty much flush with the hole, too). So I tried to break it with the punch, no dice. Only options I know of: 1.) I could try to drill in the original mark, but I need tips to make sure I don't walk off target. No drill press, just an old corded drill I use. 2.) I could continue to try to break the tap and use the hole (not ideal in location though). But I need better advice on how to get the tap out. 3.) I could get someone to weld the guide in. The way I look at it, I could do this if I fail #1 or #2 either way. Any advice? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
onehappycampster 25 Posted May 18, 2012 Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 I would probably either get an Omegadrill or one of Walton's tap extractors. If you're confident of your welding skills you could build up with filler rod then weld a bolt head to it and wrench it out. I'd choose the first two over the latter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dad2142Dad 6,559 Posted May 18, 2012 Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 You can use a punch and get it out, should just shatter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
termite 463 Posted May 18, 2012 Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 Sharpen the point of the punch and try to hit the broke tap part at the flutes. Just stay off the steel, the tap will break. Ya ain't gonna weld shit onto the tap and back it out, but there again if you have a EDM in your closest, that would work. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted May 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 You can use a punch and get it out, should just shatter. I tried that like 50 times. what exactly is your technique? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dad2142Dad 6,559 Posted May 18, 2012 Report Share Posted May 18, 2012 Put gloves on, have someone hold the rifle by the barrel with the receiver lying level on something solid (Anvil or Vice), place center punch on whats left the tap and smack it with a small sledge hammer. You can't lightly tap it, give it a good smack. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
themadhatter196 18 Posted May 24, 2012 Report Share Posted May 24, 2012 Huh when I tap my saigas I throw the tap in the drill and just throw some 3in1 on it and go slow with it. I have never had a problem with then breaking or anything. I feel that with the hand tap on smaller things it is easier to break it 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
joshman 4 Posted May 27, 2012 Report Share Posted May 27, 2012 I know a lot of people are going to hate to hear this, but go to your local auto parts store and buy some JB Weld. It will cost you 5 bucks, and you mix the two tubes together and use that stuff to hold your bullet guide in. The same thing happened to me and that is what I ended up doing. I bet it is in there better now. Also I work at a mechanics shop and I know of people who use that stuff in cracks of engines, (which gets very hot) and I have used it on other things with great success. This is way easier than drilling and tapping. When I convert another saiga I will be using JB Weld instead of a drill and tap. Good luck to you sir. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
onehappycampster 25 Posted May 27, 2012 Report Share Posted May 27, 2012 I know a lot of people are going to hate to hear this, but go to your local auto parts store and buy some JB Weld. It will cost you 5 bucks, and you mix the two tubes together and use that stuff to hold your bullet guide in. The same thing happened to me and that is what I ended up doing. I bet it is in there better now. Also I work at a mechanics shop and I know of people who use that stuff in cracks of engines, (which gets very hot) and I have used it on other things with great success. This is way easier than drilling and tapping. When I convert another saiga I will be using JB Weld instead of a drill and tap. Good luck to you sir. That should hold unless it gets as hot as 550 degrees F. I don't see why it should get that hot for any reason though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted May 27, 2012 Report Share Posted May 27, 2012 Anyone that uses cheap filler to hold the BG DESERVES the KB that will occur. The shame is that this will happen some time in the future, like when your son or daughter or wife is shooting it. Joshman you are a MORON. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jbanzai 113 Posted May 27, 2012 Report Share Posted May 27, 2012 I would not use JB weld to secure a BG. Drilling and tapping is just too easy. BUT how could doing this cause a KB? Feed failures when you need it most are what runs through my mind when people suggest this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G O B 3,516 Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 The last damned place in the world to use a cheap plastic product that will fail by cracking, chipping, or crumbling is RIGHT AT the breach of a gun where any such pieces of cheap plastic SHIT will be fed into the chamber WITH a live round. If that is too difficult of a concept for you, then you DESERVE your DARWIN AWARD! