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Ok went to the range this morning, ran 150 Federal bulk through it no issues. Ran 40 rifled Centurion slug, no issues with those either. 35 of slugs, standing @ 100 yards produced 27 hits with irons.

Ran 275 rounds through it today. Mainly Federal Valuepack. It also ran Winchester Universal without a hitch. The only FTF was mag related. I didn't bring a regular S12 to compare it to but it defin

Boom, does not look that way to me...

Ok went to the range this morning, ran 150 Federal bulk through it no issues. Ran 40 rifled Centurion slug, no issues with those either. 35 of slugs, standing @ 100 yards produced 27 hits with irons.

 

11042012_Rifled_Slugs.jpg

 

As far as kick goes, it kicks less then my S12. My son had his Mossberg 890 and that kicks like a mull with the same ammo.

 

On the bolt impacting the trunnion, it does not. Pic of the bolt

 

VEPR12_Bolt_11042012.jpg

 

Pic of the trunnion

 

VEPR12_Trunnion_11042012.jpg

 

Have a total of 700 rounds through it now, could not be happier with it. Just wish I had the funds to buy a few more and really want some 12 rounders + a drum

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Ran 275 rounds through it today. Mainly Federal Valuepack. It also ran Winchester Universal without a hitch. The only FTF was mag related. I didn't bring a regular S12 to compare it to but it definitely has less muzzle climb than the Beretta Xtrema2 with the GK-1 attached. It did not run it without the brake.

 

I found that two of my Izzy mags have issues. One has too much play in it. I did not have to fit it to the gun. Rather, the factory took too much off the tab and it is loose. It falls out upon recoil. The other mag has something going on internally which is allowing the rim of the shell to pop out of its groove and jam up inside the mag.

 

As you can see, there is a bit more marring from the bolt carrier hitting the rear trunnion. At this point I am not concerned.

 

f583c0b5a200fb856ef42a2fd99b541a.jpg

9c2fa46ceb02f7064a8b2def301557a8.jpg

d995ef3eb76cd7f05f88d4be83e07ff9.jpg

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Mine worked perfectly at the range. I did just drop a buffer into it, I am going to see how that works out. I have a Carolina GK01 copy coming & plan on replacing the stock soon. Explains why the recoil beat me up. I will keep an eye on it. Hopefully it wont get much worse.

 

Funny how some strike & some don't with 3", & some have more recoil than their Saigas & some less?

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Thanks gentlemen. I think the real test would be to run a ton of high brass through one and see how it looks. Mine definitely started to mar right away but it seemed to taper off quickly. On the first five rounder the dust cover popped open. I think it was the bottom of the carrier striking the trunnion and lifting up a bit. Once it peened for a few rounds it never happened again. I mainly shoot low brass so I'm not worried about the trunnion strikes.

 

 

Captain,

 

Yeah, the ACR is new to me. I bought it with a 7.62x39 conversion kit. I wasn't real thrilled with the recoil until I put the PWS brake on it. Now it is a pussycat, just like the SCAR. I'm going to send the barrels off and have them turned down to shed some weight off the front end. It'll be perfect once the barrel is penciled.

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Wow, after reading this & seeing the above picture I checked my own Vepr. I was horrorified to see it worse than above- I actually have a circular indentation from the rear of the bolt slamming into the trunnion. I then checked my Saiga 12 that I've own for years & that had no markings.

 

I have only fired my Vepr once so far & only put 60 rounds thru it.

45 rds of Rio buck

10 rds of Rem Sluggers 2 3/4"

5 rds of Rem Magnum Express buck 3"

 

I have to take & post some pictures

 

That semi-circular cut in the rear trunnion is done at the factory and was not caused by your shooting. Mine was like that before I ran shell 1 through it. The cavity is there so you firing pin doesn't get peened by repeatedly smacking the rear trunnion when the bolt and bolt carrier do so.

 

Or so others have said/done before...

 

Eric

 

Boom, does not look that way to me...

Vepr12Trunnion.jpg

 

Interesting. I haven't run any 3" through mine (never shoot 3" anyway) and haven't seen the marring as bad as in your pic. The 2 3/4" slugs and Federal bulk pack I normally shoot don't seem overly abusive, but the hotter loads would obviously impart more energy on the bolt carrier group.

 

I guess a long-term observation of the effects (negative or nil) on the rear trunnion is going to tell the tale.

