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RJF's Failing Customer Service.


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#1 GySgt New River

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 07:37 PM

Red Jacket and Customer Service


This is a detailed log of my dealings with Red Jacket Firearms (RJF), warranty repair and customer service. First I will give you a chronological order of email and/or telephone conversations I had with RJF. Secondly, I will give you the outcome of the work on my weapon.

Names, phone numbers, email addresses and my serial # have been changed to protect private information.

Enjoy,
GySgt New River

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2012 08:36
From: GYSgt New River
Subject: ZKMR needs repair.
To: rjf@redjacketfirearms.com

Sir/Ma'am,

Good morning. I purchased a ZKMR short barrel rifle (serial #XXXX) from you back in late 2009 and took possession of it in mid 2010. Since I took possession I have put no more than a few hundred rounds through this weapon however I have noticed something VERY alarming. Where the rear plate is welded to the receiver to allow the folding stock to be mounted there is a fracture in the weld almost all the way around two to three sides. I noticed this yesterday when I took it out shooting and immediately stopped firing the weapon. I plan on shipping this back to you for repair as soon as possible and would like to know the approximate turn-around time and if I could get a reference number so that I have a way of tracking this issue once the weapon is out of my hands and in yours. Thank you for your time, assistance and consideration in this matter. I look forward to hearing from you at your earlist convience. Personal email is XXX at gmail.com or cell # 123-456-7891 or respond to this email. Semper Fi!

GySgt New River


Date: Sat, 04 Aug 2012 10:55
From: rjf@redjacketfirearms.com
To: GySgt New River
Subject: ZKMR needs repair.

GYSGT. NEW RIVER

I'm sorry to hear about your troubles with the weapon. Of course, we will fix it as soon as possible. If you could email me back with your address that the weapon will be shipped from and returned too and I will generate a label for pick up. When you pack it up make sure to include a detailed list of problems that you have with your build. Turn around time can take up to a month in most cases. Thank you!

James M. Dunford

Shipping Manager

--------------------------
On August 7th Mr. Dunford provided a PRE-PAID Shipping label for which I was able to ship and track my weapon back to RJF for warranty repair. Relatively fast communication and I was extremely happy I was not out of pocket on shipping costs. Great job Mr. Dunford!!
--------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2012 13:51
From: GySgt New River
To: Mr. Dunford

Mr. Dunford,

Good afternoon. The SBR shipped this afternoon with a list of needed repairs (our emails), my 5320.20 showing my permanent "SHIP TO" address and your FFL. Shipping Date/Time: Mon 13 AUG 2012 at 12:37PM.

Thank you again for all your assistance in this matter and look forward to receiving my SBR back so that I can continue having fun shooting.


Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2012 13:11
From: Mr. Dunford
To: GySgt New River

I have received your rifle and we will begin repairs immediately.

James M. Dunford

Shipping Manager


Date: Thu, 16 Aug 2012 14:30
From: GySgt New River
To: Mr. Dunford

I know you stated in the original email chain that the average turn-around time is 30 days but since you stated below that repairs will be started immediately when might I expect it returned?

Thanks again


Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2012 08:29
From: Mr. Dunford
To: GySgt New River

It will still be about 30 Days..

James M. Dunford

Shipping Manager


Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2012 11:29
From: GySgt New River
To: Mr. Dunford

Sir,

Good afternoon. May I get status update please?

Thanks.


Respectfully,
GySgt New River


Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2012 11:29
From: Mr. Dunford
To: GySgt New River

I forwarded your message to out status checks department. dennis@redjacketfirearms.com is his email for the future! Hope this message finds you well.

James M. Dunford

Shipping Manager


Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2012 15:39
From: GySgt New River
To: Mr. Dunford, dennis (status check employee)

Gentlemen and anyone else concerned,

It has been just about a month and a half, you received it Aug 16, since you stated you had received my weapon at Red Jacket. I was told that it would be about a 30 day turn-around time however I'm more than a little concerned with the level of customer service that I have received up until this point and the fact that you have my weapon still. Mr. Dunford was, and has, done everything in his power to assist me with the status of my weapon however that is not his main focus and after several emails and phone calls all I get is the same B.S. answer and that is I have to wait up to 72 hours before I can expect a reply from someone. Well 72 hours has come and gone several times over and frankly it's getting old and I want an answer now. Additionally, I have tried to contact Mr. Hayden numerous times on the Red Jacket Firearms web site on the Saiga forum. Again, the same broken record...absolutely zero answers in reply. Let it be known that I will publish every single email, and piece of correspondence, that I have received to date in an effort to show any "would-be" customers how problems are handled at this establishment. If you feel the need please forward this to Mr. Hayden.

