all the 10mm fans

[dashowdy 141]

I had recently e-mailed smith and wesson too request that they build a 10mm M&P handgun. They have not made one in a while and seeing as how they are a direct competitor with glock they should step up and put out a 10mm handgun. Here is the response I got from S&W.

 

 

 

I just wanted too e-mail and say how much I love smith and wessons firearms, I have 2 M&P 9mm's and an M&P 15-22 rifle and hopefully a sport at some point. Anyway I love them all but my main love is my glock 20 10mm I love the cartridge and the sensation when shooting it, I dont mind the glock it is ok I can live with it but I had a thought the other day.

 

Smith and Wesson is famous for there 10mm handguns and have not done a 10mm handgun in a while. In short I thought I would throw the idea too you guys to make a M&P 10mm handgun preferably in a 4.25 inch model and a 5 inch longslide version for hunting, It would be nice to have a couple of recoil springs to go with it 17 lb. for 10mm lite and an extra 22 lb. spring for the nuclear loads, besides the M&P already has a steel guide rod giving it immediate advantage over the glock, as well as the standard rifling which is much friendlier for reloaders which several people shooting 10mm fall in that category. I am a big fan of the 1006 and the 1076 and rarely see one as they are discontinued now. In short it would be nice to see a beefed up M&P with the 10mm cartridge because I love M&P's and the 10mm round if I could combine the two I would never buy another glock handgun.

 

thank you for you time, sincerely, matthew smith

loyal customer since I could buy firearms. Reply | Reply to all | Forward | Print | Delete | Show original

<a href="https://mail.google.com/mail/h/1xwxps4smpmrr/?&redir=?%26v%3Dc%26d%3Du%26n%3D0%26th%3D139bb13446455c30&a=st&at=AF6bupMTIKcFvWB-hm57foin-C2qInQVvQ&m=139bb13446455c30#m_139bb13446455c30">

Degray, Don

<ddegray@smith-wesson.com> Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 11:22 AM To: matthew smith <mgsmith1987@gmail.com>

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Matthew,

Over the years S&W has produced different 10mm firearms and they were not very popular. They are nice guns but we have to make what is in demand.

Maybe someday they will put that model on the production schedule.

Don

[timy 1,185]

Well, what he said was true ya know.

[Syndicate 812]

ya sadly, 10mm is awesome, but they always seem to be in the trailing sales category.

[BuffetDestroyer 969]

10mm is absolutely superior to 40S&W ballistically, but it is longer and gives a heavier kick than most people want to handle in a compact carry or defensive handgun. IMO, the .45 ACP is a gentle push where even the 40S&W is snappy and the 10mm even more so. The larger frame is the biggest complaint that Glock gets on their 10mm and 45 pistols.

 

I do like the 10mm and don't mind the larger frames, but won't likely ever own one due to the high cost of ammo. If the ammo support and availability was there, more people would likely adopt the round.

 

Say what you want about Glock, but they are probably the biggest manufacturer keeping the 10mm cartridge alive at all.

[mostholycerebus 415]

Only if they make a 10mm Sigma.

[dashowdy 141]

I dont hate my glock it is a fine weapon and I am glad at least some firearms manufacturers care about the 10mm. I find compared to the 40 it is snappy but the extra heft of the G20 more than makes it manageable and follow up shots are easy enough. I still carry the G20 most of the time with 155 gr. gold dots going 1500 fps, if that is not a manstopper than I dont know what is in a semi-auto handgun.

 

As far as price it is expensive in that respect but it is probably no more expensive too manufacture than 45 acp as far as materials and all. Either way if the message gets some of the higher ups and designers thinking about it that is good enough for me. The 10mm has a following for sure and maybe smith and wesson will see that, until then I am happy as a clam with my G20.

[filthygovemploye 64]

i was hopin this was gonna be a thread on how to shoot it in a 410 saiga.... i do dig the m and ps. think i will buy a delta elite in 10 though. the name is more badder ass

[Syndicate 812]

EAA Witness in 10mm

[YOT 3,743]

Only if they make a 10mm Sigma.

 

I would ADORE a 10mm Kel-Tec Sub2000.

[Syndicate 812]

if HK didn't triple in price...

[Arik 565]

I had 2 10mm for a short time. A S&W 1006 and G20. Ehh...not for me. Waaay too expansive to shoot and it doesny really do anything other guns don't do. Cant hunt with a handgun in Pa, no woods with wildlife larger then deer near me. Black bears are an hour + away. I go there twice a year and even then i have some sort of a 30cal

[dashowdy 141]

I had 2 10mm for a short time. A S&W 1006 and G20. Ehh...not for me. Waaay too expansive to shoot and it doesny really do anything other guns don't do. Cant hunt with a handgun in Pa, no woods with wildlife larger then deer near me. Black bears are an hour + away. I go there twice a year and even then i have some sort of a 30cal

 

I disagree here the 10mm gives you above 357 power and below standard 41 mag but with 15 shots, that just rules in my book plus I reload so ammo cost is not huge once I get my brass built up besides I buy Gold dots in any flavor for 30 a box of 50 which is no more expensive than 45.