 

Thanks for the pics

 

Eric

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I wouldn't shoot 3" shells out of my Vepr. There is only 1 gas setting. If it runs birdshot, than 3" magnum loads are gonna beat it up more than magnum loads in a fine tuned Saiga-12. It doesn't bleed off excess gas. Although, it does appear to have a beefier rear trunnion. Maybe it can take the abuse better than a Saiga could, but it's just not worth it to me.

Edited by varickm
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Maybe Greg can come out with a stiffer spring for slugs and buckshot?

I'm not sure cause I dont have my vepr in hand yet but if it has the same recoil assembly as the S12...you can replace the spring with a stiffer 1911 recoil spring to help with wear on the trunnion. It worked wonders on an overgassed S12 I had...

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So what's the deal here about the rear trunion? Cycling buck shot or slugs is risky or abusive to the system?

 

And a rubber recoil insert isn't a good idea at all? Seems like a cheap way to prevent any kind of damage imo, just in case.

So far there is no deal. Everything that has been talked about is from each individual users accounts and each persons setup on their v12 is different and can have different port sizes or be using different ammo, climate...etc. You need to findout how "your" vepr works. You might have issues, you might not. I think the buffer will help, others don't. None of it is fact.
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Made it to the range and shot 100 rounds of 2 3/4" winchester and federal target loads, 30 rounds of 2 3/4" remington slugs, and 5 rounds of Winchester PDX.

 

Took me 50 rounds of on-and-off target load failures to eject before I realized the GK-01 brake was the issue. I took it off and the target loads cycled fine. However, the recoil reduction by the brake is noticeable -- when the brake is gone, the gun gets punchy. A better stock would probably help.

 

The slugs and PDX cycled just fine with brake, but slug groups weren't particularly accurate -- maybe 3" or so, and I kept hitting high. I don't have a lot of experience shooting slugs from an 18" barrel, though.

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Made it to the range and shot 100 rounds of 2 3/4" winchester and federal target loads, 30 rounds of 2 3/4" remington slugs, and 5 rounds of Winchester PDX.

 

Took me 50 rounds of on-and-off target load failures to eject before I realized the GK-01 brake was the issue. I took it off and the target loads cycled fine. However, the recoil reduction by the brake is noticeable -- when the brake is gone, the gun gets punchy. A better stock would probably help.

 

The slugs and PDX cycled just fine with brake, but slug groups weren't particularly accurate -- maybe 3" or so, and I kept hitting high. I don't have a lot of experience shooting slugs from an 18" barrel, though.

 

You said GK-01 brake. Is that the Russian one or the CSS copy? I shot mine today with the CSS brake, no issues with WIN Universal

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You said GK-01 brake. Is that the Russian one or the CSS copy? I shot mine today with the CSS brake, no issues with WIN Universal

 

CSS brake. When I removed it, no more FTE the target stuff.

 

That's interesting! ... any reason how & why the CSS brake affects cycling?

Edited by iteachsurfing
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I think it has more to do with the stock it shipped with. I put a Saiga sporter stock on mine (until someone gets off their ass and makes a LEFT SIDE FOLDER), any way the stock it came with sucks in my opinion. It makes it hard to get a good shoulder weld.

 

Like I said above, I had No issues at all with the cheap stuff and the CSS break on. I would like to hear if anyone else is having success or failure though.

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Recoil is helping it cycle. Take away the recoil on very light loads, and there isn't enough for it to cycle properly. Would be my guess.

 

That's what it seems to be, I'm open to ideas, though. I like the CSS brake, and it definitely does its recoil reducing job.

 

I think it has more to do with the stock it shipped with. I put a Saiga sporter stock on mine (until someone gets off their ass and makes a LEFT SIDE FOLDER), any way the stock it came with sucks in my opinion. It makes it hard to get a good shoulder weld.

 

I switched out the stock for an RPK wood stock -- it's got about the same length as the factory placeholder. I get a decent enough shoulder weld...I think the low top of the RPK stock is producing the high slug shots. Need to come up with a cheek pad or new stock and see.

Edited by Koljec
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I think you are inherently going to see less varience with the Molot shotguns than the Izhmash shotguns, simply due to the barrel. The majority of the issues we have seen in the past with the Saiga 12 is due to the variences in the thickness of the barrel, one gas port one size is going to function differently in a barrel with a different wall thickness. From what I understand, Molot has a better system for barrel manufacturing, and we should see much more consistancy.

 

I do not have a CSS brake, but i can say that loose hip firing had no effect today on the cycling of low brass value pack birdshot.

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