The above situation is disappointing to say the very least but I guess I just had higher expectations for Red Jacket.

In the CC line you will find my personal email addresses please feel free to reply to me and regardless of where I am at I will be able to view and respond as needed.


Respectfully,
GySgt New River


Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2012 16:23
From: dennis (status check employee)
To: GySgt New River

GySgt New River,

The issues with your weapon have been corrected and it has had its first coat of a new paint job. After curing and more coats it should be ready to go out either at the end of this week or the first of next. I called and left a message for you this afternoon before i received this email. Sorry for the inconvenience and delays, thank you for your business.

Dennis/RJF


Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2012 15:39
From: GySgt New River
To: dennis (status check employee)

Dennis,

Sorry I missed you call but I was out of the office. You can call my cell as needed (123) 456-7891 as this is the easiest way to get in contact with me.

I do appreciate your response to my email as Mr. Dunford has been the only one I have been in contact with up until this point. I look forward to another email at the end of this week or the first of next, as you stated, informing me that my weapon is ready to ship.

Thank you for your time.


Respectfully,
GySgt New River


Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2012 11:48
From: GySgt New River
To: dennis (status check employee)

Sir,

Good afternoon. Per our last telephone conversation you stated that my rifle needed a few more coats of paint, and cure time, still. However, you also stated that it should be ready to ship out no later than the end of this week. Being that today is Friday I eagerly await your status response on my weapon.

Thank you.


Respectfully,
GySgt New River


Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2012 12:47
From: dennis (status check employee)
To: GySgt New River


GySgt New River,
I've lost 2.5 days of painting this week due to our compressor motor going out and parts having to be shipped in. Its back up and running as of 30min ago and the rifle should be ready first of next week.

Thanks for your business and your patience, Dennis RJF



>>> END OF CURRENT EMAIL CHAIN <<<

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

DATE: Sat, 06 Oct 2012

I guess I will have to wait till next week so see if my weapon in the mail...but I've heard that many times before. Whenever my weapon does come in I will post pictures of the completed work and my opinion as to the quality of the repairs.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2012

So I expected to NOT get an email, or call, on Monday regarding that status of my weapon being that it was a holiday but Tuesday and Wednesday have also passed without any status update. Failing customer service is a CLEAR indication, IMHO, of a failing business. Sadly I do not expect great things from RJF anymore.

My weapon has been with you since August 16th...WHATS GOING ON??!!


Respectfully,
Gunny New River (aka a "Once Proud RJF Owner.")

---------------


Date: Thur, 11 Oct 2012

Dennis,

Being that RJF is two hours ahead of Arizona time I feel that I have given you ample time to respond to my status request from yesterday. HOWEVER, once again this work day has almost passed by without any answer from Red Jacket. Again, no matter how hard you work this type of treatment makes a customer NOT come back...EVER. I hope this email gets forwarded to Will and he sees what is happening to his company.

Respectfully,
GySgt New River
--------------------

Date: Thur, 11 Oct 2012

I received an automated email from UPS that my "package" should arrive on 16-OCT-2012. Let's see how it all turns out.

A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
Gunnery Sergeant
Weapons and Tactics Training Program Chief
United States Marine Corps
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#2 Late For Dinner

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 07:54 PM

This is all I kept hearing on their service. Even buying their bullpup stock, its sad it took half a year to begin production of said stock. Sorry to hear about that experience. Glad I never bought a gun from them.

I like big butts and will continue to lie about it.


#3 Captain Hero

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 08:09 PM

That blows Gunny. I hope you get your rifle back soon. No excuse for this.

Those who live by the sword, get shot by those who don't. 022.gif

 

 

 

 


#4 Gary

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 08:45 PM

Well. . . if your chronical of events is genuine (and I have absolutely no reason whatsoever to doubt that what you write or conveyed here within the forum is anything but genuine). . . I can't say that I am surprised.

Best of luck to you Gunny! Sorry to hear of this.

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing." ~Edmund Burke


"Life's too short to shoot an ugly gun!"

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#5 Matthew Hopkins

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Posted 10 October 2012 - 09:34 PM

to me it sounds like they are pi**ing down your back and telling you it's raining, which is no way to run any kind of business. hope they have it back to you soon.

Edited by Matthew Hopkins, 10 October 2012 - 09:43 PM.


#6 sunnybean

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 11:07 AM

Ahhh, the old is at the paint shop excuse. I remember that one well. Never again.