[thebuns1 4,323]

I dont mind the 10mm. Im just not a velocity junkie for defensive/combat handguns. I prefer the heavier bullets. Dont get me wrong, there has to be a good balance between the two for a catridge to be effective, but I prefer the heavier bullets. Even if I have to sacrifice a chunk of velocity.

 

The way I try to explain to newbs is this. The .500 Smith has a 500 gr. load that moves at 1400 fps. Kinda slow for the size of the cartridge, but compared to the 300 gr. loads its rather slow, but almost doubles the stopping power. Dont confuse that with ft.lbs of energy. The lighter load will produce higher numbers, but the heavier load will be more effective at stopping the target. Such as a Grizzly.

 

The 10 is a good round though. I never got into it after shooting one, as I never really feel it gave me much benefit over the .45. a bit faster, and a bit flatter shooting, but that was all I really noticed.

 

I just like heavier bullets.

Edited September 15, 2012 by Captain Hero

[Voltia 375]

I don't mean to be harsh, but, next time you send an official correspondence somewhere,

have a proofreader read it first. You had something like 25 grammatical and/or spelling errors

in that email. I don't mean to diminish your efforts, nor your goal, but, whenever you contact

customer service anywhere, you need to know that their first job is to blow you off.

 

Appearing uneducated is the first chance you give them to blow you off. Many people, especially

hard-working, salt-of-the-earth types, believe the oral communication and the handshake is still king,

and written stuff is just meaningless, so there is no need to try to be correct. Unfortunately, if it

isn't written down, it pretty much didn't happen these days, so written communication is king.

 

Short version, you may have gotten a better response with a better letter.

[dashowdy 141]

I don't mean to be harsh, but, next time you send an official correspondence somewhere,

have a proofreader read it first. You had something like 25 grammatical and/or spelling errors

in that email. I don't mean to diminish your efforts, nor your goal, but, whenever you contact

customer service anywhere, you need to know that their first job is to blow you off.

 

Appearing uneducated is the first chance you give them to blow you off. Many people, especially

hard-working, salt-of-the-earth types, believe the oral communication and the handshake is still king,

and written stuff is just meaningless, so there is no need to try to be correct. Unfortunately, if it

isn't written down, it pretty much didn't happen these days, so written communication is king.

 

Short version, you may have gotten a better response with a better letter.

 

Kiss my grammatically incorrect ass, I wrote that 2 sheets to the wind.

[Voltia 375]

Uh, congratulations?

[Brian M1 50]

10mm would make an awesome carbine rifle. A .40 is nothing more than a neutured 10mm. It is a 10mm "short". Sadly, most commercial loads for 10mm are made "shy". That means that they are made to appease the .40 crowd, A REAL 10mm is an awesome powerhouse. Personally, I'm not impressed with .40. I thinks it's a joke. I perfer 9mm. The .40 have NEVER proven better than the 9mm, and 9mm is so much more common. .40 is like the answer to a question that no one asked. 10mm (REAL full load), on the other hand, is a serious roiund. Yes, it would make an AWESOME carbine round, but there are already rounds in place that mathc (or better) it's ballistics. As a handgun round, 10mm is hard to beat, but in a rifle?... there are better (commonly available) rounds that match (or better) those ballistics.

A bit of history for ya here: the fbi went with the 10mm for it's better "effectivenes" but then realized that it was too hot a load for most "average" shooters. so it watered it down with the .40 (10mm SHORT). So the fbi wound up with nothing more than a HOT 9mm. But, as government is.. they refuse to give up on their initial plan... so they stick with it. Thus... the .40 it is. An overpressured 9mm, and underpowered 10mm. Best of neither. If they were a normal corp, they would have gone back to the 9mm.. but this is govt where talking about.... so they stuck with the .40 (neutured 10mm). Meanwhile most of the police agencies have recogocnized the "short" comings of the .40 and moved back to the 9mm. Basically, a .40 offers more recoil, ZERO more effectiveness, and less round count. A true 10mm offers WAY better ballistics but REAL 10mm rounds are hard to find anymore (most are watered down to .40 ballsitics)..

[dashowdy 141]

Yes a 10mm carbine with a 30rd magazine would be tits man, imagine a 16 inch mp5 clone or even the kel tec sub 2k design but with 10mm full powerhouse loads. 180 gr. @ 1500 fps would be gnarly. Still not in 44 mag territory yet but would make one hell of a woods gun. Now if only I had an engineer and a machine shop.

Edited September 17, 2012 by dashowdy

[YOT 3,743]

Yes a 10mm carbine with a 30rd magazine would be tits man, imagine a 16 inch mp5 clone or even the kel tec sub 2k design but with 10mm full powerhouse loads. 180 gr. @ 1500 fps would be gnarly. Still not in 44 mag territory yet but would make one hell of a woods gun. Now if only I had an engineer and a machine shop.

 

Put me on the waiting list for one. In the first production run actually!

[Syndicate 812]

a few locals are working on a 10mm AR upper, I'm giong to help them as much as I can.