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fallschirmjager667 729 Posted May 28, 2012 Report Share Posted May 28, 2012 did you drill the hole all the way through the trunnion? that's what you are supposed to do, drill it all the way through, soak the tap in oil and go really slow, i mean really fucking slow 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted May 30, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 30, 2012 did you drill the hole all the way through the trunnion? that's what you are supposed to do, drill it all the way through, soak the tap in oil and go really slow, i mean really fucking slow yeah, I did that. I dunno if it got hung up on metal shavings at the bottom of the hole or what. I was taking my sweet time, tap handle and everything (my drill is corded and old and really only goes fast so I decided not to use it). I felt it stick on a quarter turn I was doing and then I tried to gently back it out and it snapped when I was trying to get better leverage on it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MyGrassIsBlue05 14 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 The last damned place in the world to use a cheap plastic product that will fail by cracking, chipping, or crumbling is RIGHT AT the breach of a gun where any such pieces of cheap plastic SHIT will be fed into the chamber WITH a live round. If that is too difficult of a concept for you, then you DESERVE your DARWIN AWARD! Ok, but seriously..why don't you tell us how you really feel? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
onehappycampster 25 Posted June 11, 2012 Report Share Posted June 11, 2012 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brian M1 50 Posted June 19, 2012 Report Share Posted June 19, 2012 I know a lot of people are going to hate to hear this, but go to your local auto parts store and buy some JB Weld. It will cost you 5 bucks, and you mix the two tubes together and use that stuff to hold your bullet guide in. The same thing happened to me and that is what I ended up doing. I bet it is in there better now. Also I work at a mechanics shop and I know of people who use that stuff in cracks of engines, (which gets very hot) and I have used it on other things with great success. This is way easier than drilling and tapping. When I convert another saiga I will be using JB Weld instead of a drill and tap. Good luck to you sir. That should hold unless it gets as hot as 550 degrees F. I don't see why it should get that hot for any reason though. +1. At 550 degrees, any lube you'd have in the gun would cook, the parts would start to fuse together, and the stock and forearm would be putty. I don't think AK operating temps would do ANYTHING to JB weld. However... I'm not sure the JB would do well with the constant changing temps with added repetitive impacts (although small ones). People HAVE used this method, though, and it has worked. For how long? Who knows? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mikebaker1129 19 Posted July 8, 2012 Report Share Posted July 8, 2012 Bust the tap out with a punch like has allready been suggested . Then go buy a new good quality tap .Go no more than 1/4 turn back off to break the chips,then 1/4 turn then back off and so on . Keeps lots of oil on the tap. This method works. You cannot back it off and on too many times. Taps are hard and brittle,it should shatter like a piece of glass with a blow placed in the proper spot,usually on the side. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brian M1 50 Posted July 14, 2012 Report Share Posted July 14, 2012 I'll add to this that I think drilling/tapping (or drilling/bolting with locking nut) is probably better than any epoxy (such as JB) even if epoxy DID hold, simply for being able to REPLACE the bullet guide easily. I ordered a BG (not installed yet, as my SGM's are going strong) but I ordered TWO. That way, if one chips/breaks, I can simply unscrew the old, and drop in the new, identical, one (why ordering TWO exact ones, at same time to avoid design/hole changes, seems important to me). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thebuns1 4,323 Posted July 14, 2012 Report Share Posted July 14, 2012 (edited) wow. i guess im a fucking genius. i never have a problem putting a bullet guide in. maybe i have more patience than most. its not fuckin rocket science. go slow. it takes about 10 minutes going slow. you should only turn the tap around a 1/3 of a turn at a time. i did it with a pair of vice grips holding my tap. its not hard man. im sorry that you had trouble, but not sorry that you rushed it nature gave us brains for a reason. edit: but so long as the hole is deep enough for the screw, i wouldnt worry about it. Edited July 14, 2012 by Captain Hero Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted July 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2012 wow. i guess im a fucking genius. i never have a problem putting a bullet guide in. maybe i have more patience than most. its not fuckin rocket science. go slow. it takes about 10 minutes going slow. you should only turn the tap around a 1/3 of a turn at a time. i did it with a pair of vice grips holding my tap. its not hard man. im sorry that you had trouble, but not sorry that you rushed it nature gave us brains for a reason. edit: but so long as the hole is deep enough for the screw, i wouldnt worry about it. jesus, sorry the educational system failed you and never taught you how to fucking read and understand what you've read. as I said . . . so I finished drilling and then went to use the tap and after reading broken tap stories I went super slow. you dumb fuck. why the fuck do people come on here so long after a post, offer NO relevant new information, act like arrogant pricks, and STILL get the facts wrong. weird. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted July 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2012 I feel like I should also add that people are complaining about broken taps from kits left and right and there's speculation that CSS got a bad batch of them. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skiluvr03 24 Posted July 16, 2012 Report Share Posted July 16, 2012 I feel like I should also add that people are complaining about broken taps from kits left and right and there's speculation that CSS got a bad batch of them. Don't let any of the smart-assed, shit-don't-stink, best-thing-that-ever-happened-to-guns, arrogant mofo's, get under your skin, lol; there is only a handful around here that I noticed; most are good people that really want to help. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted July 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 I feel like I should also add that people are complaining about broken taps from kits left and right and there's speculation that CSS got a bad batch of them. Don't let any of the smart-assed, shit-don't-stink, best-thing-that-ever-happened-to-guns, arrogant mofo's, get under your skin, lol; there is only a handful around here that I noticed; most are good people that really want to help. Yeah, I've been around since December 2010 (and I lurked for a while before that). it didn't get to me at all, but I don't take shit from someone like that. sure, sometimes I deserve it, but that wasn't one of them! Cheers! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thebuns1 4,323 Posted July 17, 2012 Report Share Posted July 17, 2012 wow. i guess im a fucking genius. i never have a problem putting a bullet guide in. maybe i have more patience than most. its not fuckin rocket science. go slow. it takes about 10 minutes going slow. you should only turn the tap around a 1/3 of a turn at a time. i did it with a pair of vice grips holding my tap. its not hard man. im sorry that you had trouble, but not sorry that you rushed it nature gave us brains for a reason. edit: but so long as the hole is deep enough for the screw, i wouldnt worry about it. jesus, sorry the educational system failed you and never taught you how to fucking read and understand what you've read. as I said . . . so I finished drilling and then went to use the tap and after reading broken tap stories I went super slow. you dumb fuck. why the fuck do people come on here so long after a post, offer NO relevant new information, act like arrogant pricks, and STILL get the facts wrong. weird. sorry, guess you cant take sarcasm very well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
onehappycampster 25 Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 You never can tell what kind of person is on the other end, typing, can you? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted July 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 wow. i guess im a fucking genius. i never have a problem putting a bullet guide in. maybe i have more patience than most. its not fuckin rocket science. go slow. it takes about 10 minutes going slow. you should only turn the tap around a 1/3 of a turn at a time. i did it with a pair of vice grips holding my tap. its not hard man. im sorry that you had trouble, but not sorry that you rushed it nature gave us brains for a reason. edit: but so long as the hole is deep enough for the screw, i wouldnt worry about it. jesus, sorry the educational system failed you and never taught you how to fucking read and understand what you've read. as I said . . . so I finished drilling and then went to use the tap and after reading broken tap stories I went super slow. you dumb fuck. why the fuck do people come on here so long after a post, offer NO relevant new information, act like arrogant pricks, and STILL get the facts wrong. weird. sorry, guess you cant take sarcasm very well. being condescending =/= sarcasm. I'm dying to know what part of your reply you think was just "sarcastic," Would you be willing to elaborate? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thebuns1 4,323 Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 wow. i guess im a fucking genius. but not sorry that you rushed it nature gave us brains for a reason. sarcasm and ambilvalence are the hardest things to get across in text. i wasn trying to be a total dick. and if i came across that way than my bad. at times i fail to inform others that im fuckin with them, and thats on me. but under the circumstances, thats about the best i can do man. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
irishsandman 17 Posted July 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 wow. i guess im a fucking genius. but not sorry that you rushed it nature gave us brains for a reason. sarcasm and ambilvalence are the hardest things to get across in text. i wasn trying to be a total dick. and if i came across that way than my bad. at times i fail to inform others that im fuckin with them, and thats on me. but under the circumstances, thats about the best i can do man. I'm eager to never have to have flak with someone (especially on a damn gun forum of all places) so I'm completely willing to bury the hatchet on this one. I have to say, I have a pretty good ability to comprehend what others are writing, though (if I said why it would come off as arrogant, so I won't) and I still don't get the point of your original comment (ambivalence perhaps, but maybe you didn't realize how it came across?). I dunno, I actually think you're a good contributor to a lot of conversations on here, so I really was surprised and am completely willing to move on. after all, you have a sweet avatar pic that makes it hard to stay mad at ya. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
thebuns1 4,323 Posted July 18, 2012 Report Share Posted July 18, 2012 its all good negro. at times i can get drunk and can be pretty bitter, and it can result in the above statements being made, but like i said,i wasnt trying to come across as an arrogant ass. but im sure thats how you took it, cuz after reading it, i would have got he same impression. so its cool. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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