Gunny, not surprised at the welds breaking. I should show you the Galil charging handles they tried to weld on. Or, the 100 series folder trunnion that they WELDED into place. Or the selector stop that was on the left side. Or the rivets that are boogered. Or the barrels that are scratched from someone slamming the drill bit into the bottom of the barrel. Or the face of a bolt carrier that had to go back three times and ultimately cracked. Or the shoddy dust cover repair. Or the crooked HK sights that are welded on. Or the grind marks left in my receiver. Or the stock that is canted to one side. Or the...

Never again.
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'TonyRumore', on 16 Nov 2011 - 9:42 PM, said:
...and you have to be a complete dorkwad or mall ninja to run around hunting with a mag fed gun, pulling the fucking mag out every shot and dicking around loading a shell and jamming it back in the gun when you can just stuff one in the tube. Even with multiple mags, it's a serious pain in the ass and takes two hands. That's a major drawback when hunting since you need to keep one hand on the gun and the other on your beer............

Tony

#7 Gary

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 11:31 AM

Ahhh, the old is at the paint shop excuse. I remember that one well. Never again.

Gunny, not surprised at the welds breaking. I should show you the Galil charging handles they tried to weld on. Or, the 100 series folder trunnion that they WELDED into place. Or the selector stop that was on the left side. Or the rivets that are boogered. Or the barrels that are scratched from someone slamming the drill bit into the bottom of the barrel. Or the face of a bolt carrier that had to go back three times and ultimately cracked. Or the shoddy dust cover repair. Or the crooked HK sights that are welded on. Or the grind marks left in my receiver. Or the stock that is canted to one side. Or the...


Yea, but I'm sure it's all good enough for "Louisiana" work, don't ya know. Posted Image
(Yea I know. . . I'm a cold SOB.)
How many times have we witnessed via their Sons of Guns program, one of the gunsmiths grabbing a firearm and taking a battery-powered hand drill to it, versus taking the additional minute or two required to chalk the firearm up in a drill press to drill an accurate, straight hole? Just say'n. That sort of crap speaks boat-loads to me.
.
.

Edited by Gary, 11 October 2012 - 12:35 PM.

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing." ~Edmund Burke


"Life's too short to shoot an ugly gun!"

Posted Image


#8 GySgt New River

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 02:50 PM

---------------
Date: Thur, 11 Oct 2012

Dennis,

Being that RJF is two hours ahead of Arizona time I feel that I have given you ample time to respond to my status request from yesterday. HOWEVER, once again this work day has almost passed by without any answer from Red Jacket. Again, no matter how hard you work this type of treatment makes a customer NOT come back...EVER. I hope this email gets forwarded to Will and he sees what is happening to his company.

Respectfully,
GySgt New River
--------------------
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
Gunnery Sergeant
Weapons and Tactics Training Program Chief
United States Marine Corps
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#9 Jbanda1213

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 03:06 PM

The sad part is this is the least horrible story I have read about their costumer service.

#10 183cav

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 03:24 PM


Sad to see CS hasn't improved any since Feb. My build didn't cycle out of the box, even though I have the little card initialed where it was test fired. After a hastle for several weeks back and forth, I was told to send it back. Went back on my nickel. Also never again.

183cav

#11 GySgt New River

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 03:31 PM

---------------
Date: Thur, 11 Oct 2012

Dennis,

Being that RJF is two hours ahead of Arizona time I feel that I have given you ample time to respond to my status request from yesterday. HOWEVER, once again this work day has almost passed by without any answer from Red Jacket. Again, no matter how hard you work this type of treatment makes a customer NOT come back...EVER. I hope this email gets forwarded to Will and he sees what is happening to his company.

Respectfully,
GySgt New River
--------------------
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
Gunnery Sergeant
Weapons and Tactics Training Program Chief
United States Marine Corps
2000-Present

#12 weaponx

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 03:59 PM

wow, a mod writing shit like this ,well you are sure to be bound and beat real soon. o,yes gag too. hats off to you ! i can tell, your the man that anyone would follow into battle. a straight shooter .

most mod,s would never write stuff like this against a business on here.

#13 GySgt New River

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 04:13 PM

Date: Thur, 11 Oct 2012

I received an automated email from UPS that my "package" should arrive on 16-OCT-2012. Let's see how it all turns out.

I'm not a forum Moderator writing this...I'm one of their customers. Being a Moderator plays NO role in this situation as you can tell...I got no special treatment.