[chicagosfinest 26]

Xdm is coming out with a 10mm

[filthygovemploye 64]

Xdm is coming out with a 10mm

 

link?

[dashowdy 141]

Not a fan of the XDM and seeing that they are tall guns, with high bore axis, I hope springfield throws some heft on the frame to handle the full power loads. Dont get me wrong great gun, seems to work well and has a lot of good features, just not my cup of tea.

 

Thats why I would like an M&P so bad in 10mm, S&W makes a very nice frame very stout and balanced much better than glock imo. But hey if springfield gets into it then maybe smith will follow they are all direct competitors.

 

 

I am gonna call kel-tec and see if a 10mm version of there 40 s&w sub 2000 guns would be possible if you could get the gunsmith to lengthen the chamber and is there enough there to do this, if not could a gunsmith do it.10mm I think is only .32 of an inch longer than 40 so were not talking alot here.

 

 

I saw the mechtech kits that use glocks on something like an ar-15 upper, wonder if those are any good.

Edited September 17, 2012 by dashowdy

[YOT 3,743]

I'm thinking the pressure is going to be drastically more fore the 10mm than a .40. I'd be afraid of a kaboom trying it with a standard Sub2000 barrel. For a 180gr. XTP bullet there is 1500 PSI more pressure units, if that means anything, with 166 more FPS.

Edited September 18, 2012 by Yeoldetool

[ManOnTheHIll 13]

Thureon Defense makes pistol caliber carbines that accept Glock magazines in10mm, 9mm, .40 S&W, .45ACp, & .357 sig. I have one in 9mm and it's a hoot!

 

http://www.thureondefense.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1&Itemid=4

 

Here's a couple of photos of mine:

 

 

 

They are not that well known but I am very impressed with the firearm and their customer service is great.

[ManOnTheHIll 13]

I saw the mechtech kits that use glocks on something like an ar-15 upper, wonder if those are any good.

 

Not sure about the MechTech 10mm kits but the 9mm kits could only shoot +p loads, that and the fact that you have to take apart one of your handguns to build it turned me off from the MechTech.

Edited September 18, 2012 by ManOnTheHIll

[timy 1,185]

10mm would make an awesome carbine rifle. A .40 is nothing more than a neutured 10mm. It is a 10mm "short". Sadly, most commercial loads for 10mm are made "shy". That means that they are made to appease the .40 crowd, A REAL 10mm is an awesome powerhouse. Personally, I'm not impressed with .40. I thinks it's a joke. I perfer 9mm. The .40 have NEVER proven better than the 9mm, and 9mm is so much more common. .40 is like the answer to a question that no one asked. 10mm (REAL full load), on the other hand, is a serious roiund. Yes, it would make an AWESOME carbine round, but there are already rounds in place that mathc (or better) it's ballistics. As a handgun round, 10mm is hard to beat, but in a rifle?... there are better (commonly available) rounds that match (or better) those ballistics.

A bit of history for ya here: the fbi went with the 10mm for it's better "effectivenes" but then realized that it was too hot a load for most "average" shooters. so it watered it down with the .40 (10mm SHORT). So the fbi wound up with nothing more than a HOT 9mm. But, as government is.. they refuse to give up on their initial plan... so they stick with it. Thus... the .40 it is. An overpressured 9mm, and underpowered 10mm. Best of neither. If they were a normal corp, they would have gone back to the 9mm.. but this is govt where talking about.... so they stuck with the .40 (neutured 10mm). Meanwhile most of the police agencies have recogocnized the "short" comings of the .40 and moved back to the 9mm. Basically, a .40 offers more recoil, ZERO more effectiveness, and less round count. A true 10mm offers WAY better ballistics but REAL 10mm rounds are hard to find anymore (most are watered down to .40 ballsitics)..

 

Yours is just another opinion on the never ending subject of the ideal round. I do find it amusing that people can almost express hatred for an inanimate object, but whatever.

 

I use both 40 and 9mm depending on the circumstances and situation. In a full size Sig 226 or Beretta PX4 I prefer 40 caliber over 9mm. I've never had a problem with the 'snappiness' I hear mentioned when doing double taps and hammer pairs and neither do my wife and daughter in law. I can only surmise from that that it isn't overly significant.

 

In concealed carry, I prefer 9mm simply because it's a less bulky package. However, I much prefer shooting the XD40 Subcompacts of the daughter in law and her father. They're more accurate and far more comfortable than my PF9. Then again, I realize the Kel-Tec is a single purpose gun and does that purpose very well.

 

Next up I plan on getting a P3AT Kel-Tec. There was a time I would never even consider a 380 but that time is behind me. I find pocket carry very appealing these days and promise not to try any 1000 yard shots. Or 500, or 100, or 25 even. Close encounters only.

 

Anyway, not trying to lecture you, just giving another opinion on an issue that will never be settled. That's fine though. I like having a lot of choices since there are a lot of preferences out there.

[Marc 147]

SAAMI max pressure for 10mm is 37,500 psi, only 2500 psi over the .40 short & wimpy (35,000 psi)

 

http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/205.pdf