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mastalee103

saiga 12 suppressors... cadiz gun works vs red jacket firearms?

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hello everyone. new to the forum, first post.

 

currently contemplating a suppressor for saiga 12. looking at cadiz gun works and red jacket.

 

pros to cadiz suppressor:

its 10.5 inches compared to red jackets 15"

at 1 lb 6 oz also lighter than red jackets 2lbs

at $800 cheaper than red jackets $900.

can be fitted to most barrel lengths. rjf suppressors only fitted to shorti's.

 

pros to red jacket:

considered the industry standard in terms of saiga 12 suppressors.

considered reliable among industry leaders.

highly effective in reducing db levels compared to cadiz which is really used for reducing recoil instead of sound.

can have it integrally built.

 

this is just my two cents on the products. both seem like great products and would like to see what others think about the suppressors. Any feedback would be much appreciated. thank you for your time.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGYThnZRC7c

 

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My experience has only been with Tom's setup (that I think was a prototype). I'd love to try final production units though, from both places.

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For what it costs to buy one already made, I'm not interested in taking that big of a gamble on whether or not it will perform to my liking. However, I am heavily considering sending out a Form 1 to build one myself. The mounting system and baffle design will be like nothing that I have seen, and if the mounting system works as intended, it will be an extremely quick attaching suppressor. My biggest concern is the weight of the mount and baffle designs, but I have a way to "wash" some of that. I wake up thinking about this type of thing almost every day.

 

I've handled the RJ can and didn't care for it. It is not compact.

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Seems the redjacket is being tested first with standard loads, or even heavy loads ( look at ejection) then low recoil loads with the suppressor.

 

The CGW looks like the same ammo used in both tests.

 

What I don't understand is why the industry standard Bruel & Kjær 2209 meter is not used to give more accurate levels for these products.

 

Different loads, even in the same test, and different camera's, shooting in different angles I feel is really misleading .

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Just FYI, if you don't already own a suppressor keep in mind that neither one will be silent. Or even hearing safe for that matter. Shotguns are loud. Its really up to you to decide if the decibel reduction is worth the expense.

 

I did a quick review of my CGW suppressor here:http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/77723-tromix-s17-cgw-suppressor-100-win/&do=findComment&comment=769506

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I don't understand the point. If it doesn't silence the shot to at least hearing-safe, then it doesn't seem like it has a purpose. It's just a heavy piece of metal on the end of your gun for other people to drool over at the range....

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I don't understand the point. If it doesn't silence the shot to at least hearing-safe, then it doesn't seem like it has a purpose. It's just a heavy piece of metal on the end of your gun for other people to drool over at the range....

 

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you. you might as well screw a hollow tube at the end of your S-12 for all the good those do, and it will cost you under 10 bucks and no tax.

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"A hollow tube"? Come on guys don't be ridiculous.

 

 

If you don't want one then don't get one. Most suppressors are not hearing safe. Dropping the level of noise and blast on any firearm is beneficial. There are other benefits to suppressor use as well, you can Google it if you feel like learning cause I'm not gonna enumerate them here. God I hate having to justify myself to the internet.

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"A hollow tube"? Come on guys don't be ridiculous.

 

 

If you don't want one then don't get one. Most suppressors are not hearing safe. Dropping the level of noise and blast on any firearm is beneficial. There are other benefits to suppressor use as well, you can Google it if you feel like learning cause I'm not gonna enumerate them here. God I hate having to justify myself to the internet.

 

Beneficial, but not practical in this case. I do not intend to get one, and I was expressing my distaste for something so expensive without a purpose.

 

From the Wiki on supressors:

 

There are many advantages in using a suppressor that are not related to the sound.

Hunters using centerfire rifles find suppressors bring various important benefits that outweigh the extra weight and resulting change in the firearm's center of gravity. The most important advantage of a suppressor is the hearing protection for the shooter as well as his/her companions. There are many hunters who have suffered permanent hearing damage due to someone else firing a high-caliber gun too closely without a warning. By reducing noise, recoil and muzzle-blast, it also enables the firer to follow through calmly on his first shot and fire a further carefully aimed shot without delay if necessary. Wildlife of all kinds are often confused as to the direction of the source of a well-suppressed shot. In the field, however, the comparatively large size of a centerfire rifle suppressor can cause unwanted noise if it bumps or rubs against vegetation or rocks, and many users cover them with neoprene sleeves.

Suppressors reduce firing recoil significantly, primarily by diverting and trapping the propellant gas. Propellant gas is generally a fraction of the projectile mass, but it exits the muzzle at multiples of the projectile velocity, and since recoil energy is a function of mass times velocity squared the elimination of the propellant recoil can be significant. Paulson et al., discussing low-velocity pistol calibers, suggest the recoil reduction is around 15%.[2] With high-velocity calibers recoil reduction runs in the range of 20–30%.[22] The added weight of the suppressor—normally 300 to 500 grams—also contributes to the reduction of the recoil. Further, the pressure against the face of each baffle is higher than the pressure on its reverse side, making each baffle a miniature "pneumatic ram" which pulls the suppressor forward on the weapon, contributing a counter recoil force.

A suppressor also cools the hot gases coming out of the barrel enough that most of the lead-laced vapor that leaves the barrel condenses inside the suppressor, reducing the amount of lead that might be inhaled by the shooter and others around them. However, in auto-loading actions this might be offset by increased back pressure which results in propellant gas blowing back into a shooter's face through the chamber during case ejection.

 

 

Very little of that has anything to do with beneficial use on a shotgun.

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I'm seeing what you're saying and I'm respecting your opinion, I'm just trying to also point out that it does have a purpose. I paid $600 for mine and it does suppress so I'm pretty happy with the cost versus performance. Read that Wiki quote again, I believe some of that does apply.

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