A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
Gunnery Sergeant
Weapons and Tactics Training Program Chief
United States Marine Corps
2000-Present

#14 sharkbit

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Posted 11 October 2012 - 05:21 PM

I had my own horror story that I posted here awhile back(and subsequently removed after the shitstorm I received over it). I had the same thing happen with my back plate, but instead of returning it (after already having gone thru the previous turmoils) I decided to remedy the problem myself by removing the cracked welded backplate and putting in a solid internal receiver block I bought from Carolina Shooters Supply. I haven't regretted it since.
Posted Image

#15 Captain Hero

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Posted 14 October 2012 - 12:46 AM

Pretty pathetic that they run shit this way.
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Those who live by the sword, get shot by those who don't. 022.gif

 

 

 

 


#16 weaponx

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:27 PM

Date: Thur, 11 Oct 2012

I received an automated email from UPS that my "package" should arrive on 16-OCT-2012. Let's see how it all turns out.

I'm not a forum Moderator writing this...I'm one of their customers. Being a Moderator plays NO role in this situation as you can tell...I got no special treatment.

well how did it turn out? as for the mod thing, well customer or not most mods on here would never write anything neg at all about a business that is on here, and if you are a average joe then you most likly get slamed.

i get that you are a customer and i hope you get closure with this issue

#17 GunFun

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:28 PM

If you note, he recently added a picture of the gun with positive comments to his gallery. It doesn't fully answer the question, but he does have the gun back.

#18 GySgt New River

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:34 PM

If you note, he recently added a picture of the gun with positive comments to his gallery. It doesn't fully answer the question, but he does have the gun back.


That is a VERY old picture and it was added to use as a comparison.
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
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#19 weaponx

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:38 PM

so any luck ? i bought a russian krinkov from them with trigger problems . there is no way in hell anyone shot it and did not notice it. i fixed it myself , no way was i senting it back . hell it probly would have got lost or resold. ha!

#20 GunFun

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:41 PM

Sorry to hear that. I would have a hard time being as tactful about the situation. It seems to me that anything that comes with a tax stamp automatically qualifies as a luxury item deserving of extra attention to detail. This ain't exactly a complaint about getting the cheapest WASR at the gun show and finding problems later.
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#21 weaponx

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:46 PM

it has the fake can pinned to make it 16 inches , if i had paid a tax stamp then it would be different.

#22 GySgt New River

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 07:06 PM

Yeah, I paid the stamp but this isn't a discussion thread. This thread is simply to show people how they conduct business.
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
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Weapons and Tactics Training Program Chief
United States Marine Corps
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#23 Matthew Hopkins

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 07:12 PM

It seems to me that anything that comes with a tax stamp automatically qualifies as a luxury item deserving of extra attention to detail.


"extra attention to detail"? a good gunsmith worth his salt wouldn't need to as you put it, "deserving of extra attention to detail". all his builds should be of high quality, regardless if it's a non-NFA item. you wouldn't want to pay someone to build a firearm for you and just because it's not a NFA that gives him a go-ahead to skimp on quality.
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#24 GySgt New River

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Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:47 PM

---------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tues, 16 Oct 2012
---------------------------------------------------------

OK members here is the final outcome to this entire saga.

SBR was delivered this evening in the box pictured below...Sadly, this is the EXACT SAME BOX I mailed the weapon to them in. What, do boxes cost that much in Louisiana??
Posted Image

I thought for a minute and said to myself, "They surely are not sooo cheap that they couldn't afford packing materials right?" Well, guess what? I got back my bubble wrap and styrofoam peanuts right. Guess they are cutting costs with reusing customer provided packing supplies. I wonder if RJF is too strapped for cash to professionally package and ship weapons. Hmmmm?
Posted Image

So, I dug through everything and pulled my weapon out to ensure everything got to Arizona well and no damage was done in shipping. UPS held its end of the bargain as you can see below.
Posted Image

I began to inspect my weapon for the completed warranty work I had requested and the quality of the work. On the ejection port side, the legal engraving for NFA weapons that was missing appears to be well done and the weld work looks as good as it did the first time. Lets see how long this one holds up.
Posted Image

On the flip side of the receiver the RJF shield was also engraved.
Posted Image

Now for some complaints... the refinishing is substandard...and NO, I WILL NOT BE SENDING IT BACK! In the above picture you should be able to notice that the finish on the entire receiver is blotchy and grainy, not smooth, to the touch. The finish on my Chiniese MAK-90 and TROMIX S-17 are better than what I got here and its supposed to be a freshly painted. I assume RJF had to completely disassemble the weapon to refinish it but when they reassembled it the hole where the trigger used to be is now exposed, nice touch. Attention to detail is key for a return customer. I'll just toss that out the window. Another finish blemish is that it looks like a hair, or something stringy, was sprayed over just below the ejection port, see the red circle for the hair.
Posted Image
Posted Image

Mr Will Hayden and RJF Staff,

After almost a full two months of waiting, twice as long as I was quoted, I finally got my weapon back this evening. As you can probably tell from this entire post from start to finish I am NOT a happy customer. I used to be a loyal, dedicated fan to your company, the show, and customer of Red Jacket however over the past two months the conduct of everyone involved has been lackluster. Your one saving grace is that you have Mr Dunford. He is a good employee, you would be wise NOT to get rid of him.

Thank you for fixing the following as per your invoice:
-Replace backplate and weld properly
-WEAPON NEEDS LEGAL ENGRAVING!
-Tighten muzzle device
-Check function of trigger and see if "slap" can be reduced

Its nice to know you let this SBR leave your establishment the first time WITHOUT the REQUIRED LEGAL ENGRAVING thus putting a weapon out of BATFE regulations in my hands. Thanks! I can assure you that I will NOT recommend anyone purchase anything from RJF, no hats, shirts, pistols, rifles, suppressors, NOTHING. Your company USED to be great and honorable however after hearing all the complaints and then getting the short end of the stick myself I can offer you nothing but this entire thread to read and consider.

Will, I hope your reading and take this to heart. Customers are what made you...we can break you just as easily.

Respectfully & Semper Fi,
GySgt New River
A veteran is someone who, at one point in his life, wrote a
blank check made payable to 'The United States of America' for an amount
of 'up to and including their life.'-That is Honor

ega_kbar.gif
Gunnery Sergeant
Weapons and Tactics Training Program Chief
United States Marine Corps
2000-Present

#25 Matthew Hopkins

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Posted 17 October 2012 - 08:08 PM

what a shit finish, I did a lot better job with a can of KRYLON. hopefully, they did the weld correctly this time-----but you won't find that out until you shoot it.

Edited by Matthew Hopkins, 17 October 2012 - 08:16 PM.

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#26 dcgregorya

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 03:36 PM

Heh. Wow. You must go nuts when you bring your car in for work ;). Anyway, I get the frustration but you must've been lucky in the past to have such high expectations. Everything I've ever sent out to get done by anyone has gotten messed up, delayed or otherwise screwed me over in some way or another. I've never used any of the fine vendors here or sent out my guns for work, I'm talking about in the business and non-firearm world.

Anyway, personally I would chalk it up to "stuff happens" and not sweat it too much - you'll give yourself an early stroke.

#27 AZG

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 05:43 PM

sounds like the same customer service I got from Rifle Dynamics. Its really frustrating getting fuct around. Glad you got your SBR back.

stop scheme'n & look'n hard

b7d5b530-bc2b-470e-a931-c451a097b518_zps


#28 red308

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 06:03 PM

After reading and seeing the outcome I can say I will never buy anything from RJF and I will recommend the same to all my friends and family.

#29 Matthew Hopkins

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 07:07 PM

Anyway, I get the frustration but you must've been lucky in the past to have such high expectations.


you call getting a decent paint job, and not one that looks like a special ed. student did, "high expectations"?

Everything I've ever sent out to get done by anyone has gotten messed up, delayed or otherwise screwed me over in some way or another. Anyway, personally I would chalk it up to "stuff happens" and not sweat it too much - you'll give yourself an early stroke.


then that is your fault for letting merchants/companies treating you that way. if you just let it go then letting it go the next time then the next, then you need to change your name to door mat. because that is how you will be treated every time you get screwed over. and it appears you are satisfied with being one from your statement, "personally I would chalk it up to "stuff happens" and not sweat it too much"

I will let you on a secret that people don't use and it is the most power thing you have over any merchant that will try to screw you over, or a shitty job - use a credit card for your purchases or service, then when things go south due to shoddy workmanship and they refuse to make it right, simply just tell them, "no problem, if you don't want to make it right, my credit card company will be more then happy to get their money back from you. and oh by the way, you will get hit with a high percentage charge back fee for being a total ass (which they already know they will get hit by a charge back fee, but it's a nice touch to remind them)".

you won't believe how fast they change their tune after that.

I never pay for anything with cash or MO when dealing with merchants, companies etc... . once they got your money you're basically hoping on their word and good will. remember the money they get isn't yours it's the CC companies money, and CC companies will be more then happy to get their money back, and then a bit more from a charge back fee on top of that from a shit company or merchant.

want to know how many times a company tried to screw me over? 6 times. now, you want to know how many succeeded? 0



Mathew - 6

rip off companies - 0

Edited by Matthew Hopkins, 19 October 2012 - 07:26 PM.

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#30 Saiga Power

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Posted 19 October 2012 - 07:42 PM

Sorry to hear your not happy with your firearm......Hope ya feel better after shooting it


Glad I got a pair of Tromix myself.....couldnt be happier




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